The annoying noob strikes back!

[Boeroer]

@Slacker: yes, Wood Elf's racial ability works with the Long Pain.

 

If you liked the monk in the early game you should play one.

[Slack83er]

Are you referring to a paladin or a monk? Because I don't see how taking no damage should hurt a paladin (also I don't see how you are taking no damage, it's more about taking and them regenerating, which makes the race such a strong choice for a monk)

I was referring to the paladin, and I play easy. That's the reason for not taking damage. But with the other MCs I use to be punished quite a lot. I've also tried Monk, but prefer paladin. I have two questions though... does flames of devotion work ranged? Because on the wiki it says melee only... and then again... I was curious about a hybrid paladin build... just wanted to know if it's viable...

[Loren Tyr]

Just thinking... shouldn't it be "The annoying noob strikes again", rather than "strikes back"? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Abel]

 

Are you referring to a paladin or a monk? Because I don't see how taking no damage should hurt a paladin (also I don't see how you are taking no damage, it's more about taking and them regenerating, which makes the race such a strong choice for a monk)

I was referring to the paladin, and I play easy. That's the reason for not taking damage. But with the other MCs I use to be punished quite a lot. I've also tried Monk, but prefer paladin. I have two questions though... does flames of devotion work ranged? Because on the wiki it says melee only... and then again... I was curious about a hybrid paladin build... just wanted to know if it's viable...

 

 

Not a specialist about paladins either, but i'm pretty sure that i could use flames of devotion with an arquebus with Pallegina...

 

Paladins are cool. But there is just one thing i don't like about them as a MC. And this is that there are some abilities they have that can profit only to allies, not themselves. I know for sure it's the case of reinforcing exhortation and Inspiring Triumph (guess it's the name) since i tried them both with Pallegina. But well, one good thing about them is that they can wear Ryona's breastplate while priests or fighters can't, according to the wiki. (Monks can wear it too btw).

 

Don't really know about viability of such a hybrid paladin. I guess it's possible, as with any other classes.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Abel

[Loren Tyr]

I was referring to the paladin, and I play easy. That's the reason for not taking damage. But with the other MCs I use to be punished quite a lot. I've also tried Monk, but prefer paladin. I have two questions though... does flames of devotion work ranged? Because on the wiki it says melee only... and then again... I was curious about a hybrid paladin build... just wanted to know if it's viable...

 

It works on ranged as well, yes. Gun-paladin is a viable build, certainly. Though you could also go for a mixture, get a third weapon slot and go Arquebus + FoD as an opening volley at the beginning of combat; switch to second Arquebus and fire with FoD; then switch to melee weapon and starting hitting stuff. Arquebus has the highest base damage of all weapons, so it gets you the most out of FoD in that sense. 

 

Arquebus is also in the same Weapon Focus group as Greatsword, you could go for those. There is a nice pair of Gloves you can get in act 2 that gives you the Firebrand sword three times per rest, which packs a nice punch. Does fire damage, so you could get Scion of Flame to boost both your FoD and Firebrand damage (and put Fire Lashes on all your weapons, and boost those too). 

[Slack83er]

Just thinking... shouldn't it be "The annoying noob strikes again", rather than "strikes back"? 

 

Gee, you're right! sometimes you can clearly see I'm not native english... 

 

Just saw that armor...wow...it really IS strong! Monks, Paladins or Chanters can use it..

I'm just trying to find something not so stereotypical as the sword and board paladin... or the classic punch punch monk..

I dunno... can't find something so far that really tickles me... The builds on the site are all dramatically min-maxed... which is something I really don't appreciate... so I can't even refer to some particular build.... guess I'll wait then... something will come out of all those advices you're giving me... thanks a lot!

Edited August 10, 2016 by Slack83er

[Boeroer]

For paladin I recommend island aumaua with two guns (preferably arquebuses - you can get the first one from Kana - before that you can use arbalests) for 2 FoD shots at the start of the fight without reloading. I also take Quick Switch, others don't. Third weapon set is a melee weapon with Outworn Buckler. Skill for tanky melee. Sworn Enemy and FoD is enough damage and ACC for your shots. You don't need any talents for the guns.

Keep in mind that you will get Sacred Immolation at lvl 13. So don't gimp tour MIG, INT and PER. DEX can be a dump stat. CON doesn't need to be stellar either. At some point take Scion of Flame: it works with FoD and Sacred Immolation.

[rheingold]

Just thinking... shouldn't it be "The annoying noob strikes again", rather than "strikes back"? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ummm... somehow "the empire strikes again" doesn't have the same ring...

Edited August 10, 2016 by rheingold

[rheingold]

Just bear in mind that easy is actually not that easy - unless you mean story time. The middle difficulties are very close to one another. In fact the only difference between easy and hard is the amount and type of creatures you encounter. Their stats are still the same. So, yeah its easier overall, but there can still be some tough fights on easy, mainly the dragon fights - they won't have any adds with them which helps a lot, but the dragons are still painful. At one point when I was really battling against the adra dragon I dropped down to easy.... Darn dragon still kept one shotting my party. Turns out the adds were not the problem

Edited August 10, 2016 by rheingold

[Ben No.3]

Now, I came up with a simple concept for the hybrid paladin, so I'll post it anyway... It's not a full build, rather a first-levels recommendation and a simple draft... I never tested it. Should work anyway. It is also a good first build since it works rather simple and requires little micro.

 

The cheetah (we will cheat around DR, also we play an yellow Orlan to fit the name )

 

Heart Orlan

 

M 14 (15 base -1 Orlan)

C 8

D 8

P 19 (17 base +2 Orlan)

I 14

R 14 (13 base +1 Orlan)

With your culture you can add one more point anywhere... Perhaps mig or perception

 

Whatever Order you like, Kind Wayfarer might fit since the used weapons are rather cheap and low-quality (lore-wise, use obviously the best you can get) and the wayfarers ate described as a loose order lacking in structure and money.

 

No min-maxing since this is your first char. Heart Orlan to get more crits. This is an accuracy build.

We will use a blunderbuss and dual stilletos (for guns and duals speed penalties are rather minor, so this enables you to wear any armour you want. Hand and key is yellow though, so let's take that . It also has kind-wayfarer lore and a nice bonus... You can find it rather early). The thing about stilletos and blunderbuss are: They both can benefit greatly from DR-Bypass because their base damage is low, so they loose very little. Beware: You are more of a DD than a tank. Some Res over more Int so you have some more front-line capabilities. If you behave accordingly to your order you will also get defense-bonuses. This all makes you a sturdy DD. However, I won't stop you from putting Res into Int, you will simply loose some defensive capabilities. Also, mental stats are all upped in this build.

 

So, let's see:

Lvl 1: Lay on hands/Flame of devotion It really does not matter... Our goal is to go for DR bypass, so more damage is only helpful for low-DR enemies at this early stage anyway. It's still a lot of fun. The Heal is very powerful though, I would recommend it.

Lvl 2: WF: Ruffian As I said, Stilletos and blunderbuss

Lvl 3: Zealous Focus: We are a DD, so more accuracy gives us the most. As mentioned before, duals and guns don't care about speed as much. More DR doesn't help a DD an awful lot

Lvl 4: Penetrating Shot, or Vurnable attack: we can soon get a blunderbuss (if you focus on the story), so let's prepare for that. See, the blunderbuss shoots six (?) low damage bullets, so the DR bypass gives us a lot since it applies to every single bullet. If you don't plan to focus on the story as much, take vulnerable attack: more DR bypass for our trusty stilletos is always good. The fact that they trade speed for DR bypass is also really nice for us.

Lvl 5: sworn enemy: The "better flames of devotion", it also adds to accuracy which we always love.

Lvl 6: Vournable Attck, or penetrating shot: whichever you didn't choose before

 

So that is a nice starter pack. After that you should have some experience with the game, so you can choose talents which you consider best for your playstyle. Keep always some sabres in case you encounter pierce immunit, perhaps also a sabre and a shield if you need to tank for a certain fight (although that isn't our main concern). Also an early game miniboss drops a really nice yellow stilleto .

So yeah... That's it

 

Edit: now that I think about it, definitely choose penetrating shot after Vurnable attack. Orlan is also more of an recommendation, any race will do...

Edited August 10, 2016 by Ben No.3

[Slack83er]

What a nice build! If I can I will test it today! I'm not really into Orlans, maybe you can suggest another fitting race? Something like elf maybe? Or godlike... Dunno... Or human...

 

Somewhere on the board I also saw a nice dwarven paladin, developed around social abilities and buffing the group... Can't remember where I saw it... But as you stated before, the build you gave me is very effective mentally-wise... I like it!

Which exact role must this build fit in the party? Since you told me it's not a tank... How should I play it? I focus on the story and role play a lot... By the way... What makes stilettos and blunderbuss so fitting in turn build? Do they carry some useful stat? Sorry I just don't know all of the little secrets of this game.. I was thinking that without a shield I might get squishy...

[Ben No.3]

1. In the party he will be the reliable damage dealer, he won't do as much damage as some other classes but he will be sturdy. Also if the enemy breaks the tank-line he is a "last row of defense" and can defend the spellcasters/dedicated DPS classes for some time. This isn't a usual build, I tried to fit him to your demands. What you got is a jack of all trades with a focus on Damage Dealing who is easy to play.

2. Open with the blunderbuss and let your tank(s) engage. Switch to stilletos at will and flank the enemy. Or kill anything that gets through the first line, as mentioned before. You can also engage together with the tanks, this is however risky since the enemy's will focus on you rather than the tanks. Roleplay wise... Since the weapon focus is ruffian, a pirate comes to my mind. Perhaps a goldpact paladin joined some pirates for some treasur hunt? Or go the other way, a former robber/murderer who decided to start over (in Dyrwood that is) and protect people as a kind wayfarer There is a threat about backstories, some good ones there (inspiration)

3. the thing about these weapons is: they have a low base damage, and that synergies quite nicely with the dr-bypass.

See, the stilleto has a base damage of around 12 (as I recall...). It also has an DR Bypass of 3 (every type of weapon has a certain strength). That means 3 damage will be applied even if the armour of the enemy should absorb it. When dual-wielding, this is obviously quite a powerhouse. Take in the Vurnable attack, that's another 5 DR bypass on every hit, giving us 8 damage on every hit regardless of the enemy's armour. With the high speed of stilletos this is quite a damage output.

Blunderbusses work somewhat similar, firing six individual bullets that each do around 10 (again not sure, but around) damage. In theory, this can give you a lot of Damage. However, high DR is obviously the Blunderbusses biggest enemy, since it will lower each bullet's damage extremely. The penetrating shot gives us 5 DR bypass when ranged, so that solves the problem (partially). This means that each bullet can do 5 Damage reliably on a hit of a single bullet... Remember there are six of them.

Although the actual game also calculates miss/graze/hit/crit, altering each hit's damage output. But that's what our high accuracy is for.

 

A word about attack speed: the penalty only affects the recovery time, not the attack/reload animation. For all ranged weapons which need to be loaded this means: attack time is set...recovery is affected...reload time is set . Thus the speed penalty applies only minimal actual speed decrease. For dual wielding, the high speed bonus compensates for the penalty: dual wielding decreases the recovery time after each strike. Since the penalty is calculated using percent, the penalty is again lower than it sounds.

 

Have fun

 

Edit: don't worry about squishyness... The paladin is a sturdy class, and your order can give you defense bonuses (or penalties).

Edited August 10, 2016 by Ben No.3

[Ben No.3]

Also, wear heavy armour if you feel you lack protection... Speed penalties are ok.

For a race... Pale elf (wood elf might be a bit to much ranged) if you want to go elf. For a godlike perhaps death? Really cool ability for a DD. Or fire, but melee dependence (since you go hyprid better not take a pure melee/ranged class) or moon for more defense (if you fear you might lack it). A dwarf can be nice... The accuracy bonus is huge when applied. Human always works.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Ben No.3

[Boeroer]

Kind Wayfarers are nice in combination with kill stealing: they have two powerful healing abilities, one gets triggered when you kill an enemy. You need to do some damage for that so it's good not to skill your paladin 100% defensively. Search for "damaging healbot" in the forum here. I think that build never made it to the index, but it's great. The inventor used Moon Godlike + Kind Wayfarer + Sword & Shepherd + Strange Mercy to build a paladin who heals like crazy. This would work well with dual wielding like described above. You can also add Envenomed Strike. It#s good with high MIG and INT and it will most certainly kill an enemy - triggering healing. Not very kind, I know - but a strange mercy perhaps.

 

What also works and is fun is an offensive paladin build around fire. Use a Fire Godlike - it's racial ability scales with level. It might seem to be weak at first, but later on it can really do a lot of damage. Choose high CON, MIG and INT (and not too bad PER). Choose either Darcozzi Paladini with Fires of Darcozzi Palace or Goldpact Knights with Enduring Flames. Take whatever two handed weapon (focus) you like - for example great sword or pollaxe or estoc or morning star - even pike or quarterstaff or durance's staff works well (it's a very good weapon early in the game because it has two damage types, crush and burn. At that stage there are a lot of enemies with low burn DR).*    

Then buy Forgemaster's Gloves from Dunstan in Crucible Keep. Those can summon the great sword Firebrand 3 times per rest. Usually the duration is long enough for a whole fight with a party on easy or normal. That great sword is made out of flames and does pure burn damage and works with ANY weapon focus.

So, you have that flaming great sword (and it's really BIG) that you can use with your burning FoD, you have a flaming head, you will either cause a burn DoT effect with FoD (Goldpact) or get Flame Shield (Darcozzi). I like Darcozzi better because they are passionate and that's more fitting. Also the other order related talent "Inspiring Exhortaion" is way better in my opinion (stacks with everything). Ant later on you will have Sacred Immolation. All this is burn damage. And it adds up pretty nicely.

So now you should take Scion of Flame - it will improve all that burning damage by 20% - also the burniung lash you will put onto your main weapon. Only the Goldpact DoT will not be affected - DoTs don't work with Scion of Flame. Firebrand's base damage - which is already very high - will improve by +20%, this will increase the damage on which the 75% of FoD is based, which will also be boosted by 20%. If you drop below 50% endurance, you will retaliate with fire and gain +4 DR (stacks with Zealous Endurance), that retaliation is also boosted by +20%. Your FoD will give you a Flame Shield that also retaliates which also gets boosted by 20%. Your Sacred Immolation will get boosted by 20%. 

Put on plate first - later put on the Sun Touched Mail (you get it after you defeated some thiefs who stole a scroll of Wael it's on of the first quests in Defiance Bay). It has 3 uses of Sunbeam per rest. It's a great spell that does burn damage and blinds. Then later you can find the Amulet of Summer Solstice. This also has 3 uses of Sunbeam per rest. Guess what? That spell also gets boosted by Scion of Flame.

Never was Scion of Flame more useful than here.

Firebrand is annihilating by the way - meaning it has double crit damage bonus. With FoD and Sworn Enemy you will have +40 ACC - this should result in crits. Your FoD will do a looot of damage. Also use all the +dmg mods you can get like Savage Attack and Two Handed Style. Don't use Vulnerable Attack, it's not worth it with such high base damage.

Also put on Shod-in-Faith boots if you have nobody else who can make good use of them. 

It's a nice combo of sturdyness (very high DR and CON and the natural high defenses and healings of a paladin) plus a good amount of damage (2 x burning retaliation, 2x FoD, a flaming sword with good damage).

 

Some of my abilites/talents would be (just what comes to mind):

- FoD

- Lay on Hands

- Zealous Endurance

- Intense Flames

- Sworn Enemy

- Scion of Flame

- Savage Attack

- Two Weapon Style

- Outlander's Frenzy maybe - gives you more MIG and CON and also attack speed but lowers defelction and obscures health/endurance stats.

- Veteran's Recovery - only  if you feel he's going down a lot despite the +4 DR and Battle Forged retaliation

- Weapon Focus what you like

- Inspiring Liberation (if you also want to be a supporter - then you might also want to take Coordinated Attacks if you have points left)

- Fires of Darcozzi Palace

- Sacred Immolation

- Behold the Martyr (be useful even if you go down)

- some defensive talents like Bear's Fortitude and such

- dunno - maybe something else I forgot about.

 

)*  I think I would take estoc for Blade of the Endless paths or peasant for Durance's Staff and later also Taluntain's Staff (has 3 Fireball uses per rest) for the second weapon slot. Tidefall is also great, but tide and flames - I don't know if that fits thematically. When you choose to siphon knowledge from Maerwald you can also get the sabre "the Flames of Fair Rhian" in lvl 13 of the Endless Paths. It has has 3 Fireballs per rest, too. You can wear this with the Outworn Buckler or even duplicate it with the Helwax Mold (Stronhold quest item) and dual wield. Then you would have 6 Fireballs per rest, even 9 per rest with Taluntain's Staff. But you would have to retrain then to dual wielding sabres. But maybe that's best because once you get Durgan Steel Firebrand starts to become inferior - until then it's top notch though.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Boeroer

[Boeroer]

Ups, added a lot (too much) with an edit...

[rheingold]

Not sure if the op has tried a chanter? They definitely do not need to be min/maxed and are good from a roleplay point of view if that's his major concern.

[Slack83er]

Hi rhein, no, never tried it. Isn't it a bit microintensive or squishy? I'm open to all suggestions...

[rheingold]

It's actually a great class... Tanks well, has some crowd control and dps at later levels. Can be micro intensive or not, it's your choice, though it's never going to be as micro intensive as a rogue....

Any race works well enough, really only moon godlike is overpowered, so you can choose whatever you like. I'm partial to boreal dwarves or pale elves myself. Boeroer has got 2 excellent builds chillfog and the drakes ambassador. Regarding stats, you seriously don't have to min/max in this game if you don't want to. That includes POTD. So if you like a build just remember you can use the idea and tweak the stats to your liking. For a chanter I like str 16, Int 16, Res 16 everything else at 10. Gives a large number of dialogue options from high resolve and Int. Bear in mind that chanters are really powerful but very deceptive characters. You only start noticing them at high levels even though they do more than pull their weight at low levels. They are just not flashy before say 9th level or so.

Edited August 10, 2016 by rheingold

[Slack83er]

Mmm.. I'll open the game and see if the class appeals to me.. Never tried... thanks for the moment...

 

EDIT.. no...thanks mate but this whole chanting mechanic doesn't appeal that much to me... but thanks nonetheless.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Slack83er

[Boeroer]

Chanters are awesome by the way. Can be played with minimum of micromanagement, a lot of tankyness and a TON of damage. One of my most favorite classes for soloing. But what about the fiery paladin with da big burnin' sword? Not appealing?

Edited August 10, 2016 by Boeroer

[Slack83er]

Right now I was playing the paladin that the other guy suggested... I'm trying all the build you give me. Next will be yours, Boeroer. 

At the moment I don't dislike that build... maybe I must carve a background around him but... not bad. 2hand fighting is not bad, as it reduces the penalties in speed for low dex...

 

Edit... come to think of it... would it be possible to "mix" the two builds? Somehow... I like them both...

Edited August 10, 2016 by Slack83er

[Ben No.3]

@Boeroer about the big edit: while this is excellent advise (I honestly forgot about the chainmail from the wael quest... Dammit what store has it now?), I doubt that late game advise is useful for our favourite noooob . He hasn't even seen defiance bay, weapons like buckler, stormcaller, little savour and so in are to him more abstract than actual weapons... He won't see them for quite some time. I think we should rather get him started ...

Edited August 10, 2016 by Ben No.3

[Ben No.3]

Well, simply choose fire godlike and enchant all your weapons with fire lash . The thing about boeroer's build is he mainly uses two handed weapons... Speed penalty really hurts us with those, so we would had to put points into Dex so we had to reduce mental stats...

 

Hey, we just won bronze in Judo in the Olympic... Sure you don't wanna play a monk

Edited August 10, 2016 by Ben No.3

[Loren Tyr]

Just as a general observation, I would advise against using Blunderbuss with Flames of Devotion. Just like the six pellets themselves, any Lashes on those pellets individually reduced by DR so it suffers much more against high DR targets. Moreover, Lashes don't benefit from DR reduction (either from the weapon itself or from effects like Penetrating Shot or Vulnerable Attack). Arquebus is the best weapon for this, but staying in the Ruffian WF a pistol is also usually a better bet in this regard. 

[Boeroer]

It's just an outlook what will become of this fire paladin - of course you don't start with all that stuff. I'm only watering his mouth.

 

I won't dump DEX with Two Handers, true - but you don't need superhigh DEX to make them work. Your main damage source will be FoD and you only have 2 of those per encounter. But with Firebrand those two hits - especially with Scion of Flame - really hurt a lot.

 

Battle Forged - here the +4 DR - is not bad in the early game, too. It's not as powerful as Silver Tid from Moon Godlikes but it scales better with level and fits the theme.

 

You can of course use dual wield fast weapons like stilettos instead and use guns for FoD. It's just that the optics of a aumaua sized Fire Godlike with a giant burning sword are quite... cool?