The NHL Thread.

[mkreku]

I thought this was kind of funny:

 

http://espn.go.com/nhl/conversations/_/id/9448246/alex-ovechkin-washington-capitals-tops-nhl-all-stars-earning-6th-selection

 

It sounds cooler than it is. What it means is that a number of professional sports journalists probably didn't know the Caps switched Ovechkin from left to rightwing this year, thus accidentally voting for him as a leftwing.

[Kor Qel Droma]

Wow, that's a pretty active start to free agency!

[Hurlshort]

Krookie, I hope the Ryan Clowe signing works out for you, but that is too much money for him.  He's a gritty guy with good hands, but he's got no speed.  $3 million a season should be his ceiling.

[Volourn]

I like how people will just arbirtlaly sya so and so is only worth x amount. Why is Clowe worth exactly 3mil and not 5 mil or not 1 mil? What is so special about 3mil? L0LZ

 

Arbitray number is arbitrary number.

[Hurlshort]

Because there is a salary cap and you can only afford so many players?  

 

I mean there are a lot of statistical ways you can break it down, but he did score 3 goals last season, was injured for awhile, sometimes takes bad penalties, and lacks speed.  That's a decent percentage of the salary cap to devote to a player coming off those issues.  

 

I like the guy and hope he is able to get back to his 20 goal, 50 points average, but I wouldn't be comfortable gambling that much on it.

[Volourn]

Everything you said is true but none of it explains why it all adds up to 'this a 3 mil player not 5mil or 1mil'.

[Hurlshort]

Everything you said is true but none of it explains why it all adds up to 'this a 3 mil player not 5mil or 1mil'.

 

I'd probably have to run a comparison of other wingers that play a similar role to fully explain it, but I'm much too lazy to do that.

 

The salary cap is $64.3 million this year.  Clowe is a 2nd line winger at best, 3rd line if he plays like he did last year.  With some quick research I noticed that Johan Franzen, a comparable player when they are both healthy, is a million less as a cap hit than Clowe.  I'd say Franzen is better too, so that makes it seem to me like they overpaid.

 

I guess it is fine if the Devils don't run into cap trouble, but they don't have that much room and down the road that contract can become a burden. 

[alanschu]

Yeah, it may be an "arbitrary number" but that's the way you feel.  Sometimes people go "whoa, that was a steal!"

 

Although I think Hockey fans are still a bit on the $39 million salary cap mentality as opposed to a $64.3 million, so almost all contract signings I see will have some people suggesting "really overpaid."

[Hurlshort]

Well we could break it down by position, what you can do with 64 million.

 

Goalie : 3-5 million

Defense #1 - 5-6 million each

Defense #2 - 3-4 million each

Defense #3 - 1 million each

 

Forward line #1 - 6-8 million each

Forward line #2 - 4-5 million each

Forward line #3 - 2-3 million each

Forward line #4 - 1 million each

 

If you go with the lowest number for each of those, you end up with $60 million.  Now I'm just guessing and playing around with numbers here, there is obviously a lot more complications when it comes to putting together an NHL team (and a few more roster spots for reserves.)  But Clowe seems to be getting a second line contract, when he really didn't put up second line numbers last year.  It seems risky to me.  I'm rooting for him though.

[babaganoosh13]

WE DO! WE HAVE LOTS OF MONEY AND NO BRAINS!

 

/Leafs Management

...and it did happen.

 

So, who have they got to play defense at the defense position yet? Could they have used the people that they used to get a backup goalie to get someone there that could play defense?

[Kor Qel Droma]

Free agency is all about over paying for players.

 

That being said, the big one year deals for guys like Alfie and Iginla I have no problem with.

 

It's the five, six, and seven year deals that make me shake my head.

[alanschu]

4 year deals are A-OK though

[Kor Qel Droma]

Sure, as long as you sign them before a player hits 35.

 

I'm glad that Edmontons' new GM did something.  I don't know a lot about Andrew Ference. A four year deal for a 34 year old is a little iffy, but I'll reserve judgement for a year or three.  I'll be happy if he can keep his head above water while showing a lot of the kids on the team the ropes.

 

I agree with Hurlshot that the money for Clowe seemed large.  But that's free agency.  Lou is pretty smart.  He's offsetting the cost of Clowe for the first two years with the savings he got signing Ryder so cheap.  On paper New Jersey looks scary good right now.

[Volourn]

Meh. They're the type of team that will either end up with the one of the best records.. or out of the playoffs.. kind of like the jekyell and hyde of the last two seasons.

[Deraldin]

I honestly have no idea what the hell Bergevin is thinking after the draft and his free agent signings. He goes and drafts big players with mediocre to moderate skills at the draft because "we need to get bigger and tougher", but then turns around and signs a tiny, aging player going into steep decline in Briere and a another fighter in Parros because we didn't learn anything from signing Laraque.

 

Why did we sign Briere? To replace Ryder? Why didn't we just resign Ryder? Hell, if Bergevin had waited a day or two I would have rather we re-signed Grabovski after he was put on waivers. Briere is terrible on the wing, but is at least competent at center. We have enough centers right now that we can't even get Galchenyuk proper ice time at center to help his development. At least if we had signed Grabovski instead we would have picked up someone who could play tough minutes rather than someone who struggle playing soft minutes.

 

At least we only signed him for 2 years. Maybe we'll be able find someone who wants him at the trade deadline, or next summer. What a terribly disappointing start to free agency for Montreal fans. Is it too late to sign Damien Brunner? At least he has some offensive upside.

[Leferd]

Slightly off topic:

 

I'm trying to remember the top two lines for the mid 90's era Penguins.

 

Was it Stevens-Lemieux-Tocchet and Mullen-Francis-Jagr or do I Kevin Stevens and Joe Mullen switched? Was Mullen even part of top two lines? Or was Mullen with Martin Straka and Shawn McEachern??? Who am I missing?

 

I was thinking about this the other day and never bothered to look it up.

[alanschu]

Stevens was with Lemieux.  It was probably Recchi then Mullen after Mark was traded in '91-'92 season though.

[Leferd]

My memory came back.

 

1) Stevens-Lemeiux-Tocchet

2) Mullen-Francis-Jagr

3) McEachern-Straka-Sandstrom

 

I remember Ron Francis was saying that he had to be the tough one on his line - which I found funny because he had just won the Lady Byng.

[alanschu]

Is that after Recchi was traded?  Recchi was still a 100 point man on those teams, so I can't imagine he wasn't on top 2 before Mullen.

[Leferd]

Yeah, this was after Recchi went to the Flyers.

 

Circa 95.

[Hurlshort]

Brenden Shanahan is now a Hall of Famer!

 

Chris Chelios and Neidermyer also made it.

Edited July 10, 2013 by Hurlshot

[Leferd]

I don't get that.

 

Scott Niedermeyer in before Rob Blake and Brendan Shanahan before Theoren Fleury??

[Hurlshort]

Not sure if serious...

 

Both of them are only in their first year of eligibility.  Blake will be in but he's not quite in the same class as the other two.

 

Fluery is a cool player and all, and he'll get in, but he doesn't hold a candle to Shanahan.  It was ridiculous Shanny didn't get in last year.

[Leferd]

Fair 'nuff.

 

90' era I ranked Defensemen as follows:

 

Bourque

Chelios

Leetch

Coffey

Lidstrom

Blake

Stevens

 

I guess I could see that Niedermayer gets the nod in before Blake due to Stanley Cups.

 

But I always had Fleury as a better player than Shanahan. Especially when comparing their five best seasons and three year consecutive peaks. Shanahan does have a longer albeit less dynamic body of work.

[mkreku]

Ouch, bad luck, Devils.