Company of Heroes 2 closed Beta

[Monte Carlo]

Hi,

 

Relic / Sega have lifted the NDA restrictions on discussion only, so sadly I can't post screenies or anything. I've been playing in the Beta for almost ten days and thought I'd share some thoughts with those of you who enjoyed the original game and are thinking about perhaps picking up this one.

 

CoH2 is all about the Russian Front. It has rousing choral music that sounds like the Red Army choir, blizzards that kill your troops if you can't make it to sources of fire and deep snow that can bog down vehicles. Oh, and iced-over lakes that you can blow up, sinking any units attempting to cross it. It also tries to capture the meat-grinder character of the theatre, which has led to some controversial gameplay changes. Hardcore fans are slightly concerned, but speaking as one of them myself, I am adapting the more I play.

 

And, bejaysus, there is a lot of Arty in CoH2. If you like dropping inordinate amounts of indirect fire on your enemy and blowing them into paste, then you'll enjoy this game. It was identified immediately as OP (on the Beta forum it quickly became dubbed 'Company of Mortars') and I think is having some timely nerfs applied.

 

 

Anita whatshername would approve of the heroic depiction of Kommunist sniper-chicks in CoH2

 

nyhow, here is the meat and potatoes...

 

Eye-Candy

 

TBH it doesn't look like we've had seven years of progress from the original. Having said that the first game still looks great. Blizzard / weather effects are excellent. Unit models are good, some of the new units are great (Katyusha rocket trucks, SturmPanzers etc). The Soviet sniper teams come in a boy / girl combo but my favourite unit is the T-70 tank, a crazy lightly-armoured Dalek of a unit with a female commander who can pop out of the turret to increase line of sight. There are also scout cars and halfies you can load snipers and flamethrower units into for even more mayhem and incinerated Fascists. The GUI is frickin horrible and we all want it changed: too busy, clumsy and distracting. Here is an NDA-free example that has already been released...

 

 

The resource stats are to the right (not shown here) and are horizontal. I hate it. I think given the barrage of nerdrage Relic might tweak it.

 

Big battles (3 v 3 & 4 v 4) look utterly brilliant - swarms of armour rolling across arty-strafed battlefields. I would prefer the camera to let me pan out a bit more, again a common complaint on the Beta forums.

 

Ear-Candy

 

CoH2 has the best sound I've ever heard in a computer wargame. All of the historic weapons were fired for real and recorded. The armour clanks and groans as it trundles onto the battlefield. The music is solid and rousing, although will never surpass the genius of the original. The soldier chatter is, as usual for a CoH title (one German AT gunner is moaning about dragging the gun, the other reminds him that's because they ate all the horses).

 

Gameplay

 

We have seen nothing of the official campaign, only multiplayer so please bear that in mind.

 

Faster than CoH1. Much faster. Tanks roll out quicker, units cannot build the static defences prevalent in CoH1 (no concrete bunkers or zombie grens or tank traps) so it is a game of fire-and- manoeuvre. This has led to allegations of the "Command and Conquer" style dumbing down of the franchise, but TBH this is a tad harsh (although I wish they'd slow the pace down a bit, it's very frenetic for an old fart like me). A primordial meta is developing that might put this into context.

 

The Soviets play a little bit like Amis from CoH1 but the Germans have devastating late game armour (most 3 v 3s and 4 v 4s have StuGs running around by the twelve / thirteen minute mark, they are very cheap to build and get spammed). A critical hit system against vehicles allows for all sorts of mayhem (stunned crews / damage to vision blocks / engines / weapons). Swarming suicidal Soviet penal troops armed with satchel charges onto crippled Nazi armour is a totally do-able tactic in this game and is very Eastern-Frontish in feel.

 

The VP / resource system has changed too. You can now build resource OPs on any point and choose which resource to boost (Fuel or Munis). This makes cut-offs less of an acute problem, which changes the meta completely.

 

There is an interesting roster of units and 'Commanders' (who you can customise, I'm slightly underwhelmed as you have to take their abilities in order, unlike CoH where there were skill trees). The Russians have penal troops, cannon fodder conscripts, elite Guards infantry (wearing capes!), metal-armoured close combat infantry with SMGs, all sorts of tank destroyers etc. Germans have less infantry varieties (one squad is rifles / MG42 with upgrade the other MP44 / Panzerschreck with upgrades) but shed-loads of armour and vehicles.

 

Conclusion

 

It's... different but still CoH. It will take a lot of getting used to. It's as if a diehard BG fan had opened up NeverWinter Nights and discovered that it didn't suck donkey balls. If you want a fast-paced but tactically deep WW2 RTS game that is less fussy than Men of War but more gritty than something involving hex-squares and men with beards, then you really might like this.

 

Feel free to ask questions!

 

Cheers

 

MC

Edited April 12, 2013 by Monte Carlo

[Bokishi]

How are graphics, are they better than the first game? because they don't seem like it to me in screenshots

[Agiel]

Well at least the Soviets have a lot of artillery, they called it the "God of War" for a reason. About the only artillery that's an actual unit and not an off-map global ability the Germans have are mortars and the Walking Stuka (the latter if you're kind of up a creek if they miss). At the moment, there have been quite a few complaints that "German Steel" has a dominating advantage against Soviet armour, but given that the Soviets have to count upon spam tactics and they have plenty of immobilising abilities (ram for T-34 and their basic conscripts having easy access to the CoH 2 equivalent of riflemen sticky bombs) and that the Ostwind is weak as hell this time around, I don't really see where they're coming from.

 

I would definitely like to see the 88 back in this game. Anti-aircraft, anti-tank, and anti-social!

[Drowsy Emperor]

I was hoping it would be as slow or slower than CoH, not faster.

 

Another gripe is the perpetuation of the fiction that the Soviet army fought with Zerg tactics. The reality is that they fought with outdated WW1 tactics at the beginning of the war and adapted to modern warfare quickly afterwards. But, games are games...

 

That said, the rest seems okay.

Edited April 12, 2013 by Drowsy Emperor

[LordCrash]

Cool, thanks for the information. I'm morte interested in the singleplayer campaigns but the information about the gameplay and graphics sounds promising.

[Monte Carlo]

How are graphics, are they better than the first game? because they don't seem like it to me in screenshots

 

Pretty cool. But then again I love CoH1's graphics. I've got it ramped up to maximum for everything and it's purdy. I think you'd like the weather effects, the blizzards are very atmospheric I had to put a woolly hat on.

 

As for other observations ---

 

I agree with Drowsy that they have resorted to one concept of the theatre, which in Multiplayer I would suggest is Kursk - Berlin (i.e. later war tactics) will be interesting to see what's occurring in the campaign...

 

So for LordCrash the campaign is a totally different data set from MP. So you might see very different units and mechanics in single-player.

 

Agiel: You can get 88s in this game as a Commander ability and move the suckers around, too. There is a very fair split between on and off-map arty.

[Monte Carlo]

Oh, and using the T-34 to head-butt German armour and break their guns is priceless. Soviets don't really Zerg-rush but they need combined arms to defeat armour. What I mean is you cripple the German tank with other tanks then the coup de grace is with AT guns and AT infantry. I took out a Tiger that killed two T-34s and three infantry squads. Finally slew the beast with a satchel charge.

[Agiel]

 

How are graphics, are they better than the first game? because they don't seem like it to me in screenshots

 

Pretty cool. But then again I love CoH1's graphics. I've got it ramped up to maximum for everything and it's purdy. I think you'd like the weather effects, the blizzards are very atmospheric I had to put a woolly hat on.

 

As for other observations ---

 

I agree with Drowsy that they have resorted to one concept of the theatre, which in Multiplayer I would suggest is Kursk - Berlin (i.e. later war tactics) will be interesting to see what's occurring in the campaign...

 

So for LordCrash the campaign is a totally different data set from MP. So you might see very different units and mechanics in single-player.

 

Agiel: You can get 88s in this game as a Commander ability and move the suckers around, too. There is a very fair split between on and off-map arty.

 

The PaK-43 at the moment seems to be just a specialist anti-tank unit with not much more anti-infantry power than the Panther, takes an agonising time to build, is particularly vulnerable to at that stage in the game ubiquitous Soviet artillery, and costs way too much in the way of upkeep. 

[Drowsy Emperor]

Regarding graphics, I don't honestly see how they could have improved much over CoH. CoH was ahead of its time, and in terms of clarity, animation and being easy on the eyes (detail tends to stand out in strategy games too much, making them a visual mess) - its probably still unsurpassed.

 

DoW 2 is an example of how too much detail can make the game tiring to look at. At least that was the case for me.

[Morgoth]

It's a beta, so they rarely put the final hi-Res art assets into it.

[Monte Carlo]

Some replays are starting to trickle out...

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/Propagandacast

 

Plus some Beta keys...

 

Just 'like' the FB page...

 

https://www.facebook.com/companyofheroes

[alanschu]

How are graphics, are they better than the first game? because they don't seem like it to me in screenshots

 

Hahaha sees this post by Bokishi.  Then sees Bokishi's thread about graphics killing the game industry

[Monte Carlo]

^ LOL. Games like CoH aren't really about extreme top-end graphics. What they have is good, and the atmosphere feels right. Plus, the weapons effects feel crunchy and satisfying, especially the tank battles.

[alanschu]

I liked COH a lot.  My first impressions were "Eh, I was hoping for Close Combat" but after giving it another try some years later, I was like "Oooo, very nice"

 

 

Though that the pace has been upped is a bit worrisome for myself.  I didn't mind the pace of the original, but would probably have been okay with its pace being slowed somewhat too.

Edited April 16, 2013 by alanschu

[Bokishi]

 

How are graphics, are they better than the first game? because they don't seem like it to me in screenshots

 

Hahaha sees this post by Bokishi.  Then sees Bokishi's thread about graphics killing the game industry

I must be trolling lol

[Drowsy Emperor]

Some replays are starting to trickle out...

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/Propagandacast

 

Plus some Beta keys...

 

Just 'like' the FB page...

 

https://www.facebook.com/companyofheroes

 

More or less what I expected and pretty good overall. A pity that the vehicle movement and rotation still isn't ideal.

[Nepenthe]

I avoid eastern front games, coz I generally have to pick one of two wrong sides.

[Drowsy Emperor]

/delete 

Edited April 17, 2013 by Drowsy Emperor

[Nepenthe]

Obviously, being the grandson of a chaplain from a front line Finnish Army unit, I might have inherited a slightly different picture of it from most "westerners".

[Monte Carlo]

No, Nepenthe is correct, the Ostfront is a choice between intolerable totalitarian bastard or intolerable totalitarian bastard. It's basically Warhammer 40K. On earth. With no orks or space elves or **** like that. Although I'm sure somebody will persuade me that Hitler had a secret Space Elf program.

 

Once you've wrapped your head around that, it's a superb squad-level tactical RTS.

 

My only concession to righteousness is that the Russians were at least defending their own turf, plus I like their choirs. And the first time you ram a Panther with your shot-up T-34 and smash the gun off the enemy panzer is simply priceless.

[alanschu]

I find it reasonably easy to recognize it's a game, and typically find the Soviet Front to be filled with many interesting battles and scenarios.

[Drowsy Emperor]

No, Nepenthe is correct, the Ostfront is a choice between intolerable totalitarian bastard or intolerable totalitarian bastard. It's basically Warhammer 40K. On earth. With no orks or space elves or **** like that. Although I'm sure somebody will persuade me that Hitler had a secret Space Elf program.

 

Once you've wrapped your head around that, it's a superb squad-level tactical RTS.

 

My only concession to righteousness is that the Russians were at least defending their own turf, plus I like their choirs. And the first time you ram a Panther with your shot-up T-34 and smash the gun off the enemy panzer is simply priceless.

 

The Russians weren't fighting for Stalin or even communism. They were fighting for their nation and out of genuine anti-fascism which is apparent from wartime posters calling for the defense of "mother russia" and soldier memoirs. Of course simply having to defend themselves and later the need for retribution are a big part of it too.

[Nepenthe]

 

My only concession to righteousness is that the Russians were at least defending their own turf, plus I like their choirs. And the first time you ram a Panther with your shot-up T-34 and smash the gun off the enemy panzer is simply priceless.

For a while. Obviously they'd invaded Finland earlier in the war... And there's the rest of the Molotov/Ribbentrop pact stuff, too. Edited April 18, 2013 by Nepenthe

[Agiel]

As of now the most irritating thing about playing team games is being teamed up with too timid players, people who don't understand that a Relic RTS is all about map control, even more so than Starcraft and League of Legends all the kids are into these days (these same players also seem to think we get enough fuel income just by building fuel points, rather than helping me take the natural ones on the map, spending valuable manpower on that instead of additional grenadiers or conscripts). One of these days, Relic should put a splash screen on their games that's required to watch every time you launch the game that says: "DO NOT TURTLE WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE AT LEAST HALF THE GODDAMNED MAP!"

 

Also with the mortar-centric meta now, I've gotten in the habit to listen closely for the tube launches. I micro a capping unit to dance around the point as mortars shells land around them, and break down an MG-42 ASAP to re-position. Putting infantry into scout-cars/half-tracks during blizzards also finally clicked with me, ninja-capping the other guy's fuel during blizzards on the winter maps. Speaking of which, a pair of Sdfkz 222 Scout Cars with autocannons raiding a Soviet player's rear lines and icing 4 Studebaker trucks with Katushyas mounted on them is glorious. I really hate artillery-centric players, you see.

[Drowsy Emperor]

In anticipation: