Cipher is an aggro magnet - to be fixed?

[AzureG]

  OK. Lots of hours of play now.  (Need sleep!)  One thing that is consistent over multiple party builds.  The Cipher draws aggro - even when that character HAS DONE NOTHING BUT STAND STILL.  The mobs ignore the fighter, even with Defender active, and run right past and head for the Cipher.  This has happened with multiple parties with differing compositions.  Not quite 100% of the time, but it is at least 90%.  If she does start to cast a spell, woe is her, because almost every mob will stop what it's doing and head for the Cipher.  The only way I can keep her on her feet is to stack the fighter types around her so nothing else can reach her.  This doesn't happen with any other character type.  The mobs will run right past my wizard - in the middle of casting, and sometimes even after an AoE, and still head for the Cipher.

[Mungri]

Not a specific issue with the cipher, mobs target your squishiest characters first.

 

You need better tactics, try rusing in your tank(s) first with your squishies out of agro range, then bring them in after all the mobs are engaged on your tank(s).

 

Also try having one decent defender backline char that can swap to emergency tank if mobs do reach your backline. On Potd I manage with two max defense fighter tanks, and a DPS paladin backline protector. If mobs get past the tanks, swap my paladin to sword and shield weapon set and engage those mobs while my squishy rogue and casters run away.

[termokanden]

Yeah this was a major issue for me until I started adapting to it. I always keep a little focus to cast Mental Binding one anyone who gets close.

 

I don't know how the enemies instinctively know who is squishiest.

 

PS: Have you ever heard of Beagle Power? No? Then let me tell you about Beagle Power. There is a cloak in this game that summons a "noble animal". Well, turns out that noble animal is a beagle, and I've lost count of the number of times my enemies have stopped in their tracks to pet the beagle instead of hitting me. You can only summon it once per rest, but it really is a life-saver.

Edited April 1, 2015 by termokanden

[Jonthrei]

Yeah this was a major issue for me until I started adapting to it. I always keep a little focus to cast Mental Binding one anyone who gets close.

 

I don't know how the enemies instinctively know who is squishiest.

 

"Three guys in platemail... two wearing mail... hey, that idiot's in a dress! Kill him!"

[Ceranai]

  OK. Lots of hours of play now.  (Need sleep!)  One thing that is consistent over multiple party builds.  The Cipher draws aggro - even when that character HAS DONE NOTHING BUT STAND STILL.  The mobs ignore the fighter, even with Defender active, and run right past and head for the Cipher.  This has happened with multiple parties with differing compositions.  Not quite 100% of the time, but it is at least 90%.  If she does start to cast a spell, woe is her, because almost every mob will stop what it's doing and head for the Cipher.  The only way I can keep her on her feet is to stack the fighter types around her so nothing else can reach her.  This doesn't happen with any other character type.  The mobs will run right past my wizard - in the middle of casting, and sometimes even after an AoE, and still head for the Cipher.

You need to make sure that the enemies are engaged with your tank, ive never seen a mob disengage once its engaged, your problem is probably that you let them get past your front line too often, I have a 2 paladin, 1 druid, 1 chanter, 2 cypher build that works really well as long as i position my front line well, but the second i let mobs past the front line the cyphers drop like flies

[termokanden]

It's also a matter of how many mobs the tanks can hold. I gave both my tanks Hold the Line and find everything much more manageable now. Together they can now hold 6 mobs.

[Mungri]

At level 5 both my tanks took that ability that lets them snatch mobs and pull them into melee range and engage.

 

That sounds incredibly useful.

 

I'm sure the AI goes after your lowest health / endurance characters first. When one of my tanks had less health than max endurance, I pulled him back and added my paladin to the front, and then all the mobs were ignoring my casters and going straight to my almost dead tank with a crossbow.

 

Cannot do Potd without at least 2 tanks. Its impossibru. But its nice that there's finally an RPG where tanking is effective and works.

Edited April 1, 2015 by Mungri

[Marceror]

 

Yeah this was a major issue for me until I started adapting to it. I always keep a little focus to cast Mental Binding one anyone who gets close.

 

I don't know how the enemies instinctively know who is squishiest.

 

"Three guys in platemail... two wearing mail... hey, that idiot's in a dress! Kill him!"

 

I think you just described at least some of it all on your own!

 

Also, casters tend to be higher threats. I know I target them first... because I "instinctively know" it's a good idea. Why shouldn't the AI do likewise?

[termokanden]

"Three guys in platemail... two wearing mail... hey, that idiot's in a dress! Kill him!"

 

"Three guys in a dress, but I know THAT guy has two less HP than the others because... I saw him cough?"

 

It's funny you should mention it though, because aggro works exactly the opposite in Dragon Age: Origins. There, heavy armor (but most of all proximity) generates extra aggro.

 

I don't really know how the AI manages to single out my cipher among my 3 squishy casters, but I seem to have stumbled upon the solution. I got Durance killed and needed a sixth party member. I picked a really squishy moon godlike, and sure enough, enemies just love her. The thing about the moon godlike passive is, it's totally useless if you're not getting attacked, but if you are a squishy aggro magnet, it actually gives you one heck of a heal in each tough battle. It saved me in that pesky lighthouse.

[Katarack21]

I find sending my main tanks in and then having Aloth create a wall of fire behind them, in front of the casters, is a super effective strategy to prevent this issue.

[Shadenuat]

I heard Sensuki say mobs like to target characters in 6th character slot.

[tamurm]

I do think the mobs tend to target the 'squishiest' people first, that is, the person with the least damage resistances to whatever attacks they have. - In the lighthouse for example. My Cipher PC had zero freeze resistance, and every Shade in the damn room would walk around line of sight just to hit him with their freeze bolt. All four of them. All at once.

 

The moment I put on some freeze resistance gear? They changed their priorities to Durance. Who probably had the lowest resistance next. - He had far more HP than my 3 Con Cipher.

[Arctic]

you need to get better positioning if its happening in normal fights.

 

If there is a lot of mobs you need to cc them, block their path or being able to engage all of them .. so bonus engagement talents and items are your tanks friends ...

 

if you are fighting teleporting monsters .. well .. wait until they teleport mentalbinding and focus them down ..

[gurugeorgey]

I actually agree with the OP, there's something fishy about Ciphers vis a vis mobs. 

 

All that positioning and going in with the tank etc. is great, and works a lot of the time, but sometimes you can't get that perfect positioning, and on those occasions when there are so many mobs they swarm around the front line, they will go for the Cipher, rather than the Wizard or Druid or Chanter - 9 times out of 10.

 

Could still be a random result, but it's something I noticed myself enough so that this topic alerted my interest.

 

Maybe it's something to do with a raw damage dealer or cc-er being higher on a threat table or something?

Edited April 3, 2015 by gurugeorgey

[Shdy314]

Its not the cipher its just whos squishiest. For me it's Aloth.