[CLASS BUILD] Llunrwald - Hearth Orlan Rogue, The "Handy Thief" (one hand rogue focused on hit to crit conversion)

[Chaospread]

Hi,
   this is another build of mine, he is a one-handed, Gravestep-addicted Hearth Orlan Rogue focused on hits on crits conversion.
I think about a build with the greatest hits to crits conversion rate possible, I check if it is viable and in case fix some lacks, and eventually give up some conversion score for more efficiency.
If you wanna know about Hits to Crits conversion reached by this build, go to the corresponding paragraph near the end of post.
Hope you like it

Llunrwald - Hearth Orlan Rogue, The "Handy Thief"

"So do you think I can't hit you? We will see..."

Name: Llunrwald
PoTD: YES - ver. 3.07-1318 LATEST
SOLO: YES - ver. 3.07-1318 LATEST - All TCS achievements.
ULTIMATE: No, unless you choose another race* and change a little bit talents and abilities choices.
Race: Orlan - +1 Res, +2 Per, -1 Mig
Subrace: Hearth - Minor Threat*
Class: Rogue - +2 Mechanics,+1 Stealth
Culture:  Old Vailia - +1 Int
Background:  Drifter - 1 Mechanics, 1 Stealth

*PAY ATTENTION! In SOLO, Minor Threat is useless! It works only with companion, it doesn't trigger with figurines, charmed or dominated foes and/or Concelhaut Visage, SO playing solo with an Hearth Orlan it is the same to say playing without race bonus. Because of that, if you want a race bonus, choose another race for this build. Human, Boreal Dwarf and Island/Coastal Aumaua can fit well

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Attributes - final scores with passive bonus

Mig: 18 - 18 base, -1 Orlan, +1 Gift from the Machine
Con: 10
Dex: 18
Per: 7 - 3 base, +2 Orlan, +1 Hylea's boon, +1 Song of the Heavens
Int: 19 - 18 base, +1 Old Vailia
Res: 9 - 8 base, +1 Orlan

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Skills score

Stealth: 9 - 13 with Rogue, Drifter, Blooded Hunter and Dungeon Delver, with equipment and bonus rest it can raise even at 17
Athletics: 2 - 4 with Angio's Gambeson
Lore: 5 - 6 with Hylea's Boon, can arrive at 8 or even 10 with Aldwyn's Boon, rest and equipment
Mechanics: 6 - 10 with Rogue, Drifter and Dungeon Delver, 12 with equipment and even 15 with Rite of Walking Shadows
Survival: 3 - 5 with equipment

After killed Concelhaut, I respeced with:

Stealth: 2 - 6 with Rogue, Drifter, Blooded Hunter and Dungeon Delver
Athletics: 6 - 8 with Angio's Gambeson
Lore: 7 - 8 with Hylea's Boon, it can arrive at 12 with Aldwyn's Boon, rest and equipment
Mechanics: 1 - 5 with Rogue, Drifter and Dungeon Delver
Survival: 8 - 10 with equipment

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Talents

I took talents and abilities focused on Hits to Crits conversion, so i gave priority to those ones.

One-Handed Style - +15% Hits to Crits conversion
Vicious Fighting - +10% Hits to Crits conversion
Bloody Slaughter - +20% Hits to Crits conversion and +0.5 Crit multiplier against enemies with >10% endurance
Deep Pockets - we need scrolls, figurines and potions more than other classes
Shadowing Beyond - no brain talent for skipping many encounter and split many groups of monsters
Weapon Focus: Knight - for +6 accuracy with We Toki
Weapon Focus: Soldier - for +6 accuracy with Godansthunyr
Weapon Focus: Peasant - for +6 accuracy with Cladhaliath

Bloody Slaughter is an underrated talent for almost all players, I pick it for RPG reasons and for initial goal - Hits to Crits conv., but it can be useful in general with scrolls against many very damaged groups of monsters to kill them with more chances; i.e. shooting a fireball versus 5 ogres with low endurance can result in many hit bu no kill and you have another round with 5 ogres alive; with 1 more crit you have 4 alive the next round instead of 4, if you score a crit by yourself they become 3 and with the others our abilities with more hits to crits conversion, they could be 2... And beside that with boss - dragons ecc with many endurance, 10% can mean 60 or 70, and scoring a crit at that point can make the difference between winning or losing the fight - and your life. Not so bad, after all. Fun fact: if you pick Bloody Slaughter, in th combat log ALL Hits to Crits conversion are assigned to this talent; I suspect it is a log bug, that is, the conversions are made by all talents and abilities, but in the log you say only hit - Bloody Slaughter --> crit and no more other talents/abilities

The three weapon focus can be much. You're right, I didn't know what to take and I increased my accuracy with my weapons. You can keep only one or two of them - I'd pick Knight focus because We Toki is our preferred weapons, Peasant can be still usefull... see Equipment session for that. And late game, with high Rogue accuracy, weapon focus is not very important. Dropping some weapon focus talents you can choose other talents as Fast Runner, Outlander's Frenzy, Envenomed Strike, Devastating Blow or what you like. If I restarted the game, maybe I'd drop all the three, I'd pick Gallant's Focus and I'd have +4 accuracy and 2 more talents choice.

By the way, after killed Concelhaut I respeced with:

One-Handed Style - +15% Hits to Crits conversion
Vicious Fighting - +10% Hits to Crits conversion
Bloody Slaughter - +20% Hits to Crits conversion and +0.5 Crit multiplier against enemies with >10% endurance
Deep Pockets - we need scrolls, figurines and potions more than other classes
Shadowing Beyond - no brain talent for skipping many encounter and split many groups of monsters
Devastating Blow - +2% Finishing BLow damage, it seems low but it is very good in the damage calculation
Fast Runner - more speed is always great for a melee rogue
Beast Slayer - Alpine and Adra Dragon, Llengrath's friends and so on, you know

Abilities

Sneak attack - automatic
Recless Assault - no-brain for every rogue I believe
Dirty Fighting - no way, I have to pick this for +10% Hits to Crits conversion
Deathblows - it's hard to find a rogue without it, +100% damage to enemies with 2 or more afflictions
Deep wounds - 3 + MIGHT bonus every tick any time we give slash, crush or pierce damage... I like it for rogue
Finishing Blow - +5 accuracy, +50% damage and high damage to low endurance enemy with a weird calculation: trust me, pick it, shoot it when a Dragon is near death and you will see damage going to the sky In my video below there are some single crit near 300 damage with a one-hand weapon.
Blinding Strike
Crippling Strike
Fearsome Strike or Withering Strike - I prefer first one because it give 2 affliction for more time even if it is per rest instead of per encounter
Other abilities are defensive or replicable with equipment most of the times, so no many words here. Maybe you can try Shadow Step for more damage or Escape/Coordinated Positioning/Smoke Cloud as panic button, but they make no real difference.

Talents chosen/achieved through the run

The Merciless Hand - +0.3 crit damage, better than other two and with a Rogue, can't we stay with Doemenels?
Gift from the Machine - yes, we want +1 Might and more Endurance ;
Hylea's Boon - only because we need +1 Per and above all +1 Lore , by the way, Llunrwald is a artist of theft and deceit, you can say that
Song of the Heavens - more PER
Dungeon Delver - crit bonus, stealth and mechanics ... food and air for us
Flick of the Wrist
Dozens Luck
Blooded Hunter - more stealth
Scale-Breaker

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Equipment

Most used equipment

Weapon set 1: We Toki - Overbearing, Legendary, Durgan-Refined, Corrode Lash, Slaying - Beast
Weapon set 2: Godansthunyr - Stunning, +1 Might, Superb, Durgan-Refined, Corrode Lash
Alternative weapon: Cladhaliath - Stunning, Vicious - +20% damage against stunned, prone or flanked enemies, Superb, Durgan-Refined, Slaying - Vessel

Armor: Angio's Gambeson - Superb, Athletic, Of Constitution 2, Deleterious Alacrity of Motion, Slash-Proofed, Durgan-Reinforced
Head: Munacra Arret - +12 Will, Whisper of Threason 3 per rest
Neck: Cape of Master Mystic - Invisibility when hit by Crit, +12 Deflection, Minor Arcane Reflection
Hands: Gauntlets of Swift Action - +15% Attack Speed
Finger 1: Gwyn's Band of Union - Blassing, +4 INT, Instill Doubt when endurance above 80%
Finger 2: Ring of Chainging Heart - + 3 RES, Dominate 2 per rest
Waist: Girdle of Mortal Protection - Reduce damage of critical hit by 27%
Feet: Boots of Speed - Moving fast can make the difference
Pet: Concelhaut - essential for Llengrath fight

Some words about equipments - which take at the beginning, predatory weapons, etc.

Predatory weapons - +10% Hits to Crits conversion
Predatory weapons should fit well for this build, especially Aattuuk because it is a dagger, so +5 accuracy, one hand, and whole place for full enchantment.
I try to use that weapon and the others predatory equipment, but Llunrwald can't go through the game with them. He is too squishy, he need to CC enemy and if he can achieve it via scrolls and figurines,
this tattic is frustranntig and, above all, expensive to adopt every encounter, so I stuck with deabilitating weapons.
You can play with Aattuuk until you get a stunning or averbearing weapon, and the best for us - one handed are the three already cited: We Toki, Godansthunyr and Cladhaliath.
By the way, Aattuuk is a dagger and in my run I've already taken weapon focus for war hammer, so just arrived to Defiance Bay I went to Vincent Dwellier, buyed
Haba's Hammer - a simple Exceptional war hammer and enchanted it with Corrode Slash and Slaying Kith - Act 2 is plenty of kith to kill, it got its job well in early game;
maybe now I'd pick Aattuuk, but it no so decisive.

Weapons selection
Yet said that We Toki is the best weapon for a one-handed character because it debilitate opponent - prone via overbearing, prone status last long, almost no monster is immune to prone and We Toki can
be enchanted at full 14 points with Legendary, having +15 acc/+55% damage - become +20/+80% against beast and +25% corrode damage at top of that. Very good.
Godansthunyr is for the few enemies immune to prone, that's all.
Cladhaliath was picked only for one reason: I needed a effective one hanb weapons against Eyeless. So I took Cladhaliathand enchanted it with stunning and Slaying Vessel, with a +5 accuracy on top
because it is a spear. It did its job at the best... and from that moment I used it against Vessel, obviously, Woedica final statues especially.

Armor
At the beginning you have to make do with what you find, middle game I took Wayfarer's Hide but then I think that Athletic and Deleterious Alacrity of Motion of Angio's Gambeson was perfect for Llunrwald.
You can keep ready armor with stealth bonus and survive bonus, for different moment and situation.

Other equipments used often and not already mentioned
Let go early game, I often used Rotfinger Gloves - area damage and two afflictions maker and Ring of Searing Flames, end game they become poor and I wear Gauntlets of Accuracy and as rings Bartender's Ring, Orlan's Bramble Ring, Pensiavi mes Rèi or Ring of Thorns. Gwyn's Band of Union is excellent with +4 INT - afflictions last longer and Ring of Chainging Heart is a good way to CC enemies
and make allied, such as Munacra Arret. Late game I dropped Munacra Arret for Maegfolc Skull - +4 MIG for damage and Unbending for healing.
For neck slot I used also Mantle of the Excavator, Glanfathan Adraswen - for +2 Lore, or Fulvano's Amulet - for Healing bonus.
At waist I used the same old Belt of the Royal Deadfire Cannoneer but also Belt of the Stelgaer or Trollhide Belt but I found that late game the best is Girdle of Mortal Protection.
For foot I wore Boots of Stability, Cat's Whisper - for Stealth bonus, Fenwalkers, and usual Shod-in-Faith or Viettro's Formal Footwear.

Quick Slots
I was plenty of figurines, apart form this I used scrolls and potion depending on the situation, you can see some "combination" of quick slots items in the videos at the end.

Drugs and food
I've my usual combination of food, the one that give +2 almost to every attribute, and IMPORTANT I take Gravestep before every hard encounter.
It give +25% of Hits converted to Crits for 600 sec and this is far well of +15% Hits to Crits conversion of Potion of Merciless Gaze AND Gravestep can be drunk BEFORE combat, clearing a quick slot item.
-20% maximum Endurance for 600 sec is not so problematic.

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Ok, but, how high this blessed Hits to Crits Conversion is?

Finally, we take the stock of this Hits to Crits Conversion.
We have theese bonus stacking:

Dirty Fighting    --> +10%
Vicious Fighting  --> +10%
Predatory         --> +10%
Gravestep         --> +25%
Durgan-Refined    --> +20%
Bloody Slaughter  --> +20%

So, if you stack ALL and EVERY bonus, the final Hits to Crits conversion rate will be: 10 + 10 + 10 + 25 + 20 + 20 = 95% !!!
But some bonus are situational, especially Bloody Slaughter, and we wear predatory weapons almost never, so end game the conversion will be 65%, and early/middle game, without Durgan-Refined
and Gravestep we can reach only 30% with 2 talents and abilities and a predatory weapon, or 45% with a potion of Merciless Gaze, and this is not so bad early game, after all!
My mistake, I wrote a lot of heresies!
I'm going to quote the right calculation done by @Boeroer and I'm sorry about my innacuracy, please forgive me! But the effectiveness of the build is the same also with lower hits to crits conversion and what was written without Strikethrough below Boeror quote it is still valid

Quote

 

... the overall chance of conversion is not simply an addition of the individual chances. Instead they will stack multiplicatively and not additively, but not in favor of the player. It's easiest to calculate the overall chance by multiplying the chances NOT to convert:

Dirty Fighting --> 0.1 chance to convert --> 0.9 chance NOT to convert.

Vicious Fighting --> 0.1 ctc --> 0.9 ntc.

Predatory --> 0.9 ntc

Gravestep --> 0.75 ntc

Durgan-Refined --> 0.8 ntc

Bloody Slaugher --> 0.8 ntc

0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8 =  0.3499 or ~0.35 chance NOT to convert- substract from 1 and you get the chance to convert: 1-3.5 = 0.65 or 65% overall conversion chance. 

You can never reach 100% with this approach. Each additional conversion will have lower and lower absolute impact on the overall conversion rate.

This is why stacking them at all costs doesn't yield the best results. In some fights the additional ACC is still good in the later game though. It depends on your ACC vs. the enemies defense. Usually high-defense bosses are cases where single handed weapon might yield better results than dual wielding (or two handers) just because you prevent misses and maybe even grazes.

But for a Rogue who has several Full Attacks it's almost always better to have two strikes instead of one. Let's determine the difference in conversion rate between a Full Attack with two overbearing weapons compared to a Full Attck with a singe Overbearing weapon: Accuracy aside, the only difference in conversion is the 15% from Single Weapon Style. If ye take the exampl from above:

dual wielding: 0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8 = ~0.35 ntc for both attacks --> 0.35 * 0.35 = 1.2255 --> ~88% crit conversion chance with at least one of both weapons. 

single weapon: 0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8*0.85 = ~0.3 ntc for the single attack -> ~70% crit conversion chance with tha one weapon. 

 

So with all bonuses, including Minor Threat if you don't play solo, i.e another *0.9 factor to NTC rate it gives about 70% conversion rate with all bonuses together. It is very good and perhaps it could be convenient land a crit with conversion than with accuracy...
Actually, Dirty Fighting and Vicious Fighting stack, but, since 0.80 is near 0.9*0.9 = 0.81, above calculations remain valid.
Middle/end game you will see almost any hit converted to crits, this PG crits a lot also with low Perception.
With low PER I can distribute some poin in CON and RES, better than nothing and this give more surivability to the build.
But some foes are hard to hit, so you have to reach at least a "hit", not a "graze", because of that accuracy bonuses are welcome.
Also, Minor Threat doesn't work SOLO, but in a game with other characters you can put another +10% bonus in front of others, so the previous rates become 105% - ROTFL!, 75% and 55%, very impressive NO, say above for actual rates.

Good to hear, but, is this PG viable?
Ok, if you wanna go SOLO, the best Rogue is with two weapon style - We Toki and Godansthunyr and the usual build - see for example @baldurs_gate_2 Ultimate Rogue.
By the way I beat every encounter with no so high difficulty, except Llengrath: with one hand/low Perception Rogue it is very difficult and it is the only reason this PG can get Ultimate Solo achievements.
If you wann go ULTIMATE with Llunrwald, for Llengrath respec in two handed or weapon and shield style and maybe take different quick slot items than my video below.
Also Brynlod can be risky, but you can pull/kite easily at that location.
All other encounter, with the right tattic - confusion/paralize scroll, figurines, use of shadowing beyond etc. are quite simple, also Adra and Alpine Dragon.
And I have to say that many quests can be achieved with stealth/invisibility - i.e. The Rising Tide with no combat at all, skipping many battles.
In "normal" game, with other PG and Minor Threat, this could be a good damage dealer and a great "priority target killer".

RPG thoughts

I thought about Llunrwald as an abandoned infant from Old Vailia, who grew in a circus or somenthing like learning his rogue abilities and at a certain point of his life he decided to go on his way.
A day he tried Gravestep and by that moment he was addicted and he found out that his tricks could be better with it ;).
He didn't receive a good education, in D&D terms, he can be a Chaotic Neutral PG.

---

MEDIA

For these battles, I was inspired by @baldurs_gate_2 Ultimate Rogue and also this run.

Brynlod

Adra Dragon

Alpine Dragon

Concelhaut

Thaos

Llengrath

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Chaospread
fixed PG name

[Boeroer]

17 hours ago, Chaospread said:

Ok, but, how high this blessed Hits to Crits Conversion is?

Finally, we take the stock of this Hits to Crits Conversion.
We have theese bonus stacking:

Dirty Fighting    --> +10%
Vicious Fighting  --> +10%
Predatory         --> +10%
Gravestep         --> +25%
Durgan-Refined    --> +20%
Bloody Slaughter  --> +20%

So, if you stack ALL and EVERY bonus, the final Hits to Crits conversion rate will be: 10 + 10 + 10 + 25 + 20 + 20 = 95% !!!

Unfortunaltey conversions don't stack like that. In code there will be a list of conversion abilities with their percentages - and the game will loop through that list after the initial hit - to see if any of those conversion chances might trigger. If one triggers the loop is ended with a hit-to-crit conversion. If none triggers there will be no conversion. 

Because of that the overall chance of conversion is not simply an addition of the individual chances. Instead they will stack multiplicatively and not additively, but not in favor of the player. It's easiest to calculate the overall chance by multiplying the chances NOT to convert:

Dirty Fighting --> 0.1 chance to convert --> 0.9 chance NOT to convert.

Vicious Fighting --> 0.1 ctc --> 0.9 ntc.

Predatory --> 0.9 ntc

Gravestep --> 0.75 ntc

Durgan-Refined --> 0.8 ntc

Bloody Slaugher --> 0.8 ntc

0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8 =  0.3499 or ~0.35 chance NOT to convert- substract from 1 and you get the chance to convert: 1-3.5 = 0.65 or 65% overall conversion chance. 

You can never reach 100% with this approach. Each additional conversion will have lower and lower absolute impact on the overall conversion rate.

This is why stacking them at all costs doesn't yield the best results. In some fights the additional ACC is still good in the later game though. It depends on your ACC vs. the enemies defense. Usually high-defense bosses are cases where single handed weapon might yield better results than dual wielding (or two handers) just because you prevent misses and maybe even grazes.

But for a Rogue who has several Full Attacks it's almost always better to have two strikes instead of one. Let's determine the difference in conversion rate between a Full Attack with two overbearing weapons compared to a Full Attck with a singe Overbearing weapon: Accuracy aside, the only difference in conversion is the 15% from Single Weapon Style. If ye take the exampl from above:

dual wielding: 0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8 = ~0.35 ntc for both attacks --> 0.35 * 0.35 = 1.2255 --> ~88% crit conversion chance with at least one of both weapons. 

single weapon: 0.9*0.9*0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8*0.85 = ~0.3 ntc for the single attack -> ~70% crit conversion chance with tha one weapon. 

Of course the additional 12 ACC will help with landing crits, too -  but overall it's less impactful than having the additional chance from a second weapon - which not only might deal additional damage and add more CC time, but also can apply an affliction which will already count towards Sneak Attack and Deathblows for the second strike. Also, with an overbearing weapon + a stunning weapon (e.g. We Toki + Godansthunyr) you might unlock Deathblows just with auto-attacks, which can't be done with a single weapon (although there is some problem with stunning weapons not counting for SneakAttack/Deathblows because the stun affliction is not implemented properly as an affliction iirc, needs testing). 

That's why single weapon style is perceived to be the weakest option of all styles in PoE by most (after the early game where the +12 ACC bonus, compared to the general low ACC and defense numbers, has a huge impact and makes "not missing" a lot easier). Of course later there are edge cases, for example when your ACC is just high enough (e.g. from the +12 from single weapon use) so that you cannot miss,graze or even hit anymore and so on. And also classes that don't have Full Attacks don't suffer so much from it (see Cipher). But a Rogue with many of the per-encounter Full Attacks unfortunatley does.

So you picked the most difficult setup with one of the weakest classes for PotD.

But as long as it works and is fun to play it's awesome of course. And it's cool to see someone actually doing this from start until the end of the game. 

 

[Chaospread]

Indeed! When i started I knew how calculation works, but I forget while playing

A thing I believe doesn't work as you say:

Quote

with an overbearing weapon + a stunning weapon e.g. (We Toki + Godansthunyr) you might unlock Deathblows just with auto-attacks

Prone is overridden by stunning, so I don't know whether Deathblows triggers, I've to try

By the way, I'm going to correct my post with right rate conversion, thanks for all the calculation

And I forgot the +12 bonus, it is maybe the best bonus with one hand, it helps a lot early game, but you lack some protection and/or speed, late game is better to have +15% conversion bonus, as Rogue has high Accuracy by himself, but +12 is very good against bosses anyway.

I knew rogue is a poor class, but I was "sad" that no one has never picked up "one-handed style", and I was curious of how much many conversion bonus worked and how was in game in practice. And even if the rate is no good as in my post, I feel that I crit more than one shot every two, because I haven't predatory weapon, but maybe it is only an impression.

Maybe it can be fun for some readers/players who read the forum, or for new games in the future: one-handed is actual a bad thing, either the rate conversion should stack, or it should give speed or somenthing like a parry, maybe with further talents, but as it be by now, two-handed and weapon and shield are far better than one-handed, and two-handed of course, but in some cases, two-handed has a reason to be.

At the end, one-handed attack, not style, could have a sense if you have to land a weapon effect att all costs: +12 ACC is very good for that, but when does it happens?

One-handed style and his conversion can be useful only for Sap because it's the only primary attack ability for Rogue and you improve the chance of the duration of stunned can last longer... but if you already have stunnig weapon... better to have We Toki + Godansthunyr.

So if in the future there will be an Enhanched Edition, Rogue and one-handed style will deserve a restoration, as was for Barbarian for example. And I'd change Shadow Step with more quickness... a +20% damage as a 13 level ability? Lol...

I've to start Pillars 2; I hope Rogue and one-handed style are better in that game

Quote

But as long as it works and is fun to play it's awesome of course. And it's cool to see someone actually doing this from start until the end of the game. 

I like trying not exlpored build, if you have one tell me, maybe if I find that it is fun or interensting, I can give it a full run chance

Thanks again @Boeroer for correcting me, If you weren't here, we should create you!

[ekt0]

On 12/24/2022 at 11:58 PM, Chaospread said:

Ok, if you wanna go SOLO, the best Rogue is two handed weapons

I think you mean two weapon style ?

Anyway, it is a good post and I find it quite valuable. Thanks for your effort.

[Chaospread]

1 hour ago, ekt0 said:

I think you mean two weapon style ?

Yes, that was I meant.

Thank you very much for the correction, I hate wrong sentences in a post! I've just fixed my post

Quote

Anyway, it is a good post and I find it quite valuable. Thanks for your effort.

Thanks!

[Chaospread]

@Boeroer, I'm sorry, maybe I'm a little boring but another thing about conversion stacking: I think that Vicious Fighting and Dirty Fighting stack each other.

If you see Vicious Fighting description, it says that it modifies Dirty Fighting:

and the Dirty Fighting description says 20%:

and indeed in my active effects I find again 20%:

So I think the calculation for one-handed style should be (I'm adding Minor Threat fon NON-SOLO and MAX rate with one-hand):

Dirty Fighting AND Vicious Fighting --> 0.2 chance to convert --> 0.8 chance NOT to convert.

Predatory --> 0.9 ntc

Gravestep --> 0.75 ntc

Durgan-Refined --> 0.8 ntc

Bloody Slaugher --> 0.8 ntc

Minor Threat --> 0.9 ntc

Then:

0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8*0.9 = 0.31104 ntc --> 0,68896 =~ 69% conversion rate.
Without Minor Threat, it become 0.9*0.75*0.8*0.8=~ 65% conversion rate, because 0,9*0,9 (Dirty Fighting and Vicious Fighting NOT stacking) is 0,81, that's to say almost the SAME VALUE as they shouldn't stacking.

It is not very important now, but, if we'll find others stacking bonus, rates should start to change... and I'm not sure that all others bonuses don't stack at all
By the way, I calculate the rate also with Minor Threat

If the log were a full/trace log with the calculation ...

Another thing, with two weapons you have greater chance that one attack can be converted, and in less time, so the rate considering the time can be also better thant 65 versus 88, isn't it?

[hansvedic]

For One-Handed Style, I think this would be a great idea to build a Chanter around, especially given how One-Handed Style benefits chants. I tested this idea a bit, and Hearth Orlans actually benefit from Minor Threat for Chanter summons for some reason, even when soloing.

 

EDIT: Maybe combining some concepts from the alternate Chillfog build with this build could produce interesting results?

Edited May 1, 2023 by hansvedic

[Chaospread]

Oh yes, it can be a very good combo with Rêghar Konnek     or better Aattuuk with Filck of the Wrist, an attacking Chanter with high ACC and a graet hits to crits conversion rate

I'm sorry but, what is the alternate Chillfog build? I haven't found a such build looking for in the forum, a side some Wizard builds... thanks.

[hansvedic]

On 5/2/2023 at 2:51 AM, Chaospread said:

Oh yes, it can be a very good combo with Rêghar Konnek     or better Aattuuk with Filck of the Wrist, an attacking Chanter with high ACC and a graet hits to crits conversion rate

I'm sorry but, what is the alternate Chillfog build? I haven't found a such build looking for in the forum, a side some Wizard builds... thanks.

Chillfog chanter build; there’s the main build (a defensive tank) and the alternate build. You can find it in the builds list.

The main idea behind the chillfog chanter build is having incredible passive healing.

Edited May 3, 2023 by hansvedic

[Chaospread]

Oh, yes, I've seen it just now. Yeah, you could add more crit to your invocations/phrases with a +12 accuracy, maybe the bonuns for hit to crits conversion works and also the bonus for predatory items, @Boeroer do you know whether those bonues were applied?

I'd seen him with strong offensive damaging phrases/invocations or, for sake of originality, a very strong CC with effects like paralyzed/frightened/terrified/charmed applied to foes

Very good alternative, in my opinion

[Boeroer]

9 hours ago, Chaospread said:

maybe the bonuns for hit to crits conversion works and also the bonus for predatory items, @Boeroer do you know whether those bonues were applied?

One-Handed Style doesn't get applied to chants, only the generic +12 ACC bonus. I actually never tested predatory items but I suspect they alo don't work with chants.