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KoToR 3: Ideas and Suggestions

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How about Non-essential NPC's? That way you can let them rot in the cargo hold, and you won't have to worry about missing out on what the heck happened on M5, or where Revan went, etc. I mean, sure, have side-stories and quests, but don't make them essential to progress, or make them Jedi, etc. You should be able to ditch them at one point, too... Like a combo of BG and NWN style...

Geekified Star Wars Geek


Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force


"Only a Sith deals in absolutes!"

-Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom)


"The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."

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How about Non-essential NPC's? That way you can let them rot in the cargo hold, and you won't have to worry about missing out on what the heck happened on M5, or where Revan went, etc. I mean, sure, have side-stories and quests, but don't make them essential to progress, or make them Jedi, etc. You should be able to ditch them at one point, too... Like a combo of BG and NWN style...


I agree, "essential" storyline info should come through cutscreens primarily. However, I see nothing wrong with having 2 party members that you KNOW you need to talk to get main storyline info. In KOTOR I, this was Bastila and Carth. In KOTOR II, it was

Kreia and Atton



But there should only be about 2 that you absolutely must keep on your ship. Feel free to let the others go and bring on others that are more to your liking. And these others should be all about non-essential sidequests.

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- The finess feats shouldn't exist. The dexterity modifier should ALWAYS be the one added to calculate hits, either

with melee or ranged weapons.

Since I think this point is going to cause much debate, I'll try to explain why I think that addind the strength

modifier (in melee) is a mistake.


Example: A guy has 4 times my strength. I have 4 times the dexterity he has with a blade. If we fight unarmed,

his strength will matter, yes, BUT, if we fight with blades I'll cut him open even before he has a chance to

use his superior strenght in his blows.


- Much more upgradable Jedi robes

- different saber hilts

- much more color crystals (gray metal, brown, dark blue, white, black)

- different fighting moves when using different styles

- Possibility of constructing lightsabers, sowrds, vibroblades, rifles

- There should be a toggle option allowing us to show or hide on the screen all the "buff" powers that are

afecting the character at that moment (wether he's in a fight or not)

- Possibility of seeing the influence VALUE the main character has with the others

- Possibility of buying our swoop bike and it's upgrades

- Add more wildcards to Pazzak

- Possibility of constructing belts that have special abilities (like a belt that makes you immune to

electrical, or fire, or cold or sonic)



Well, I completely agree with your reasoning, but I doubt it's going to happen. Star Wars RPGs are stuck in d20 rules by virtue of business deals between Lucasarts and Wizards of the Coast (who publish the tabletop RPG), so that's probably that. Indeed, it might even be that the finesse feats were forcibly introduced in KotOR2 despite excelling with their absense in KotOR1 because their removal was a potential infraction of the d20 rules. I should hasten to say that I don't know that all, but it is possible.


In fact, the whole Two-handed/Double-bladed vs. Single-handed weapon thing needs a major overhaul. It's a popular myth to think that having a second weapon in your "off" hand (or a double-weapon utilizing both) will allow you more attacks, but anyone who has bothered to simply watch the Obi-Wan vs. Darth Maul fight in Episode I know it's just a myth. Yes, using double/multiple weapons have advantages, but they sure don't double your attack rate - anyone thinking it would should try making a few mock attacks with wooden swords or similar, because they'll find that it's actually really hard to coordinate those attacks without the swords hitting each other, let alone accidentally striking yourself (which is ill adviced with a lightsaber...).


As you might figure from my reply, I don't like the d20 system much. In fact, I outright hate it - worst thing to happen to RPGs in a decade IMO :lol:


I'd take WEG's Star Wars system any day of the week over WOTC's forced and inflexible classes and levels, or even better a Star Wars system based on the GURPS rules. But... it's not going to happen.


I play KotOR games because I like the drama and character depth. I *don't* play because of the d20 rules! I play in *spite* of the d20 rules! I don't enjoy the d20 rules so much as I endure them... and it's not always easy :shifty:

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and what's all that bull**** mean? I already knew Kreias plan, but like I said, for her own ****ING mouth, she wished to get all her enemies out in the open so they could be destroyed.


Yes, but note that this is exactly what she said - her enemies. We learn those included the Sith (which may be presumed to be Sion and Nihilus) and the Dantooine Jedi council (Dorak, Kavar, Zez-Kai-Ell). Kreia did *NOT* however say that it included any and all Jedi!!


You seem to be proceeding on the basis that she did mean that, but there is no basis for that conclusion - it is unsupported by the events of KotOR2, so whoever writes the plot for KotOR3 can presume pretty much whatever he or she wants to. Sure, Kreia wanted the jedi council dead, but that doesn't matter since she's already killed them. Therefore it is a non-factor in the continuing plot.



And um, lightside might be canon, but the events on lightside might not be cannon. Therefore not all the party members might have become Jedi, and also just becuase Mical or Handmaiden, MIGHT, become great Jedi and sit on councils doesn't mean one DAMN thing in KOTOR 3. There aren't going to be any councils or orders in KOTOR 3, perhaps afterwards, but not during.


I strikes me as rather odd that you first state correctly that endings of KotOR2 cannot be presumed to have taken place and then proceed to automatically presume the opposite. No, those events need not have taken place, but they can have - it depends completely on whatever the writers of the next chapter prefer. Indeed, having them not be jedi would be the greater sin, because meeting a non-jedi Atton after you made him into a jedi in the last game will have people protesting, while meeting a jedi Atton after you decided not to train can be simply overruled with a comment saying that "oh, but Visas trained him after the events of the last game" or similar.


If they prefer to have all the KotOR2 companions be jedi now, then they can do that, even if they were never trained by the Exile - they can just assume that Mira, Atton, Bao-Dur, Handmaiden/Disciple were either trained by the Exile before he/she left for the unknown reasons or else that they were trained afterwards by Visas. Poof - instant multiple jedi.


Besides, we *know* that the companions have the potential because you could indeed train them. I dare say that if the KotOR2 companions make any sort of appearance in KotOR3, then it's more likely to be as jedi than anything else, since they can either have been trained by the Exile in the last game or by Visas after that. That covers more possibilities than the scenario you seem to suggest. You might not like it, but there is no doubt it covers more potentiality.


Also, when you reject the mere possibilty of any sort of council, I think you're overinterpreting the ending of KotOR2 to unfounded extremes. If KotOR3 is set, say, 10 years after KotOR2, then surely there will be a council in some form. I would agree that we cannot assume much of anything in KotOR3, though, but then that's just the point - since we just don't know, your presumption of there being no council is just as unfounded as anything else.


I also think a lot of this discussion has overlooked the students. A lot of masters and padawans may have died on Katarr, but I dare say they would not have brought the students - the young children still learning the basics of the force - to a meeting where the decision to fight the Sith is being decided. It is far more likely that those young students stayed home on Coruscant with their teachers and continued their training. Those students could certainly form the foundation of a new emerging jedi order.


Indeed, I have this feeling that KotOR3 is set a few years after KotOR2 and that the new main character is one of these young students becoming a padawn learner during the beginning of the game. I could see the genders and alignments of both Revan and the Exile being set by the student taking lessons in jedi history early in the game under Brianna...

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Jesus Christ Guys, give devs a break! Actually, how do you say jesus plural...






My first post here, but don't leave me without credit, I worked on the coding for Galaxies, and no, do ask about it, I ain't telling (you would like to know, it does rock)


First off, if you read the interview, he said he would not do another Strikes Back ending even if the alternative were being thrown into a Salraac MADE of molten Carbonite. So where does that leave the Devs? With a layout that must be similar to teh plot destructions and revivals in Return of the Jedi.


here are some scripting ideas, and i will be posting 4 threads soon, one for direct action ideas that are good (i.e. specific suggestions for KOTOR 3), commentary (review and explanation of said suggestions), critizing of ideas (for when we need a laugh, please if you have anything that is similar to flaming, we need a dedicated flaming post, all forums do (yes this will be pure flaming, force flaming, taring and feathering, food throwing, and best of all, napalm), and then a Sticky(hopefully) with links to the 3




at the begining, before character creation, you start as Revan, titled as such, in the sith empire, master feats, the whole 9 yards of the Foot-to-Posterior style, you fight a few dudes, learn bout force, and can't access menu (pause with white button only on xbox, but no items switching, this will be like using an axe to cut butter, purposeful overkill) you then meet an NPC, Pivitol, but you don't know that, he asks about you, you answer the ending of Kotor's 1, telling of Revan as light or dark, Bastila, Juhani, Carth, everyone from kotor 1 that you could kill or usurp, or screw with or love, and whether you are a dude, or gal, adn you class/prestige


following this you get the tar kicked out of you in a cutscene


next, you are transfered to a similarly god like exile, full robes like revan, so no sex definition yet, you are approached by the same NPC, robes up and all, asked questions about the fate of everyone from KOTOR 2, deaths, light, Dark, etc. answer about ending, and then light/dark, then male/female, and class/prestige; promptly to be cut down in a cut scene


Now after doing this, you go to character generation, and depending on who died/lived form kotor 1 and 2, you start outside a ship that has just landed on...




Mandalore has gone to Coruscant to Find you as the final Biding of Kreia before she left, she knew the order would be reforged, and whichever order that would be re-<i>forged</i> (hint hint, Rakata copycats!) and you would be key to it coming around. the star map ruins are here BTW. now you see mandalorians at every possible choke point, securiety point, door, and landing pad (hint* not just the corellian yt-700 Ebon hawk we know and love, also maybe a yt-1100 "outrider" prototype Dash rendar style) as you are cutscene walking to the enclave, mandalorians kowtowing and kissing butt like crazy to mandalore, he tells you that the mandalorians we again impressed upon by the battle of telos upon the ravager, and that all the jedi characters (Bindo not included, but you do see a construction site, that looks like it is near complete, but no equipment... odd.) came here and uninted to rebuild the order, or should they be darksided, Mira, handmaiden, and hranharr (d@m^ you mira, why didn't you finish the beastie off, he still ends up dark, no matter what you say) along with a kreia style revival, atris (dark as can be, but you don't learn this yet) rebuilt the korriban, telos, and yavin darkside places, should mira be light, she is to be replaced by a named char. a new one., and handmaiden, will always fall to darkness, and juhani could be Dark TBD, the rest were light to begin with or were reformed by a boy who seemed familiar but they did not know


Mandalore has joind with the jedi because they are to be respected and learned from, and they need protection by non-force sensitive wariors of the highest quality, arrogant mandalorian, so the gaurd the jedi, and with the remaning "sith" assasins, there has been plenty enough action for them, and they are uninted with the jedi. now he shows you into...




wow, it is thriving, and twice it's twice the size of when you last saw it, two floors above, and below, and below... (star map, fully repaired) you see rakata "healers" who "healed" the enclave and now use the force to build things, and are part of the jedi, refraining from missions b/c of darkside tendancies


NOTE: most of the aforementioned ideas that can be written on load scenes and random speaking by npcs, should be to save and shave DEV time.


you see a council, that has been waiting for you, atton is arguing with visas, that mandalore couldn't be back yet, that hyperspace doesn't work that fast, still defiant to the last he is. on the council is a old old old bindo meditating, he says "how the work going on the final bed for my coprate form?"


"Aggravated Reply: Sir it is on schedule, for the 20th time today. Why must meatbags care so about a container to house themselves in their decomposing state of life? :Sigh: You say you will stay after you are burried, but I have never seen a Meatbag retain a sentient state without a Meatbag to house their memory core and actuators."


(w00t) WOOT WOOT WOOT (w00t)


now visas tells you that those assembled here, atton, her, Carth's son- who uninted them, and all the other jedi from the previous games. after a buncha' yammering about the force and stuff, and how some are losing connections seemingly without reason, she sends you on a recruiting mission to help strengthen the order (you couls send em all to the sith on korriban) so you are off to tatooine, kashyyykk, onderon/duxn, and finally Telos dark Academy


BUT, before you leave, there are some initiates here, and they wish to learn the ways of the force, you know some, but not much more that required, yet still enough, to take on a padawan, there will be 6 choices, consular, sentinel, and gaurdian, to choose from, male and female- these two gain a prestige class as well as you


after you have recruited the force sensitives (and picking up a following) now Carth's kid, and mission are friends and have developed a force bond, but they sense that there are people using dark true sith sorcery, and you are sent to... nar shadaa, manaan, the colonization of taris by rakata (two planets, but small ones), and finally... korriban


after koriban, you are full up on party, minus a daksider, minus 2, you go to the enclave, and are shipped off to yavin 4 along with the combined jedi/mandalorian strikeforce to find the source, you don't find exar kun, but you do find many sith, including naga sadows starship, which you need to get a route to sith space from


you could after the first visas mission, have sent all the recruits to the sith on korriban, in which case your last mission will be "cleansing" the enclave, the mandalorians side with the most powerful, and if you persuade canderous that you side is the way to go you take hims and his army to yavin.


after yavin (and recovering your darkside convert/ lightside convert that was spying) you say,

"jedi have gone alone before us, we go together, the mandalorians will follow." you got to scout the sith empire, and there are 3 planets, you can return to yavin on your sadow ship (reforged by rakata) at anytime to use the epon hawk in republic space. on each planet is a factor and a city, you must scout them, and find their weakness, kill sith leaders in the city, and call in the mandalorians to blow the factories to kingdom come, you also encouner revan and the exile upon landing, and you end up having two parties at most times, revan, you, yer padawan (quite powerful by now, though s/he may want to learn form revan or the exile), and the exile, doing ****, after this, it is off the the third planet, which has an academy, not a factory, and then to the sith throne, the 3rd planet/throne are comparable to ravager/malachor or unknown world/starforge, yes light siders finally get there chance at mass destruction, and you blow it to kingdom come, and back should you wish.


comments? :p :ph34r: :oo:):wub::p (w00t) (w00t) (w00t)


edit: yes I know the dark side needs more, i like the more saber ideas, btu how is this for plot? comments? please?


also to obsidian- i would love to do consulting adn freelance work for the storyline of kotor3


don't think about saying you aren't gonna make one, with that ending, you might get a big backlash if a third aint made

Eagles may soar...

but Rabbits don't get sucked into Jet Engines


Kinda long... funny, and we do consignment programing


One Ring to Rule them all

One Ring to draw them

One Ring to code them all

The last in the coffe spill edits them...


We are the Elite four, we went to high school together, and code games together, I rule them all (Writer/Designer/Director)

-Big Phil (calls Yao ming short, for good reason...) Draws thelevels and basic area coding

-Manu codes our AI, called latte, not for his skin, but he never stops fidgiting

-August edits our code, still has coffe in his class/company ring, and puts so much spit & polish on our stuff, his spit would flood the whole of Mars

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