4E already released!

[Tale]

I am going to try for a 4e game through the official forums. Apparently someone is trying to get a game going half an hour from my house.

[Jorian Drake]

I am going to try for a 4e game through the official forums. Apparently someone is trying to get a game going half an hour from my house.

Lucky you, try once to gather a pnp group together randomly in Hungary, you are lucky you get enough rpg ppl livin near your region...

[Tale]

Actually, there's two groups on the site for my area. I think they're both in the same city. But only one of the two is trying 4e.

 

Of course, last update in the thread was 9 days ago, so it may already be written off as a bust.

[Sand]

Well, to be honest I am not going to make any final judgments about the game til I actually run it, which will be tomorrow.

[Tale]

Blast. That group filled up.

[Jorian Drake]

Well, to be honest I am not going to make any final judgments about the game til I actually run it, which will be tomorrow.

just try to play without prejustice or it won't matter much

[marshel]

Hello, i

Edited June 26, 2008 by marshel

[Magister Lajciak]

marshel, you don't have to relearn stuff if you don't won't to. Nobody can force you to switch. I and my group, for example, we are not switching to 4e.

[marshel]

marshel, you don't have to relearn stuff if you don't won't to. Nobody can force you to switch. I and my group, for example, we are not switching to 4e.

 

well, i

[Sand]

Well, to be honest I am not going to make any final judgments about the game til I actually run it, which will be tomorrow.

just try to play without prejustice or it won't matter much

 

 

Well, combat is easy, and fun. Also rather quick in round progression. In 3.5e an hour combat would last 2 to 3 rounds, while combat at the same length with be about 6 to 8 rounds. The major fault I don't like about it is the multiclassing rules.

[steelfiredragon]

neither do I, the MC rules blow.

[Sand]

Also the complete and total lacking in crafting rules suck as well. As a player I like to make characters that makes his own stuff. From the armor he wears, the weapons he uses, to the wands and rings as well. I do like the way they are handling magic item creation, but there is absolutely no rules in making the base item.

[Magister Lajciak]

I think the crafting rules are just part of skill system issue, the skill system being just horrid in general.

[Joseph Bulock]

Ran my first game this weekend. Had a lot of fun, players started to hit their strides after two encounters.

 

I was really surprised by how dangerous level one monsters are. My players didn't start off pressing their tactical advantages too much, and the first two encounters ended with most of the party unconscious. Some of that was my fault though, as I hadn't doubled checked everyone's math to make sure they had calculated all their attack bonuses correctly. All in all though, my players had fun, I had to spend about half the time creating the encounters, which freed me up to make better maps and even develop a decent story.

 

I like D&D 4th edition.

[Sand]

I am trying to vcome up with better multiclassing for it, at the same time not overpower it. I found crafting rules built for 4e at ENWorld, but it looks way over complicated for my tastes. I am not to the point I like 4e, but so far I haven't completely dismissed it.

Edited July 1, 2008 by Sand

[Magister Lajciak]

For me, 4E is completely out of the question now. We had a discussion about whether to switch or not in all 3 of my gaming groups. For 2 of the groups, I am the DM and wouldn't switch regardless, but when I nevertheless asked the groups what they would think about switching all members of both were vehemently against it. In the third group, where I am merely a player, I would have no option but to switch, but luckily for me the DM there was also opposed to it and so were all the players. It's not that I don't see any benefits at all in anything 4E, but the benefits (treatment of epic levels, every character getting something interesting at every level) just don't outweigh the disadvantages (skill system forcing us to be good at everything, same resource management for all classes, overly gamist concepts [explicit per encounter powers I am looking at you], flavor not resembling D&D any more and so on) for me.

 

Nevertheless, I will keep some limited tabs on the 4th edition for the sake of noticing when 5E comes out, which will hopefully move back to some 3.X edition concepts and introduce some positive innovations.

[Sand]

They could have spaced out the skill set a little than what they did but overall it is better to get rid of the clutter. Did any ever put ranks in Rope Use or any non-spell caster make use of Concentration? Also what use was having a skill so specialized such as Forgery? The Skill System in 4e, with the exception of the lacking in Crafting, is not that bad.

[Magister Lajciak]

They could have spaced out the skill set a little than what they did but overall it is better to get rid of the clutter. Did any ever put ranks in Rope Use or any non-spell caster make use of Concentration? Also what use was having a skill so specialized such as Forgery? The Skill System in 4e, with the exception of the lacking in Crafting, is not that bad.

 

It is not really the combining/elimination of skills that is bad about the 4E skill system. That is mostly fine, though I do think they have been somewhat overzealous with the combinations/eliminations, particularly with eliminating things like craft and combining movement skills. What makes the skill system so bad, as far as I am concerned, is that all skills advance at a rate of 1/2 point per level for all characters. This makes it impossible, by official rules, for a character to be truly bad at a skill and I like my NPCs and my PCs to be really bad at something - it adds color to the character and makes the gameplay more interesting. For me the 4E skill system is, therefore, simply not acceptable in a D&D-like RPG - unless house-ruled of course, but house-ruling can, in principle, solve anything in any game, so that is somewhat a moot point.

Edited July 2, 2008 by Magister Lajciak

[Sand]

Well, the way I see it there is going to be some intimidation factor with a 10th level wizard even if he doesn't put any points in the skill just due to the fact that he is a 10th level wizard. Also as one gets to higher levels the DCs will also increase as well. Sure a 30th level fighter might have a Theivery of +15 but he will be facing locks and traps that have a DC of 40 or higher.

[Magister Lajciak]

Also as one gets to higher levels the DCs will also increase as well. Sure a 30th level fighter might have a Theivery of +15 but he will be facing locks and traps that have a DC of 40 or higher.

 

A rogue can only become trained/skill focused in the thievery skill giving him a +5/+10 as compared to the wizard, which means that DCs of 40 or higher are going to be very rare even at 30th level. Besides, that is not really an excuse for giving wizard a +15 in the thievery skill absolutely scot free, as depending on one's gamestyle, they might still face more mundane locks more or less often. For me, this is almost a dealbreaker issue as far as 4E goes and though not quite a dealbreaker in itself, in combination with other near-dealbreakers...

[Rostere]

Honestly, D&D 4 seems to me like D&D: Uwe Boll Edition... But that's just after a brief look at the manuals. I'm looking forward to 4e Forgotten Realms with mixed feelings (to say the least!), though.

[Gfted1]

[explicit per encounter powers I am looking at you

 

 

Ive got a kinda silly question, what constitutes an "encounter"? So lets say your party is strolling through the woods when 3 kobalts jump you. You blow off your "once per encounter" power and your party is victorious! One minute later a kobalt with a bum leg who was bringing up the rear reaches your party, is this considered a "new encounter" and thus you can use your power again?

[Sand]

If the party took a short rest then no, it wouldn't be the same encounter. If they just drudged on, then technically, yes it would be the same encounter. A short rest is basically a 5 minute breather before moving on.

[I want teh kotor 3]

I really like 4E, except for how they handle epic levels... oh well, at least we now have MAGIC ITEMS IN THE PLAYER'S HANDBOOK!! Tokk bloody well long enough.

[Joseph Bulock]

[explicit per encounter powers I am looking at you

 

 

Ive got a kinda silly question, what constitutes an "encounter"? So lets say your party is strolling through the woods when 3 kobalts jump you. You blow off your "once per encounter" power and your party is victorious! One minute later a kobalt with a bum leg who was bringing up the rear reaches your party, is this considered a "new encounter" and thus you can use your power again?

 

If it really jumped you a minute later, that's the same encounter. Five minute rests restores all encounter powers and allows the party to use any amount of healing surges.