Startling Facts about the Bush administration...

[Product of the Cosmos]

I deleted the previous thread. It is in no way the mods fault(although I do agree these boards are being over modded in general, but like phosphor pointed out to me these are a company forum, and they have interests to keep it somewhat civil here, like any reasonable company would want).

 

"just because PoTC claims proof of criminal activity does not make it so. likewise, the mere existence of such evidence is not to be trusted without verification."

 

Your right, if I was just claiming these things it wouldn't mean anything. But since 100% of what I posted in this thread is known fact. That does not apply to this post(your quote applies to my theories on DNA though of course).

 

"all of these links to past employment tells an even better story, btw... maybe these people are the ones that actually have EXPERIENCE dealing with such ventures? huh? maybe?"

 

Experience and motive. All the companies his regime have worked for are implicated or convicted in crimes while the regime's people were in management.

 

As well as selling weapons, and capabilities of WMD's to the same people they claim are the "axis of evil"! Is this not startling to you? Or do you claim their reports to the IRS of income is false too?

 

"nearly every politician has a link to some corporate past interest. nothing to see here folks..."

 

LOL! You seriously just gave me a HUGE laugh. Nothing to see here folks, just proof that the administration has contridicted the very arguements of the campaigning and current presidents big claim of the "axis of evil" by contributing to selling them weapons and weapons capabilities... Wait, that is pretty big. I guess you don't want people to see what's here. lol.

 

"one could also provide an argument that the pope is the current coming of the anti-christ.

 

Yep. But, no one is doing that. You post irrelevant conjecture to political threads often taks. Try contributing a real debate for once... Just a thought.

 

"if there were any proof here, you would have already heard about it. It's not worth anyone's time to bother with it."

 

Nice arguement.. If there were any proof you would have heard about it? lol. You have quite a lot of confidence in motive corporately owned US media. I don't. One must look into things fruether if they want to find facts that are not mentioned in either the 'labeled' media here.

 

"I stopped taking it seriously the second PotC said that he had been "investigating" this matter in-depth. This is all obviously copied and pasted off of some site or some forum"

 

You always say that. lol. You might as well put "this is all just copied and pasted" in yoru sig. It would save you some time. But I did copy paste some of the stuff. I didn't see the point of writing it down after it's in front of me anyway.

 

And the poin of this thread is not PoTC is a political genius. Its the facts I provided. Who cares if I copy/pasted them if they are accurate!

 

"there's always hope he'll learn the concept of truly objective analysis. a practice not necessarily enabled by the internet. there's too much information there, much of it suspect."

 

Funny. You maybe should learn on your objective analysis yourself. How about reading the post instead of seeing the posters name and making a judgement.

 

"hardly. his little essay is stamped as lacking in objectivity simply because of his history. PoTC regularly cuts-and-pastes data from suspect/agenda-driven websites and touts "proof" without any verification. further, i think i've pointed out how easy it is to get sucked into web-based conspiracy theories that are based on nothing other speculative and/or anecdotal evidence, neither of which is proof by any means. more often coincidence."

 

I provided proof. As I regularly try to convey things not said in the media, you regularly stalk me and try to discredit them when you dont even read them, or argue the facts I present. You only post retorical generlization attacks on my character.

 

Try debating the facts for once. Read my post, and find and expose it's flaws if your so right. If not, your just another hater who blindly follows your bias with angry spam.

 

"Uh it is stamped as unobjectionable because he never mentioned how the democratic candidate is married to a Hienze and directly influenced by the money of that corporation. Both sides are suspect when it comes to buisnesses they had their hands in. The thing that is so agrivating is that people tend to over look the bad portions of the side they are on."

 

I'm not a democrat. Kerry is a horrible candidate as well. But when you claim he married a woman to control a corporation.. LOL. I don't see any proof provided(if you provided a link to a reasonable claim I would consider it surely). Although I don't doubt it. You provivded no back up to your claim. So its taken with a grain of salt. However, with my arguement, I provided ample proof. One just has to look.

[chemchok]

The following link is to the transcript of a local NPR show called "On the Media." It's a conversation with the VP for Corporate Communications at Carlyle and is apropriately called "The Worst PR Job in the World."

 

http://www.wnyc.org/onthemedia/transcripts..._070204_PR.html

 

Just thought it might be interesting to show what a Carlyle rep has to deal with.

[Product of the Cosmos]

An interesting interview for sure chemchok. But believing what your told(esspecially from things like this) is rather sketchy. You have to look into actions more then PR people who are hired because they are good at what they do(making the company/corp seem good within the public).

 

Funny they didn't talk about the 9-11 put-options tho....

[chemchok]

Yeah, if there was a conspiracy (which I don't think there is in this case) then a Carlyle PR guy certainly wouldn't come out and announce it on radio. This was more of an amusing tangent for the thread.

[Product of the Cosmos]

Definetly interesting, and a contribution. Even if it doesn't imply what I would guess about the Carlyle Group if I had to make 1 clear judgement.

 

He did admit to having 14 years of secrecy though as well. That was rather str8 forward, and cool IMO. But u never do know about these things unless you have inside info... And most the time if you do have inside info, you can't give it out to the public to support your arguement.....

[deganawida]

I deleted the previous thread. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I knew it.

[Product of the Cosmos]

You must be a prophet! lol. In all seriousness though. The wierd thing about that was, other people didn't 'know' it. As phosphor was telling the truth. The other thread was going in the wrong direction, degrading into a flamewar, I figured just making it anew would be better... And I was right.

 

 

Oh ya and chemchok, I realized when I was driving(for som ereason I get many thought while driving), the PR rep in his descriptions didn't mention the CIA once in his descriptions of the prominent people who work for them. They have a former CIA director, and a former CIA deputy director. George Bush Senoir still recieves CIA breifings as well, as any former US president is allowed to do(although most do not). I think the intelligence reports by the CIA, is a rather huge advantage for a corporation.... Esspecially one that deals arms to other countries.

[taks]

  Your right' date=' if I was just claiming these things it wouldn't mean anything.  But since 100% of what I posted in this thread is known fact.[/quote']

no, it's not. your implication is that 100% of those activities are "criminal" and that is absolutely untrue. the topic description is about proof of criminals in the white house... again, just because YOU say it's 100% true does not make it so.

 

Experience and motive.  All the companies his regime have worked for are implicated or convicted in crimes while the regime's people were in management.

the existence of motive is not a crime, nor is the implication of crime. powerful people are regularly charged with unwarranted crimes for political reasons... again, nothing to see here. oh, and as for those convicted of wrongdoing... well they were convicted, right?

 

As well as selling weapons, and capabilities of WMD's to the same people they claim are the "axis of evil"!  Is this not startling to you?  Or do you claim their reports to the IRS of income is false too?

they were busted and paid the price for it. nothing unusual there. the items they were convicted of selling, btw, were designated for drilling purposes, btw... they just have a dual use. halliburton openly argued that they felt the restrictions on the drilling heads was politically motivated based on some domestic issue. oh well...

 

LOL! You seriously just gave me a HUGE laugh.  Nothing to see here folks, just proof that the administration has contridicted the very arguements of the campaigning and current presidents big claim of the "axis of evil" by contributing to selling them weapons and weapons capabilities...  Wait, that is pretty big.  I guess you don't want people to see what's here. lol.

uh, my statement was expressly pointed at links to corporate america... what's that got to do with the "axis of evil"? halliburton got busted and paid the price, and they publicly disagreed with the policy. hardly ties the entire bush administration to some conspiracy, PoTC.

 

Yep.  But, no one is doing that.  You post irrelevant conjecture to political threads often taks.  Try contributing a real debate for once... Just a thought.

bs. plenty actually are saying the pope is the anti-christ. i am contributing to real debate PoTC... your claims of the links are equally laughable, my entire point with that statement. still no "proof" of a criminal conspiracy here folks.

 

Nice arguement..  If there were any proof you would have heard about it? lol. You have quite a lot of confidence in motive corporately owned US media.  I don't.  One must look into things fruether if they want to find facts that are not mentioned in either the 'labeled' media here.

here's where your argument (no "e" after the "u) fails on a regular basis. this automatic assumption of big bad corporate america. sometimes, PoTC, looking too deep you'll dig up nonsense without a true connection, but circumstantial conspiracies. half the time you post "proof" it's nothing more than quotes from agenda driven websites or news articles from same. get real.

 

"I stopped taking it seriously the second PotC said that he had been "investigating" this matter in-depth. This is all obviously copied and pasted off of some site or some forum"

 

  You always say that. lol.  You might as well put "this is all just copied and pasted" in yoru sig. It would save you some time.  But I did copy paste some of the stuff.  I didn't see the point of writing it down after it's in front of me anyway.

first of all, when you switch who made a quote, you should point out who you're quoting, JN* in this case... but anyway, speaking as if you quoted me...

 

because you do it so often... not my fault you have such an agenda and hard to hide bias. maybe you should try another tactic and i wouldn't criticize you for it so often? not sure if you've noticed, but i'm not the only person around here that's noted this obvious failure on your part... not to mention you start off by admitting you deleted the first posting after getting called out on the ad-hominem attack on me. for shame PoTC, even trying to cover up your flawed arguments.

 

  And the poin of this thread is not PoTC is a political genius.  Its the facts I provided.  Who cares if I copy/pasted them if they are accurate!

but so rarely they are...

 

  Funny.  You maybe should learn on your objective analysis yourself.  How about reading the post instead of seeing the posters name and making a judgement.

i'm not the one quoting agenda driven websites and news articles. i read ALL evidence and evaluate each piece individually based on its own merits. you see somebody post "this guy is bad" and automatically assume the very worst connection. not yet, anywhere in this thread, have i seen a single piece of evidence to back up the claim that "criminals are in the white house." not once.

 

  I provided proof.  As I regularly try to convey things not said in the media, you regularly stalk me and try to discredit them when you dont even read them, or argue the facts I present. You only post retorical generlization attacks on my character.

you provided proof that halliburton did a bad thing and cheney disagreed with US policy. you also provided proof that corporate and political connections are the basis for appointments to administrative posts in the white house. as if this is unexpected? appointments are made based on associations, nothing unusual. i'm actually glad they are, since they'll (presidents) probably pick people they already know to be capable... however, no proof that the white house is "full of criminals" has been provided...

 

 

  Try debating the facts for once.  Read my post, and find and expose it's flaws if your so right.  If not, your just another hater who blindly follows your bias with angry spam.

where's the hate? where did I call YOU stupid? never. oh wait, you deleted that part of YOUR hate, right? can't let anyone know your argument is so weak you need to resort to ad-hominems... oh no!

 

what i'd like to see is proof of the CONNECTION YOU CLAIM. nowhere does that exist. i have shown repeatedly that none does, based on your evidence.

 

  I'm not a democrat.  Kerry is a horrible candidate as well.  But when you claim he married a woman to control a corporation.. LOL.  I don't see any proof provided(if you provided a link to a reasonable claim I would consider it surely).  Although I don't doubt it. You provivded no back up to your claim.  So its taken with a grain of salt.  However, with my arguement, I provided ample proof.  One just has to look.

i never said you were a democrat. where am i claiming kerry married a woman to control a corporation? i have stated he likes to marry for money... (they have no control over heinz, about 4% of the holdings...) i said you had an agenda (likely liberal). you have not provided anything other than circumstantial evidence and drawn a conclusion based on worst case scenarios... hardly objective reasoning.

 

keep on banging the drum, PoTC. few listen and even fewer care. i just enjoy shredding your conspiracies... nothing else to do other than watch cars rust.

 

taks

[taks]

The other thread was going in the wrong direction, degrading into a flamewar, I figured just making it anew would be better...  And I was right.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

that you started by calling me stupid. notice, too, that i did not resort to such a tactic.

 

taks

[Product of the Cosmos]

Read these quotes by you:

"and as for those convicted of wrongdoing... well they were convicted, right?"

 

"halliburton got busted and paid the price"

(the price was roughly 3% of what they gained by commiting the crime, and got the amount of jail time for millions of dollars worth of fraud, that someone gets for a parking ticket, none)

 

ok, now this one:

"not yet, anywhere in this thread, have i seen a single piece of evidence to back up the claim that "criminals are in the white house." not once."

 

lol. You just kicked your own ass right there. And, *cough* Enron. WOuld you go as far as sayin Enron wasn't affiliated with, and comprised of Criminals?

 

"they were busted and paid the price for it. nothing unusual there. the items they were convicted of selling, btw, were designated for drilling purposes, btw... they just have a dual use."

 

LOL! And North Korea is using those warheads they have for cotton raking fields. And those glass blown "water tobacco pipes" in the window of headshops downtown Seattle are for tobacco

 

 

 

 

"plenty actually are saying the pope is the anti-christ."

 

I didnt dispute that. I am aware that the current Pope has monopolized the Vatican appointing something like more then the amount of the previous 10 Popes combined to Cardinal(possible next Pope). And I'll be the first to argue VS the Catholic church in a debate about it. For example their tactic in making celebacy so they inherit their 'workers' things when they die(by chance I guess inheriting their stuff, if you dont think they have intent to create such a rule when it is not in the Bible as far as I know)... Pretty horrible if you ask me.

 

 

 

"here's where your argument (no "e" after the "u) fails on a regular basis. this automatic assumption of big bad corporate america. sometimes, PoTC, looking too deep you'll dig up nonsense without a true connection, but circumstantial conspiracies."

 

"i'm not the one quoting agenda driven websites and news articles. i read ALL evidence and evaluate each piece individually based on its own merits. you see somebody post "this guy is bad" and automatically assume the very worst connection."

 

All generalized claim of opinion/non-swear word personal character attacks.

 

 

"because you do it so often... not my fault you have such an agenda and hard to hide bias. maybe you should try another tactic and i wouldn't criticize you for it so often? not sure if you've noticed, but i'm not the only person around here that's noted this obvious failure on your part.."

 

Firstly we both obviously have bias' here. Thats a joke if either claim to not.

 

And more then one Bush follower, is not rare *JN. lol.

 

"not to mention you start off by admitting you deleted the first posting after getting called out on the ad-hominem attack on me. for shame PoTC, even trying to cover up your flawed arguments."

 

You say admitting like it was a durogatory thing. I started the thread over because it was heading in the wrong direction. And I didnt attack you. I said I QUOTE "Its amazing to me how stupid people are sometimes". If you think when people say general terms of people being stupid are applied to you, I guess thats a personal problem.

 

 

"you also provided proof that corporate and political connections are the basis for appointments to administrative posts in the white house. as if this is unexpected?"

 

Well when we're occupying the 2nd largest oil reserve country in the world right now on false intelligence, feeding Halliburton billions of dollars on biased contracts, and his administration is filled to the brim with Chevron Halliburton BP amoco Drilling timber and energy(Enron, criminals) it's pretty implicating to someone who doesn't think Bush is untouchable to corruption like Jesus, like you seem to think.

 

 

"i never said you were a democrat. where am i claiming kerry married a woman to control a corporation? i have stated he likes to marry for money... (they have no control over heinz, about 4% of the holdings...)"

 

That was not a quote from you.

 

"i said you had an agenda (likely liberal). you have not provided anything other than circumstantial evidence and drawn a conclusion based on worst case scenarios... hardly objective reasoning."

 

Definitive evidence to you would be a video of Bush smoking a primo with Osama Bin Laden while holding Britney Spears breast. I rest my case. Its obvious your a made up mind when it comes to Bush. Only reason why I respond to your propaganda is the influencable readers...

[Volourn]

I just ahte the fatc you destoryed my Kerry-Kerry-Ketchup Conspiracy. That was awesome stuff.

[taks]

lol.  You just kicked your own ass right there.  And, *cough* Enron.  WOuld you go as far as sayin Enron wasn't affiliated with, and comprised of Criminals?

exactly what was anybody in the whitehouse convicted of?

 

further, the whitehouse is not enron. they are a private enterprise (well, public, but not the government).

 

LOL!  And North Korea is using those warheads they have for cotton raking fields.  And those glass blown "water tobacco pipes" in the window of headshops downtown Seattle are for tobacco  

and like i said, they got busted and paid the price. still not proof of some whitehouse criminal conspriacy.

 

  I didnt dispute that.  I am aware that the current Pope has monopolized the Vatican appointing something like more then the amount of the previous 10 Popes combined to Cardinal(possible next Pope).  And I'll be the first to argue VS the  Catholic church in a debate about it.  For example their tactic in making celebacy so they inherit their 'workers' things when they die(by chance I guess inheriting their stuff, if you dont think they have intent to create such a rule when it is not in the Bible as far as I know)...  Pretty horrible if you ask me.

not really relevant, but you missed my point anyway. my point was that anybody can make any connection based on conjecture and circumstance. this does not amount to proof.

 

 

  All generalized claim of opinion/non-swear word personal character attacks.

not a character attack. i've caught you doing it many times. your links above are news articles written by people with an agenda and you've regularly cut-and-pasted from agenda driven websites. it's not a character attack if it's true, PoTC. the point here is that you never offer any alternative views or accept contrary evidence.

 

  Firstly we both obviously have bias' here.  Thats a joke if either claim to not.

 

  And more then one Bush follower, is not rare *JN.  lol.

oh really... exactly what is my bias? you'd be surprised if you knew. i do not defend bush, i defend against rhetoric based on conjecture and hearsay and innuendo. a lot of what you state is just that, so i argue against it.

 

You say admitting like it was a durogatory thing.  I started the thread over because it was heading in the wrong direction.  And I didnt attack you.  I said I QUOTE "Its amazing to me how stupid people are sometimes".  If you think when people say general terms of people being stupid are applied to you, I guess thats a personal problem.

no, the deragatory thing was what you said in the first post. you were directly quoting me and questioning my intelligence. with that latter bit, again, you'd be surprised at what you don't know.

 

 

Well when we're occupying the 2nd largest oil reserve country in the world right now on false intelligence, feeding Halliburton billions of dollars on biased contracts, and his administration is filled to the brim with Chevron Halliburton BP amoco Drilling timber and energy(Enron, criminals) it's pretty implicating to someone who doesn't think Bush is untouchable to corruption like Jesus, like you seem to think.

i never said he wasn't untouchable to corruption. i said you haven't proved any real link between bush's administration and all these "crimes." jesus is nothing but a man, btw. bush fills his capinet and administration with people he knows, hardly suprising.

 

  That was not a quote from you.

as i pointed out, when you switch who you're quoting, you should say so...

 

  Definitive evidence to you would be a video of Bush smoking a primo with Osama Bin Laden while holding Britney Spears breast.  I rest my case.  Its obvious your a made up mind when it comes to Bush.  Only reason why I respond to your propaganda is the influencable readers...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i'm a propagandist? yeah, right... definitive evidence would be more than circumstance. this is all you've provided. i have not made up my mind, you just haven't provided any substance connecting him to criminal activity.

 

taks

[Product of the Cosmos]

you just posted the same crap... agian.

 

 

I reffer back to my previous posts a bit ^up^ there. Since you posted nothing new from your previous arguements.

 

 

I guess Cheney may have been cloned when we was CEO of Halliburton when they were doing these things or something.. How else would you not link him to the facts provided. Oh thats right, you said they were convicted, then there is no evidence they are criminals. lol.. Blahhhh

 

I'm done wasting my time on your same posts everytime.

 

'u copy paste'

'there is no criminal connection'

'so they got convicted, so what'

'nuthing to see here'

 

lol. You crack me up man.