Idea(s) for "Modding" Environment(s) & Encounter(s)

[Osvir]

The idea is fairly simple, but it would require something from Obsidian. 

A) Make a generic wilderness area. Empty of any content (NPC's, Quests, monsters or whatnot). A forest area with no paths and lots of trees, or an open grassy field. Or a desert area.

B) A hobbyist or modder could then clone this area, add content into it. Environmental effects maybe, triggers, NPC's, quests, monsters/encounters and so on and forth.

Another separate idea, which is more or less "encounter modding", could be to have some sort of arena in-game in some city (Maybe a boxing den in some slums, instead of some large coliseum inspired arena). Then you could modify creatures and enemies specifically for encounter purposes.

Maybe be able to create some sort of "Encounter Set", "Arena Set", or "Challenge Set". "Stronghold Defense" goes in the same bin, it would be a great asset to be able to modify what type of enemies attack the stronghold, their strengths or whatnot, and also be able to add some sort of trigger in-game to activate it.

[Pipyui]

I'm hoping to, at least, get the environment resources for modding.  You know, trees, rocks, walls, tables, doors, the like.  The environments I suspect we shall have to produce ourselves, unless we want a bunch of environments without varying elevation; but it would be nice to get some of the ground/wall texture samples, so that we could plaster them into our own environments.

 

From what we've been hearing of the development pipeline, I suspect that a modders toolkit is not coming our way.  It sounds rather that Obsidian is using a whole sequence of third-party tools to produce their maps, and I deem it likely we'll need to do the same.  They'll outline their own process for us, give us all of the map formats and specifications, and suggest tools to create them, as well as provide us samples and resources (like trees).

 

It might be interesting, when the modding community comes together, to provide a website with portals to different community resources.  Environment artists could upload sceneries, modelers could upload static resources, and then the modders could use these to produce content-filled and complete mods.

[Osvir]

What I was thinking specifically btw, was a sort of "Rocky Mountains" type of area. As you know, Rocky Mountains are pretty big and stretch pretty far. Pillars of Eternity has the entire mountain reach in the north-east.

So basically, if Obsidian made one area with mountains on the north-east side of the map, modders could clone that area and then insert the clones along the mountain all the way. As I said, doesn't matter if the area looks entirely the same, it's the content that makes it more interesting. And if it is a believable area that gets repeated over and over it could actually be immersive still.

But being able to place props or similar items on a cloned map would give some diversity at least and add touch to it so that it isn't "same area over and over again".

Same thing goes with a thick forest area with lots of trees and little paths. Let the modder be able to clone the area and add content into it. Monster points, maybe a quest or an item that you can find, NPC's, Player companions, hunters, and so and so forth. The small stuff.

Another map that could be cloned easily would be a random encounter map, and then be able to add it into the "pool" of random maps. Fallout 1 & 2 style, clone it and let the Player add new content into it. A UFO maybe, or cows that say "Moo moo, I say, moo!" or whatever the modders imagination is.

[PrimeJunta]

@Osvir, why do you figure creating environment maps is going to be so hard that you'd want Obsidian to provide templates?

 

I figure that if they've got a production pipeline going which can churn them out efficiently enough to build a seriously big game in this kind of schedule, it can't be so hard that skilled and dedicated modders couldn't do it.

[Osvir]

These answers? PCGamer Interview (the answers are at the bottom of the linked page btw)
 

Is the game mod-friendly?

JS: It’s not mod-unfriendly...

 

There are certain elements of it that I think are probably going to be easier to mod than others. Environments are probably going to be pretty tough to author on your own, because even for us they’re complicated, they’re time-consuming to build, they’re very hi-res, they involve a number of special passes and things.

 

Other things I think are friendlier to modification, but we’ll have to see.

 

AB: It depends...we’re still investigating how much...since we’re using Unity there’s a lot of things we need to work around for modability, but we want to do everything we can do for the mod community. We’ll be really open, if they have questions. It’s nice because with publishers a lot of times they don’t like us talking about the technology and ways of doing things, but people can ask us on the forums and we can answer them.

 

So it would be hard to make a new environment but easier, maybe, to do a quest line or...

AB: Or an item pack. Adjust the rules system a little bit.

 

JS: Some of that stuff we’re externalizing. Weapons, some of the racial modifiers, we’re putting them in separate things so some of that stuff will be easier to modify than others.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Osvir

[PrimeJunta]

Hm. If it really is that difficult, then I think modders would be better advised to write new content in existing environments. Not sure how much I'd enjoy playing something set in a generic, pre-provided wilderness area.

[Osvir]

True. But as I said, if we are allowed to add some props (really only props) then we could add our own touch to it. The "base" template would always be the same, but what modders can do with a few props could make each area stand out on their own so it wouldn't be the same area over and over again.

Not to mention we could give the areas titles, as well as add characters, monsters, maybe a battle is taking place, or a hunt and so on and so forth. Lots of stuff could be done with a cloned map, as long as there are tools to "polish" it or make it varied/diverse from all the other clones.

The very best method would really be too release a blank template of a map, an pen grassy field or a sandy desert area. Then create modding resources for props 100%. Then that grassy field could transform into a forest, or that desert area could get some cacti and flora. Maybe an oasis too even and stuff like that.

The power in modding in environmental maps should be mostly on the Props side I think.

[Pipyui]

Modders can be pretty ingenuous.  In my mind, the question of environment generation is less "How difficult is it?" than "How free is the required software?"  As long as the map generation is fairly straightforward (of which I do not know), a wiki page or tutorial with step-by-step instructions should do wonders.  But if third-party tools are not freely* available, the modding community will suffer for it greatly.

 

Sample maps would be nice, but if everything goes well, they should be used more as sample spaces for artists to acquaint themselves with the medium than as actual environments to mod.  If things do not go so well, I guess we'd have to make do as you (Osvir) suggest we may (though I hope not ).

 

In either case, I really hope they give us those environment resources to use, because while some may be able to paint in themselves a rock or a wall or even a building, I don't think it'd be easy to paint in an animated tree.

 

TL;DR: I suspect the major concerns to modders are:

• Map generation may be complex, but how straightforward is the process?
• Are there free* tools available for the process?
• Seriously, I think a website with resource portals for community-made environments, model resources, mods, etc. is a fantastic idea.

* Free as in price and terms of use.

Edited January 14, 2014 by Pipyui

[Silent Winter]

Map generation, for those with some 3D background, isn't that complex - the problems lie in the size of the resolutions (though you can do it in stages and stitch it together) and the number of different passes for one area - time consuming unless you have a super-computer/render-farm.

I could produce a map like these ... though not of the same quality

Free tools to do this?  It could be done in blender - but that's not that easy to learn and it would take a skilled user to create backgrounds that were good enough to not look like cr*p next to the official ones..

I don't know if Bryce 5 is still free (again, takes a lot of learning but can produce good results) - Bryce 7 is better (I've got a license but it won't run on my current system - it should but it won't).

 

Setting up a website to share modding resources is a good idea and will probably be done soon after the game is out