Okay, here's the premise: whether you agreed with the faction idea or not, you put aside that argument and assume that the design team has announced that alien factions will be in the game. How would you make it work?

 

I suggest this. We never know exaclty what the faction are. The only way we know the aliens have factions is evidence we discover during gameplay. Maybe there are signs of battle. There could be a cutscene that forshadows something that looks like a dispute between aliens. Maybe we shouldn't question the factions idea so much as figure out how it will play during the game.

I do like what they did with red vs black in the comics for the Earth War. The aliens are fighting against a slightly mutated strain.

 

I think a great idea would be to use it as a red herring. Someone finds out about it, everyone proclaims it will be "THE WAY TO DEFEAT THEM!" but the plan falls completely on its ass and only makes things worse. It might even make for a possible escalation mechanic. The aliens are occupied early on, which makes it "safer" for them, but eventually the blacks (always bet on black) win out and can focus full attention on the humans.

 

We don't need to find out about any politics or even have a suggestion of political motivations. And neither queen should be percieved as less about killing/impregnating humans than the other.

The option to believe that there are Alien factions and attempt to exploit their supposed differences should be one that's available to the player, and one which has consequences for her relationship with other humans and human factions (if not necessarily with the aliens themselves).

Yes.

Unfortunately it's still a silly idea

Please explain what you think is silly about it.

Ugh. Even if it's silly, how would we implement it? If you think the factions idea is silly, how would you make it less so? The question isn't whether or not it's silly. It's how you would do it.

The option to believe that there are Alien factions and attempt to exploit their supposed differences should be one that's available to the player, and one which has consequences for her relationship with other humans and human factions (if not necessarily with the aliens themselves).

Unless the player character is in charge from the beginning, he'll need to make the transition to being in a position to make decisions. I'd have the player character just following orders, but after the immense screw up he gets the opportunity to lead!

 

Ripley wasn't always in charge, either. In Alien it wasn't until Dallas's death, Aliens it took Gorman's screwup for her to take charge, Alien3 it took the warden's death for her to be in control, and in Alien: Ressurection... well, she just started off as a badass there.

 

That's a not uncommon device in stories for promoting the main character. He or she starts off relatively low on the totem, but after a tragedy gets the opportunity to step up and show what he or she is really capable of.

Edited June 21, 200718 yr by Tale

More likely a dispute between xenomorphs might be (wrongly) interpreted as a mechanism for ultimate victory over them, when in fact it is just the reason why all the xenomorphs haven't attacked in formation and totally destroyed the otherwise puny and insignificant human settlement until later in the narrative.

zzZZzz

Yeah, we're all factioned out.

I'm struggling to understand why you created a duplicate topic to my original (still visible on the first page of the forum), only to post on the first page of it that you were flummoxed and completely bereft (see, I was kind and didn't say devoid) of innovation. In a forum specifically designed AND NAMED for speculation.

I'm not speculating, I'm fantasizing.

Just so long as you clean up afterwards.

My original thought was that we approached your idea in the wrong way. I thought to myself, perhaps I've been overly critical because I looked at the idea as a question of whether or not there should be factions. We'd gotten into a routine of arguing for or against factions in your thread. However, maybe the question woudl be different if we didn't have to choose one side or the other at the outset. If the question were, "how could you make it work?" then some folks who don't like the idea might warm to it as they plotted through the variouis steps necessary to create viable factions or make then work in an actual CRPG. If you ask me if there should be factions, I'm still going to say no. I don't like the idea. However, if you show me how the design team might make use of factions, maybe give me an example of what how I would see factions in the game, then I might change my view of factions. In the case of an either/or question, I'm going to look at the idea on its face and make a decision. If you involve me a discussion of how it might work - not only generally speaking, but in what way I would personally do it - then my position is not nearly as entrenched.

 

I guess the biggest question is what's the goal of the game. If it's a big bug hunt, then factions could be used as a direct part of gameplay. If the story is more like the first Aliens, then factions can serve as a tool to build mystery and suspense.

 

If the game is primarily an action title, then the opportunity is greater. Anything from a three way fight between Alien factions and humans up to and including trying to get the Aliens to fight each other. An action title is going to entail a lot more fighting against Aliens in the first place. Having killed some 30 Aliens to reach level 5 will inure the characters to them anyhow. The only way to go from there is to find bigger, meaner, and more powerful Aliens. If that's the case, then I don't see what the game loses by introducing a factions idea. It's just a 1980's DnD module where the Aliens are orcs. Put in a few humanoid races and we've got elves, dwarves, and halflings. It will be Star Trek.

 

If the game is a horror title, then factions could come into play as a way to build suspense and provide breaks in the action. I mentioned a cut-scene that helped build the suspense. Let's just say, assuming it's a horror title, that the player managed to find a place to hide just as the Aliens had him cornered. He's looking out from the grate in the air vent (hahaha) and sees the group of Aliens who were chasing him. It looks like they might root out his hidey-hole and he's thinking he's going to have to find some other place to run. Then, as the Aliens are looking around, another group of Aliens runs into the scene. The first group stops what they're doing and faces the second group. A moment passes. One of the Aliens in the first group gives one of those Alien "screams" and then the first group goes away. After a moment, the second group goes away.

 

That might not be a great example, but it's kind of what I was going for.

 

Finally, I didn't mean to insult you, meta. I felt bad for completely bashing your factions idea in you thread and thought that maybe it might be nice to look at a fresh approach. I won't be offended, since there's really very little in it anyhow, if you lock or delete this thread. You could even delete some of the posts and then just merge it into yours. Hell, merge it and then edit my remarks in this post regarding the thread and it will all look like it was in your thread all along. I might have foolishly gone about this the wrong way, but I didn't intend any slight. I mean, I call you names all the time, but that's just me being goofy. :Cant's being goofy icon:

My original thought was that we approached your idea in the wrong way. I thought to myself, perhaps I've been overly critical because I looked at the idea as a question of whether or not there should be factions. We'd gotten into a routine of arguing for or against factions in your thread. However, maybe the question woudl be different if we didn't have to choose one side or the other at the outset. If the question were, "how could you make it work?" then some folks who don't like the idea might warm to it as they plotted through the variouis steps necessary to create viable factions or make then work in an actual CRPG. If you ask me if there should be factions, I'm still going to say no. I don't like the idea. However, if you show me how the design team might make use of factions, maybe give me an example of what how I would see factions in the game, then I might change my view of factions. In the case of an either/or question, I'm going to look at the idea on its face and make a decision. If you involve me a discussion of how it might work - not only generally speaking, but in what way I would personally do it - then my position is not nearly as entrenched.

Cant's right. We've been going about it all wrong. Maybe this is an opportunity for an inter-faction romance story, but the factions the two star-crossed lovers are from hate each other, like Romeo and Juliet in space.

Edited June 22, 200718 yr by Blank

Okay, cross Alien factions or Alien/human one on one or what?

Two alien lovers. A queen of one hive is in love with a facehugger from the other, but the other queen won't allow it and the queen that's in love knows her drones will turn against her if they knew about it. Oh, the heartbreak.

Edited June 22, 200718 yr by Tale

My original thought was that we approached your idea in the wrong way. I thought to myself, perhaps I've been overly critical because I looked at the idea as a question of whether or not there should be factions. We'd gotten into a routine of arguing for or against factions in your thread. However, maybe the question woudl be different if we didn't have to choose one side or the other at the outset. If the question were, "how could you make it work?" then some folks who don't like the idea might warm to it as they plotted through the variouis steps necessary to create viable factions or make then work in an actual CRPG. If you ask me if there should be factions, I'm still going to say no. I don't like the idea. However, if you show me how the design team might make use of factions, maybe give me an example of what how I would see factions in the game, then I might change my view of factions. In the case of an either/or question, I'm going to look at the idea on its face and make a decision. If you involve me a discussion of how it might work - not only generally speaking, but in what way I would personally do it - then my position is not nearly as entrenched.

Well, if you're going to be all nice about it, I can't really maintain a belligerent stance.

I guess the biggest question is what's the goal of the game. If it's a big bug hunt, then factions could be used as a direct part of gameplay. If the story is more like the first Aliens, then factions can serve as a tool to build mystery and suspense.

 

If the game is primarily an action title, then the opportunity is greater. Anything from a three way fight between Alien factions and humans up to and including trying to get the Aliens to fight each other. An action title is going to entail a lot more fighting against Aliens in the first place. Having killed some 30 Aliens to reach level 5 will inure the characters to them anyhow. The only way to go from there is to find bigger, meaner, and more powerful Aliens. If that's the case, then I don't see what the game loses by introducing a factions idea. It's just a 1980's DnD module where the Aliens are orcs. Put in a few humanoid races and we've got elves, dwarves, and halflings. It will be Star Trek.

 

If the game is a horror title, then factions could come into play as a way to build suspense and provide breaks in the action. I mentioned a cut-scene that helped build the suspense. Let's just say, assuming it's a horror title, that the player managed to find a place to hide just as the Aliens had him cornered. He's looking out from the grate in the air vent (hahaha) and sees the group of Aliens who were chasing him. It looks like they might root out his hidey-hole and he's thinking he's going to have to find some other place to run. Then, as the Aliens are looking around, another group of Aliens runs into the scene. The first group stops what they're doing and faces the second group. A moment passes. One of the Aliens in the first group gives one of those Alien "screams" and then the first group goes away. After a moment, the second group goes away.

That's how I expect it to be, at least initially.

 

An alien is almost completely beyond the powers of a human to kill (or even maim); the only threat to such a powerful creature is another one. So it makes sense to have other xenomorphs in the game allied to different goals (realistically another queen/colony).

 

This has benefits for narrative (PC about to die, cornered by xenomorphs, until the chasers are attacked and distracted ... this would be likely because humans would be beneath the notice of xenomorphs, kinda like if two groups of soldiers from different armies chanced upon the same game animals whilst out looking for food in the New France of the eighteenth century: the elk would get away whilst the humans fought).

That might not be a great example, but it's kind of what I was going for.

 

Finally, I didn't mean to insult you, meta. I felt bad for completely bashing your factions idea in you thread and thought that maybe it might be nice to look at a fresh approach. I won't be offended, since there's really very little in it anyhow, if you lock or delete this thread. You could even delete some of the posts and then just merge it into yours. Hell, merge it and then edit my remarks in this post regarding the thread and it will all look like it was in your thread all along. I might have foolishly gone about this the wrong way, but I didn't intend any slight. I mean, I call you names all the time, but that's just me being goofy. :Cant's being goofy icon:

Now that would be an abuse of moderator power and display my inability to interact in a conversation (heated or otherwise) with other members.

 

Anyway, I wasn't upset / injured / insulted, I was just curious as to why to duplicated the subject matter.

I would like to see a 'faction war' between two alien queens and their siblings/hives

Maybe we could have two factions of aliens fighting each other over oil.

 

I haven't read much of this thread or any of the other, but I'd imagine that at least 2 sides of aliens will be in the game. It just makes sense. To have a single black and white enemy is just too boring, even if you add in shady corporate dealings from human corporations or military. I don't think two warring alien factions would or should be the centrepiece for the game, though.

 

You need only look to life on Earth to see that a single unified group or force in ANY species is extremely rare... I think Alien ecology should be a part of the game, and warring factions are a simple way to illuminate this.