Global warming scam exposed!

[Walsingham]

*edit snipped*

 

Actually, that reminds me: _IF_ the prognosis for humanity as propounded by climate change doomsayers was taken literally and completely to heart I think most people would immediately advocate massive military action to cripple the industrial capacity of 'certain' nations. I mean we're talking millions dead and or starving if it turns out to be true. This would normally be a casus belli.

 

So perhaps its good that people aren't taking it so seriously.

[Wrath of Dagon]

I just saw a documentary about this leak. Seems like some of the leading members of the ICCP have faked results by combining tree ring data with thermometer data (the hockey stick diagram) which is a huge no-no since the two ways aren't comparable, and they've also used scare tactics and bullying to scare spectics silent. It IS a huge blow to the ICCP. It does cast a shadow on the whole organization and we might have to reassess how serious the threat of climate change is and if anything we can do about it will actually be of any use.

 

What it doesn't do however, no matter how much poor Dagon would like it to, is show proof that the climate change doesn't exist at all. It just shows how much we don't know about the mechanics of Earths atmosphere. Reducing greenhouse gas emissions and trying to stop using fossil fuels is only a good thing no matter if theres a threat of us being to our ankles in seawater or not.

 

To summarize, ICCP hasn't been doing real science and it's a good thing that their unscientific ways have come to to light. This however should not mean we bury our heads in the sand and forget all about the whole climate change. On the contrary it means that we have to take the whole thing even more seriously and put a lot more money into research, both hippies and sceptics.

There's actually nothing I disagree with in your statement except I'm not poor and in fact a lot richer than you are, and I never claimed climate change doesn't exist at all. Obviously cllimate changes all the time, and I already said so, and the issue is how much if any is due to humans and if so what can we reasonably do about it.

 

Edit: Btw, what that documentary says is exactly what the article I linked says, if anyone had actually bothered to read it before going into automatic attack mode.

Edited December 8, 2009 by Wrath of Dagon

[Lare Kikkeli]

Perhaps it is your smug attitude and idiotic posts in other threads that makes taking anything you post seriously really hard.

[Walsingham]

Perhaps it is your smug attitude and idiotic posts in other threads that makes taking anything you post seriously really hard.

 

Maybe it's the way myself and others constantly attack him which makes him harsh and defensive?

[Fenghuang]

It's all a losing game anyway. Even if you minimize/eliminate man's impact on global warming, we're at the end of a thaw. The coming ice age is inevitable.

 

http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/Ice_Age.html

 

Eventually this interglacial period will lead into another ice age via too much cold water from glaciers hitting the ocean and adjusting the Gulf Stream so that it no longer warms up Europe.

 

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0130-11.htm

 

For what it's worth I've seen the science on both of these sites being thrown around other places before, these are just the first two links I found that were easy to digest. Even if the warming/cooling cycle doesn't work as specified in the second link, that Ice Ages and Interglacials are cyclical is pretty incontrovertible.

 

 

 

Oh, and from what I understood the "falsified" data in the emails is the scientists trying to omit things that would cause drops or spikes in the overall temperature trends (volcanic eruptions, solar flares, etc.) from the data so that the underlying trend could be seen. It's hard to pull an actual trend out of something with that many variables, and it's easy to twist the evidence to suit whatever cause you want. In the end it's all the same though, it warms, then it freezes.

Edited December 8, 2009 by Fenghuang

[Wrath of Dagon]

Perhaps it is your smug attitude and idiotic posts in other threads that makes taking anything you post seriously really hard.

 

Maybe it's the way myself and others constantly attack him which makes him harsh and defensive?

I'm probably one of the least harsh people on this forum, for instance I never insult people first unlike the unprovoked insult you just quoted. I do defend myself when attacked, which is constant, so it's no wonder if I look defensive. As far as smug, talk about pot calling the kettle black.

[jaguars4ever]

It's all a losing game anyway. Even if you minimize/eliminate man's impact on global warming, we're at the end of a thaw. The coming ice age is inevitable.

 

http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/Ice_Age.html

 

Eventually this interglacial period will lead into another ice age via too much cold water from glaciers hitting the ocean and adjusting the Gulf Stream so that it no longer warms up Europe.

 

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0130-11.htm

 

For what it's worth I've seen the science on both of these sites being thrown around other places before, these are just the first two links I found that were easy to digest. Even if the warming/cooling cycle doesn't work as specified in the second link, that Ice Ages and Interglacials are cyclical is pretty incontrovertible.

You have no chance to survive make your time.

HA HA HA HA ...

[Fenghuang]

It's all a losing game anyway. Even if you minimize/eliminate man's impact on global warming, we're at the end of a thaw. The coming ice age is inevitable.

 

http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/Ice_Age.html

 

Eventually this interglacial period will lead into another ice age via too much cold water from glaciers hitting the ocean and adjusting the Gulf Stream so that it no longer warms up Europe.

 

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0130-11.htm

 

For what it's worth I've seen the science on both of these sites being thrown around other places before, these are just the first two links I found that were easy to digest. Even if the warming/cooling cycle doesn't work as specified in the second link, that Ice Ages and Interglacials are cyclical is pretty incontrovertible.

You have no chance to survive make your time.

HA HA HA HA ...

 

 

There's plenty of ways to survive using already existing technologies to continue to produce food and weather the impending ice age. I waver between being too cynical to believe that we'll be able to band together well enough to survive it on a large scale and optimistic enough to think that impending cataclysm will bring nations and peoples together and allow them to overcome their differences and pool their resources to get everyone through it. In my wildest flights of fancy I envision something like Asimov's Caves of Steel, only instead of protecting us from radiation they'd keep us safe from the cold.

 

Even without giant domed cities sooner or later someone with the money to make it happen is going to realize you can produce a lot more food on the same amount of land using hydroponics in a skyscraper and/or a skyscraper greenhouse; enough to feed giant overpopulated nations. Structures like that untie food production from climate.

[Fenghuang]

ALSO

 

There is not much we can do about global warming at this point aside from crazy mad science (geoengineering with bioengineered organisms, creating something that will capture the methane before it escapes to the atmosphere etc.). It is on the verge of spiraling out of control due to the release of vast undersea deposits of methane hydrates which are about 20 times more effective at trapping heat than lazy CO2.

 

This is from last year: http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/c...omb-938932.html

 

This is more recent: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/...90814103231.htm

Edited December 8, 2009 by Fenghuang

[Deadly_Nightshade]

....except I'm not poor and in fact a lot richer than you are...

 

And how would you know that?

[Walsingham]

I agree that even without Man-made warming we are on a planet which shifts massively every now and then. Because of that I'd be happier if we really were having man-made warming. As I may have said before.

[Lare Kikkeli]

Perhaps it is your smug attitude and idiotic posts in other threads that makes taking anything you post seriously really hard.

 

Maybe it's the way myself and others constantly attack him which makes him harsh and defensive?

I'm probably one of the least harsh people on this forum, for instance I never insult people first unlike the unprovoked insult you just quoted. I do defend myself when attacked, which is constant, so it's no wonder if I look defensive. As far as smug, talk about pot calling the kettle black.

 

Have you wondered why everyone attacks you all the time?

[Calax]

Perhaps it is your smug attitude and idiotic posts in other threads that makes taking anything you post seriously really hard.

 

Maybe it's the way myself and others constantly attack him which makes him harsh and defensive?

I'm probably one of the least harsh people on this forum, for instance I never insult people first unlike the unprovoked insult you just quoted. I do defend myself when attacked, which is constant, so it's no wonder if I look defensive. As far as smug, talk about pot calling the kettle black.

Honestly, from everything I've seen the reason that people like to pick on you is because some of the stuff that you say is so idiotic that it makes people spit stuff all over their screens. And you are smug and egotistical, Look at how you responded to her the first time "I'm richer than you!" when you have no clue about the other persons circumstances. You don't know the state of Lare's finances nor mine. All you get about peoples lives on here is a tiny snapshot taken through a window of the interwebs. Hardly enough to make calls like "I'm richer" or "I'm so awesome you'd be blown away" or "I have the bigger Cheney!"

[Wrath of Dagon]

No, I've never said anything idiotic, only an idiot would think that. As far as me being richer, if it wasn't true Kikkeli would've denied it, so I was right. Anyway, he's the one who called me "poor", I didn't say anything about him to start with.

[Fenghuang]

No, I've never said anything idiotic, only an idiot would think that. As far as me being richer, if it wasn't true Kikkeli would've denied it, so I was right. Anyway, he's the one who called me "poor", I didn't say anything about him to start with.

 

Yeah well my **** is bigger than yours so there.

[Fenghuang]

I agree that even without Man-made warming we are on a planet which shifts massively every now and then. Because of that I'd be happier if we really were having man-made warming. As I may have said before.

 

 

Man Wals, you think I got time to read the entire thread before posting? Dang.

[Lare Kikkeli]

No, I've never said anything idiotic, only an idiot would think that. As far as me being richer, if it wasn't true Kikkeli would've denied it, so I was right. Anyway, he's the one who called me "poor", I didn't say anything about him to start with.

 

Most of your posts in WoT are idiotic to some degree, and I think most people here, even the ones who agree with you on princible agree with me on this. Also I didn't respond because it was such a stupid thing to say, I'm richer than you

[Wrath of Dagon]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Russian-Clai...251869.html?x=0

 

This has to be the most retarded idea ever conceived. I guaranty Americans are thrilled to send money to Russia, thanks Obama.

[lord of flies]

Of course climate change isn't a scam. How exactly could you organize some kind of conspiracy in the most infighting industry in the world?

[Calax]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Russian-Clai...251869.html?x=0

 

This has to be the most retarded idea ever conceived. I guaranty Americans are thrilled to send money to Russia, thanks Obama.

...

where is obama mentioned in that article ANYWHERE!?

[Wrath of Dagon]

Isn't making an agreement with the world to rip us off Obama's idea? Who do you think sent our delegation to Copenhagen?

[Calax]

Isn't making an agreement with the world to rip us off Obama's idea? Who do you think sent our delegation to Copenhagen?

who's projecting so hard they can display power point?

 

He may have sent a delegation but it's not like he has power over what other countries are doing. That article simply states that in accordance with the Kyoto treaty, Russia (who's carbon emissions plummeted after the fall of communism) has a whole pack of carbon credits. How our CURRENT president has ANYTHING to do with the signing of the treaty, Russias reduction in carbon emissions, or how the other countries handle these facts, is something you're going to need to explain to me.

[Wrath of Dagon]

The Russian are demanding that their credits are extended to get the new treaty signed, so they can sell the credits to us. Obama wants to get the new treaty signed, that is his stated goal. You're right to the extent he hasn't signed anything yet, and unlikely to sign under those conditions if he wants to be reelected, so I admit I thanked him prematurely, but it was a figure of speech.

[Lare Kikkeli]

The Russian are demanding that their credits are extended to get the new treaty signed, so they can sell the credits to us. Obama wants to get the new treaty signed, that is his stated goal. You're right to the extent he hasn't signed anything yet, and unlikely to sign under those conditions if he wants to be reelected, so I admit I thanked him prematurely, but it was a figure of speech.

 

Prime example of an idiotic post... So Obama is responsible for what Russia does? Is it because he's a commie?

[Calax]

The Russian are demanding that their credits are extended to get the new treaty signed, so they can sell the credits to us. Obama wants to get the new treaty signed, that is his stated goal. You're right to the extent he hasn't signed anything yet, and unlikely to sign under those conditions if he wants to be reelected, so I admit I thanked him prematurely, but it was a figure of speech.

They might not necessairly need the russian signature for the extension of the treaty, you're projecting really hard to find ways to hate.