Nintendo NX

[Drowsy Emperor]

I don't know if Nintendoes knows what it wants, other than our money. The trouble is, they can apparently live off the fat **** of Pokemon, Mario and Zelda forever so they're not really stimulated to one up the competition.

 

I mean the WiiU still costs around 300 euros even though it has maybe ten games worth playing (all of them first party, almost all of them sequels), while you can get the "stronger even though it released earlier" PS4 for the same money - and the Pro is going to be a relatively modest 100 euros more. And the PS4 is still building its large catalog. They want the thing to sell, but they don't want to make it a value proposition.

 

On the other hand, the new 3DS, with its prehistoric hardware costs 170 euro - while my 200 euro Chinese smartphone gives comparable gaming performance and a vibrant full HD screen. And a better battery. What gives?

 

The NX is really going to have to provide value to make early adoption worth it. If its really a 720p handheld with sub PS4 hardware (itself already dated) power as some rumors suggest I really don't know what to think anymore. Especially if they ask 200+ euros for it, as they're likely to.

Edited September 15, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Ganrich]

I've wondered if the "NX" designation was a cute joke from Nintendo. Where many would see it as N = Nintendo and X = the Roman numeral for 10... Some may see it as a short hand for nix. Many refer to unix/linux systems as *nix. It's made me cross my fingers that Nintendo is going to make a more open console using Linux and get it's third party support via Valve's steam machines. It's not likely, but interesting.

 

I keep thinking of an Alienware article I read where they claimed that some big things were coming to the Linux initiative. Which is why they have a second iteration of their steam machine.

 

I expect Nintendo would have their own store, a disc drive, but still support steam on the console. It would be a game changer, if true. I doubt it is, and is likely just me hoping for Valve's Linux initiative to pick up "steam."

[Keyrock]

I've wondered if the "NX" designation was a cute joke from Nintendo. Where many would see it as N = Nintendo and X = the Roman numeral for 10... Some may see it as a short hand for nix. Many refer to unix/linux systems as *nix. It's made me cross my fingers that Nintendo is going to make a more open console using Linux and get it's third party support via Valve's steam machines. It's not likely, but interesting.

 

Nintendo > Open.  Are you daft?  As much as I'd love for your pipe dream to come true, I'd also love to annex my own tropical island and rule it as a "benevolent" dictator (El Presidente Keyrock has a nice ring to it), but that ain't happening either.

[Ganrich]

 

 

I've wondered if the "NX" designation was a cute joke from Nintendo. Where many would see it as N = Nintendo and X = the Roman numeral for 10... Some may see it as a short hand for nix. Many refer to unix/linux systems as *nix. It's made me cross my fingers that Nintendo is going to make a more open console using Linux and get it's third party support via Valve's steam machines. It's not likely, but interesting.

 

Nintendo > Open. Are you daft? As much as I'd love for your pipe dream to come true, I'd also love to annex my own tropical island and rule it as a "benevolent" dictator (El Presidente Keyrock has a nice ring to it), but that ain't happening either.

I would have said the same thing prior to their foyer into smart phones. This shows some changes in their thinking. Nintendo has had one major problem since the SNES, and that's their party support. Building a system that leverages Valve's Linux titles would fix a good bit of that.

 

Like I said, I doubt it's the case, but man would it be a danger to the MS/Sony systems if it were.

[Drowsy Emperor]

Nintendo knows that the only thing keeping it alive is the stranglehold it has on its more popular IP. The fact that the games are behind a fully controllable paywall (hardware and fixed prices) is their only advantage compared to Sony and Microsoft (when Zelda SS went to the bomba bin they pressured japanese stores into putting it back to the shelf, even though it wasn't selling).

 

The iphone outing may seem to be at odds with this statement, but its basically a marketing campaign to stimulate sales of Nintendo hardware. They will never release their full games on other platforms unless the company is at death's door.

 

Of course, anyone with a brain will just give them the middle finger and play everything on the PC - Dolphin, DSEmu and other emulators are better at Nintendo games than their own hardware.

Edited September 15, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Ganrich]

Nintendo knows that the only thing keeping it alive is the stranglehold it has on its more popular IP. The fact that the games are behind a fully controllable paywall (hardware and fixed prices) is their only advantage compared to Sony and Microsoft (when Zelda SS went to the bomba bin they pressured japanese stores into putting it back to the shelf, even though it wasn't selling).

 

The iphone outing may seem to be at odds with this statement, but its basically a marketing campaign to stimulate sales of Nintendo hardware. They will never release their full games on other platforms unless the company is at death's door.

 

Of course, anyone with a brain will just give them the middle finger and play everything on the PC - Dolphin, DSEmu and other emulators are better at Nintendo games than their own hardware.

They could/would still retain control.

 

Let's say they make hardware based on X86 architecture just like Xbone and PS4, then build an OS using Linux like the PS3, and then built an online store like EA's origin, and they can tell devs if your porting to Linux then all we require is controller support (which many AAA games have anyway). Nintendo could not allow downloads of their store and obfuscate the code, and require the user to buy their hardware to get access to their titles. All the while they would be leveraging Valve's work with getting games ported to Linux to get themselves more third party support. Their titles would still remain on their hardware, but other Linux titles would be easier to port to theirs. This would shore up Nintendo's third party support and shore up Valve's potential for Linux ports by increasing numbers of Linux users.

 

It's not like building an OS on the Linux Kernal immediately makes all your software transparent... Nintendo could still have their locked down box while reaping benefits of already ported third party games.

[Drowsy Emperor]

NX release date has been indirectly confirmed to be the March 4 2017, due to some Zelda merchandise shipping date leak.

 

Its going to be a curiously short marketing campaign for Nintendo, already clocking in at under 6 months.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Katphood]

This is why I am not having any hopes for the NX. The console front as a whole has gone completely sideways:

 

 

[Drowsy Emperor]

They're salvaging WiiU first party software by re-releasing it on the 3DS via quick and dirty porting.

 

They think its cheap for them so some more moneys aren't bad. 

 

Its basically a death sentence for both systems, although the 3DS will be around for a while yet.

Edited September 22, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Drowsy Emperor]

Latest rumor allegedly from chinese Foxconn factory:

 

"NX is a console-handheld hybrid. It is detachable. It contains the console itself, performance module, and the handheld/gamepad.

 

The console (I think it is supposed to be a dock. I'll call it a dock from now on) contains HDD, cartridge slot and various other interfaces. It supports TV output (but no CPU/GPU).

 

The performance module is a portable device that provides power supply. It contains a Li-Ion battery. CPU/GPU also is contained inside. It supports Bluetooth, Wi-Fi and wired connections. You plug the dock inside and it becomes a PS4/Xbone like console, but you can also transfer the signals to the handheld (like Remote Play?) There are two candidate SoC for it: Pascal SoC from nVidia or AMD R9 SoC.

 

The handheld part is a 6 inch 720p screen and has a low-TDP SoC, which can satisfy basic operations with lower quality graphics when the performance module is not connected. But it can also display game graphics from the performance module which can provide a console-level graphics. A bit like nVidia Shield streaming. You can bring the performance module with you portable (since it has its own battery).

 

Additional info: whatever the solution will be, the computing power it has falls far behind a PS4, let alone a PS4 Pro. Don't have high hopes for that. The selling point for it is high portability and hybrid providing rich gameplay possibilities.

Edited September 23, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Keyrock]

That sounds... terrible.

 

Edited September 23, 2016 by Keyrock

[Drowsy Emperor]

Its basically a souped up handheld. If the CPU/GPU can run off battery power in a small portable housing then its not a home console in regards to the power level. Unless Nintendo discovered quantum computers.

 

Unfortunately it makes business sense. The console market is contracting. Sony has given up on the possibility of a successor to the PS Vita - they have retreated into the domain where they are strong and still making money, the home console. If the rumor is true, Nintendo is doing the same, except its strength is the handheld device. Their home consoles have been a string of relative failures ever since the SNES with the exception of the Wii. But their handhelds are still doing alright, so focusing on a handheld device that offers some features of a home console makes sense. 

[Keyrock]

But if you want good quality graphics on the handheld you need to carry another brick with you in addition to the handheld itself.  

[Drowsy Emperor]

But if you want good quality graphics on the handheld you need to carry another brick with you in addition to the handheld itself.  

 

Yep. Probably because it was impossible to achieve something that resembles acceptable home console graphics in a device that would be an entirely handheld unit. Especially if you expect that device to project to a larger screen as well. If its true, they wanted both something that looks good on handheld and is at least on WiiU level (kek) at home. i mean, they could hardly go  below right?

 

The price is the brick.

[Drowsy Emperor]

Aaaaand some Chinese dudes are saying its fake.

 

*shrugs*

[Keyrock]

There are several problems with a hybrid handheld/home console design.  It is extremely difficult to fit hardware powerful enough to even come close to current gen home consoles into a handheld, and even if you could fit hardware that powerful into a unit that small it would be prohibitively expensive.  So then you have the multi processor concept where the handheld unit has its own set of processors that can achieve decent visuals on a little screen and another set of processors in the dock that can be added to the overall processing power to create home console level visuals on a bigger screen.  While having multiple CPUs and multiple GPUs working in tandem is far from impossible, it's much easier to achieve when the sets of CPUs and the sets of GPUs are identical, which they obviously wouldn't be in this case.  Having different types or power levels of CPUs and GPUs working together is feasible, but it does add an extra level of complexity to everyone involved in the process, including game developers.  Then the developer has to design 2 sets of configurations, one for the handheld on its own and one for the full power dock + handheld combo.  Again, doable, but that's extra work and complexity.  What I'm trying to say is, remember all the problems the Wii U had with 3rd party support?  This wouldn't help matters.

[Katphood]

Thought I should share this:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NT_6vXmwCw

Edited September 24, 2016 by Katphood

[Labadal]

There are both pros and cons with a hybrid. I would be interested in trying one out. Last Nintendo home console I played was the N64. It would obviously not be as powerful as competing consoles, but it's not like Nintendo isn't lagging behind in that department.

[Drowsy Emperor]

I'm still of the opinion that the only way they can release a "hybrid" at typical Nintendo prices (around the 300$ mark) is if the handheld contains everything and the dock is just an HDMI port/internal storage.

 

In other words I believe its just going to be a handheld that can project to an external screen, which at current hardware limitations is going to be far below any console in power - limiting what you can actually play at home down to Nintendo first party, indie games and other titles specifically developed for the device. 

 

So, a hybrid in name only.

[Ganrich]

I'm still of the opinion that the only way they can release a "hybrid" at typical Nintendo prices (around the 300$ mark) is if the handheld contains everything and the dock is just an HDMI port/internal storage.

 

In other words I believe its just going to be a handheld that can project to an external screen, which at current hardware limitations is going to be far below any console in power - limiting what you can actually play at home down to Nintendo first party, indie games and other titles specifically developed for the device. 

 

So, a hybrid in name only.

So, a Sega Nomad with a Nintendo badge?

[Labadal]

I'm still of the opinion that the only way they can release a "hybrid" at typical Nintendo prices (around the 300$ mark) is if the handheld contains everything and the dock is just an HDMI port/internal storage.

 

In other words I believe its just going to be a handheld that can project to an external screen, which at current hardware limitations is going to be far below any console in power - limiting what you can actually play at home down to Nintendo first party, indie games and other titles specifically developed for the device.

 

So, a hybrid in name only.

I guess you're right. I'm not super hyped or anything. I just hope whatever it is, that is is good enough for me to buy.

[Humanoid]

Maybe the dock is just a gigantic heatsink and the CPU will overclock itself when placed on it.

[Drowsy Emperor]

 

I'm still of the opinion that the only way they can release a "hybrid" at typical Nintendo prices (around the 300$ mark) is if the handheld contains everything and the dock is just an HDMI port/internal storage.

 

In other words I believe its just going to be a handheld that can project to an external screen, which at current hardware limitations is going to be far below any console in power - limiting what you can actually play at home down to Nintendo first party, indie games and other titles specifically developed for the device. 

 

So, a hybrid in name only.

So, a Sega Nomad with a Nintendo badge?

 

 

 

 

I'm still of the opinion that the only way they can release a "hybrid" at typical Nintendo prices (around the 300$ mark) is if the handheld contains everything and the dock is just an HDMI port/internal storage.

 

In other words I believe its just going to be a handheld that can project to an external screen, which at current hardware limitations is going to be far below any console in power - limiting what you can actually play at home down to Nintendo first party, indie games and other titles specifically developed for the device.

 

So, a hybrid in name only.

I guess you're right. I'm not super hyped or anything. I just hope whatever it is, that is is good enough for me to buy.

 

 

I don't know. Its all just speculation. But Nintendo is a company that has relatively low prices that target the wallets of parents so I just don't see them doing something spectacular hardware wise.

 

And I don't see them repeating another straight up home console because after the WiiU, I think they have no place in that market anymore. The Wii honeypot days are over and those customers aren't coming back.

The market has shrunk for Sony - even the "winner" of this console generation, the PS4 has sold around 60 million units which looks paltry compared to the PSX 100 or the PS2's 150. Nintendo, always being on the bottom of that race apart from the Wii fluke, can only suffer even more - as they did with the WiiU.

 

So I see them merging their handheld and console development for a hybrid device... but I don't see that device shipping as a "PS4 with a Vita" for 300$, if you get my meaning.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor

[Labadal]

Yeah, that I understand.

[Drowsy Emperor]

Although this only applies to the US, it is possibly the most important market or at least one of the most important ones.

 

Nintendo hardware sales in the Americas are worse than you'd expect
3DS shifts less than half of Game Boy, GBC.
By Jeffrey Matulef Published 26/09/2016

 

Video game analyst at Niko Partners Daniel Ahmad has shone a light on some pretty damning statistics about how Nintendo's current slate of hardware is selling in the Americas.

The 3DS isn't as formidable as one might think in a mobile-first world.
Looking at its home console market, the figures, which Nintendo has made publicly available, go as follows:

34.00m - NES
23.35m - SNES
20.63m - N64
12.93m - GCN
48.64m - Wii
6.29m - Wii U

The Wii U is known for not selling well, possibly due to its confusing name, but what's more surprising is the handheld figures, which are as follows:

44.06m -GB/C
41.64m -GBA/SP
59.93m -NDS Family
20.11m -3DS Family
Given the Nintendo DS' success and the healthy slate of titles on the 3DS, combined with its budget-priced spin-off the 2DS, one might think its sales would be significantly higher after more than five years on the market.

"It started off well. But sales dropped considerably in the last few years," Ahmad said of the 3DS on Twitter. "The demand for dedicated portables isn't there."

"Portable dedicated consoles have been replaced by mobile gaming at a core and casual level."

Indeed Pokémon Go saw a big influx of 3DS sales in the US, where the half-decade-old hardware topped the charts in July, but it still can't hold a candle to Nintendo's handhelds of yesteryear when the portable market wasn't so cutthroat.

Perhaps the alleged console/handheld hybrid Nintendo NX will fare better?

 

The numbers look worse when you take into account market expansion. Some stats say that 155 out of 320 million Americans play videogames (of all kinds) regularly. So a great success is when you get a device into the hands of a third of that number, as the Wii did. But, fundamentally, Nintendo hasn't been able to achieve an even more moderate goal with their home consoles for a long time.

 

The handheld division was doing spectacularly well up until the rise of smartphones and tablets but the subsequent plunge has been pretty catastrophic. 

 

That said, the company itself is still massive- at the height of the Pokemon Go frenzy surpassing Sony in market value.  So while these are costly mistakes (or middling successes at best) they can take a lot more punches than one would think.

Edited September 28, 2016 by Drowsy Emperor