I don't know if you just ignored it so you could have an excuse to write another self-masturbatory reply or am just too oblivious to see it, but I did take it as a whole.

 

As for your supposed... arguements... against what I said, I would like to present the fact that not all goths like poetry (my brother is a goth and he hates poetry), not all goths like vulgar sex crap (especially girls), not all goths know about Nietzsche (I've explained it to several) and I even know a goth who recognizes the fact that he's just as much a conformist tool as Trendy McPopcollar, but just likes the attention. The way you just pointed out that stereotypes do not apply conveniently ignores that the same thing works for goths.

 

Of course, nobody needed me to point that out. Everybody can see that you do nothing but undermine your own arguements simply by reading your posts. I guess that means you need to take another look at "Posting... And You!"

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Once again, duh. Of course not all goths follow a pattern set in stone. But there are lot of characteristics that, when they compliment each other, make up the group. But if you viewed them all as a whole, why did you then say I basically just described every emo, hiptser, geek, indie, and literary professor in the country, when that's clearly not the case? You basically stereotyped about four different groups right there and contradicted the point you were just trying to make in the process. Enlighten me, please. Or at least word your posts a little more carefully.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Mothman

Fine. If I edit that post and turn 'every [insert group here]' into 'half the [insert group here]', will you be happy? Either way, it doesn't matter. Straying away from the actual discussion because of semantics is one tactic to save face that won't work here. Besides, what you say I'm guilty of is what you did to start this discussion, so you're basically pointing out the delicious irony and futility of your previous posts.

It's a subculture, Mothman, you're both missing the qualities that truly make them band together and adding characteristics typical to the so-called intellectual. Goth crowds are not intellectual breeding grounds, far from it, they're, most of the time, scared little kids with little self-confidence and even lesser maturity, they're afraid, that's what they are, afraid of the big bad world that awaits outside their bedroom window. You're forgetting the desire to shock, the social immaturity, the lack of self-respect. It's just a bad argument overall.

 

Reply to my last post on the other page.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Baley

Let us not forget the post that started this clash of the titans.

 

lol making goths angry is 1 of my favourite hobbies

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Uh-huh.

 

I think it's high time you gentlemen remove your humongous e-penises from this thread and be satisfied with whatever cultural group you decide to bemember yourselves. It's not relevant, nor fruitful to discuss semantics on a thread which is labeled "Favorite Metal Bands".

 

I give you probs for not deciding to delve into the everwaging fight of genres, however.

 

Edit: Borknagar kills, by the by.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Musopticon?

I hate it when the voice of reason trumps a good discussion.

Blending Hardcore Punk and Heavy Metal was a good idea...20 years ago when Napalm Death did it.

 

Metalcore sucks.

Well, naturally. According to every man and woman who worships 'tr00 m3t4l \m/:thumbsup:\m/' I have ever spoken with, Metalcore is the natural successor of N

It's about sucking corporate **** and being all mainstream and **** like that.

 

Note: I'm being facetious and purposely contrarian, let's have some fun, it's a slow Monday.

Sounds like a good way to spend a Monday.

Well, that's all well and good, but why does corporate **** need to be sucked all the time by making terrible music?

Right on, dude! Rock on! Tr00 Norwegian Black Metal only!

 

I was planning on taking a shower and watching a Bergman, but I seem to be lacking the necessary willpower.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Baley

It is and it isn't. There are two types of Goths, the old ones and the teenagers, different demographics, different tastes.

Maybe, maybe not. Vast majority of goths which I have encountered listen to many of the same things you do, including the metal/death metal variety, both old school and new school, while sometimes balancing it out with some other styles. Yes, I have met a couple goths who listen to Johnny Cash, but that's as close to country as they've ever come.

 

 

Most Goths tend to consider themselves "spiritual but not religious", you'll meet very few philosophical nihilists, in the atheist goth camp you're more likely to meet philosophical satanists, as it is a more angsty outlook on life.

 

Goths pose as being non-conformist, there's a difference.

It depends. Some share views similar to nihilism, while not branding themselves as nihilists. There are plenty of atheist goths who have a philosphically satanic mentality, as you also do, at least in some respects.

 

Yes.

Yes.

 

False, Goths as a subculture are hardly well-read, unless you consider memorising Anne Rice books a high interest.

It varies. Some tend to be very well read, others are not. At least from what I've encountered, it tends to be half and half.

 

 

True, but it's more of a faux-obsession, a desire to fit in.

It can be both genuine and faux. Some I know have a genuine obsession, others don't. But usually that theme tends to be pretty pervasive characteristic.

 

Repeated vulgar sexual references are hardly a Goth literature characteristic. Except for that, true. It's more to do with the desire to shock the reader. But Goths would more likely use obtusely verbose language. (My work wishes to amuse the reader, there's a difference)

 

In my experience, the whole sexuality thing has often been a compliment to all the violence and depression. And I disagree, many goths which I have encountered tend not to be verbose in their writing. (Ex. Gabrielle) Or maybe you and I have just met radically different goths in our lifetime.

 

Utter nonsense, Goths are as familiar with Nietzsche as I am with a good ****. They might know something about him, I suppose (his name most likely, or that famous quote), but that's where it ends.

Okay, I'll give you that one. But actually what I should have said was that many seem to share views similar to his. But if you claim you don't, then fine.

 

That's all I'll say since we're now derailing the thread, as Muso pointed out.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Mothman

Studies have long proved the link between corporate ****-sucking and inane music. **** sucking under other circumstances, on the other hand, has shown to be musically productive.

Mmm. Inane music, corporate sell-outs and ****-sucking. Smells Like Nirvana.

 

EDIT: Another band I had neglected to mention - Arch Enemy FTW.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by TrueNeutral

Maybe, maybe not.  Vast majority of goths which I have encountered listen to many of the same things you do, including the metal/death metal variety, both old school and new school, while sometimes balancing it out with some other styles.  Yes, I have met a couple goths who listen to Johnny Cash, but that's as close to country as they've ever come. 

 

There are two reasons for that:

 

1. Johnny Cash is awesome.

 

2. Modern Country music is perhaps the most jingoistic, nationalistic, proto-fascist junk I've ever heard. It's just pop music with guitars and southern accents.

 

That being said, the Alt-Country movement is still going strong and my faux-**** is still wet.

 

And if you were to say that I mostly listen to Metal, well, then you'd be a gigantic ignoramus who'd definitely have to expand his musical horizons.

 

It depends.  Some share views similar to nihilism, while not branding themselves as nihilists.  There are plenty of atheist goths who have a philosphically satanic mentality, as you also do, at least in some respects. 

 

I don't have a satanist mentally, I have a hedonist mentality. Better left for a more profound discussion some other night.

 

 

 

It varies.  Some tend to be very well read, others are not.  At least from what I've encountered, it tends to be half and half. 

 

Maybe you live in Well-Read R Us, Alaska. I'd say that 3% of the world's populace are well read, a rate of 50% among Goths would be perplexing.

 

 

In my experience, the whole sexuality thing has often been a compliment to all the violence and depression.  And I disagree, many goths which I have encountered tend not to be verbose in their writing.  (Ex. Gabrielle)  Or maybe you and I have just met radically different goths in our lifetime. 

 

I meant a literary verbose writing style.

 

Okay, I'll give you that one.  But actually what I should have said was that many seem to share views similar to his.  But if you claim you don't, then fine. 

 

You need to read more Nietzsche. It's funny, from what I can grasp, he seemed to have believed that beautiful people are literally better.

Edited April 17, 200619 yr by Baley

Botch

Horse the Band

Jesu

Kaospilot

Pelican

Sincebyman

The Red Chord

Welcome the Plague Year

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Edited April 18, 200619 yr by Kitch

MOT

Edited April 18, 200619 yr by Powerslave

The following are my 3 favourite metal bands, they are awesome:

 

Rammstein

Turmion Katilot

Megaherz

 

All of these are in the industrial metal genre.

 

I also recommend Brujeria, Nightwish, Apocalyptica(metal played entirely with cellos, although recent albums have drums), Slipknot, Korn, Mudvayne and Disturbed.

Turmion Katilot

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- Emperor

- Mayhem

- Burzum

- Dark Funeral

- Opeth

- Slayer

- Necrophagist

- Morbid Angel

- Meshuggah

- Metallica (Kill 'Em All -> Black Album)

 

 

...and Baley's right. Finntroll are fun. Excellent drinking music

Edited April 19, 200619 yr by Meshugger

Finntroll? No no, excellent moshing music.

- Dark Funeral

- Opeth

- Slayer

- Morbid Angel

- Metallica (Kill 'Em All -> Black Album)

 

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Excellent choice.

anyone mention Kalmah?

Turmion Katilot

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Turmion Katilot is awesome. I assume youve heard of them, being from Finland?

 

I listen to another band called Ruoska as well, but they are nowhere near as good as TK.

Edited April 19, 200619 yr by roshan

Turmion Katilot

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Turmion Katilot is awesome. I assume youve heard of them, being from Finland?

 

I listen to another band called Ruoska as well, but they are nowhere near as good as TK.

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Roshan u said rock was horrid on my page and yet here u are talking about finnish metal bands

Edited April 20, 200619 yr by Visas Marr is hot