Qs on Vatnir

[Griffonheart]

1) Is level 16 the lowest level possible (difficulty wise) to require Vatnir?

2) What are some of the builds people like with him? I tried Zealot on my first run but the Void really wasn’t the best spot to test his frost/corrode abilities.

[dgray62]

You can get Vatnir well below level 16. You could get him around level 10-12 I think. You'll have to fight the dragon after you talk to him, but the initial battle in town isn't too hard. You can then recruit him and leave, and come back around level 16 when you're ready to take on the DLC. With all his cold spells he's very useful again the fire resistant foes at Magran's Fires. Once you complete the quests up there, you'll probably be ready for the DLC.

Edited March 19, 2021 by dgray62
spelling

[Griffonheart]

10 minutes ago, dgray62 said:

You can get Vatnir well below level 16. You could get him around level 10-12 I think. You'll have to fight the dragon after you talk to him, but the initial battle in town isn't too hard. You can then recruit him and leave, and come back around level 16 when you're ready to take on the DLC. With all his cold spells he's very useful again the fire resistant foes at Magran's Fires. Once you complete the quests up there, you'll probably be ready for the DLC.

Hm, what is your team composition at handling the Messenger at 10~12, if I may ask? And which difficulty? 

[Boeroer]

If you have a Paladin with Brand Enemy you can take out the Messenger at lvl 5.
Neryscirlas is vulnerable to fire damage, Brand Enemy is an auto-hit and it lasts until the fight is over.

Once Llengrath's Safeguard kicks in the burn damage will no longer penetrate and thus it will take a very long time to kill him. But I tried 10 minutes ago (just to be sure) and it worked.

Maybe backing it up with an Assassin + Gouging Strike would be good. 
 

Edited March 19, 2021 by Boeroer

[thelee]

for a less cheese-y approach, I think level 10-12 is very hard for PotD, but less so for normal difficulties. With a typical party for PotD I do the first fight at 13-14.

 

The big thing is simply just being able to interrupt Llengrath's Safeguard or having a way to dispel it. Otherwise the fight can really drag, and even a powerful party might just run out of steam in such a scenario.

[Boeroer]

I don't find it too cheesy to hire a specialized Paladin to fight the Messenger in order to get Vatnir real soon. You're meta-gaming already to get this companion sooner than usual - and then it's just another small step to hire a fitting Paladin for that special task and say farewell to that special dragon hunter afterwards.  

[thelee]

oh i don't think it's cheesy to hire specialized companions for a fight, but both brand enemy and gouging strike have hilarious consequences for the patient that i have to imagine was a bit unintentional.

 

Esp with berath challenge, you end up with some pretty weird world events. Roving packs of bleakwalker paladin assassins, who all they do is point at someone and say "hey! you! yeah, you! you're my enemy now" and go hide out in a bunker for a week until their target dies. Entire kingdoms and revolutions are toppled by puny paladin pipsqueaks. Fireproof blankets are in high demand...

[Boeroer]

...then somebody does a Lover's Embrace from stealth...

[Not So Clever Hound]

Well if we're on this topic, how is Gouging Strike effective on targets that do not have anything to gouge? And how do you make a skeleton bleed to death with an Arterial Strike? Answer: if you coat your blade with a slice of camembert or any other non-pasteurized cheeze.

[Griffonheart]

14 hours ago, Boeroer said:

If you have a Paladin with Brand Enemy you can take out the Messenger at lvl 5.
Neryscirlas is vulnerable to fire damage, Brand Enemy is an auto-hit and it lasts until the fight is over.

Once Llengrath's Safeguard kicks in the burn damage will no longer penetrate and thus it will take a very long time to kill him. But I tried 10 minutes ago (just to be sure) and it worked.

Maybe backing it up with an Assassin + Gouging Strike would be good. 
 

Ok, I get the bleed-to-death part, but how do we prevent Messenger from killing my party before she dies from oozing... whatever juice that's left in her? I presume her level is around 16 without upscaling.

And after I get Vatnir, what builds do people recommend? I don't suppose I just tell him to go Zealot, since I already bought Lover's Embrace. ^_^

[Boeroer]

You simply run back up to the house where Vatnir's at. Afaik the Messenger is too big to follow? If not you can simply place your party somewhere out of sight and just go in with the Paladin, apply Brand Enemy and then use a potion of invisibility to retreat to your party asap. Or you just let the Paladin go KO while your party waits out of sight. Combat will not end because the DoT prevents it. It's rel. foolproof. 

I did my test with lvl-1 Edér and a lvl-5 paladin. But I spawned Neriscyrlas with the console into the early-game caverns on Port Maje. I placed Edér in front of the dragon, applied Brand Enemy, retreated while the Dragon attacked and killed Edér. Then it stood there and burned. I went to prepare some food for the kids and when I came back it was dead.

Edited March 20, 2021 by Boeroer

[Griffonheart]

2 hours ago, Boeroer said:

You simply run back up to the house where Vatnir's at. Afaik the Messenger is too big to follow? If not you can simply place your party somewhere out of sight and just go in with the Paladin, apply Brand Enemy and then use a potion of invisibility to retreat to your party asap. Or you just let the Paladin go KO while your party waits out of sight. Combat will not end because the DoT prevents it. It's rel. foolproof. 

I did my test with lvl-1 Edér and a lvl-5 paladin. But I spawned Neriscyrlas with the console into the early-game caverns on Port Maje. I placed Edér in front of the dragon, applied Brand Enemy, retreated while the Dragon attacked and killed Edér. Then it stood there and burned. I went to prepare some food for the kids and when I came back it was dead.

Ok, this explains a lot about not just this strategy, but also a lot of other build-guide I didn’t understand before: Combat doesn’t end, DoTs don’t get removed, even if the person applied them died. Goodness gracious... I was wondering how some Rogue builds solo PotD.

 

Can Vatnir tank?

[Boeroer]

1 hour ago, Griffonheart said:

Can Vatnir tank?

Not particularly well. Like any Priest/Celebrant/Zealot could tank - nothing special but if he's not the only one who gets attacked it's doable. 

[Not So Clever Hound]

4 hours ago, Griffonheart said:

Rogue builds solo PotD

Yep, Gouging Strike / Brand Enemy / True Lover's Kiss are the three DoTs that to my knowledge are applied until combat ends, in the most literal sense. It is one of many reliable sources of cheese in the game to effortlessly solo otherwise very challenging encounters. Being able to break engagement and move to safety with some form of invisibility is another key component of this cheezy strategy. As you can see, Rogues have it all.