Help with Cipher build

[davoker]

I want to recycle this thread, since the title really encompasses the cipher, even if the initial question is for melee hehe

My doubts come with cipher but this time for ranged, the build is basically one of MaxQ (https://gist.github.com/v1ld/fd89b6092ec840e1cce87900fb0aaa85 )

4. ranged cc/dps - robe/hide/padded armor (early game), durganized robe (late game), Borresaine/Sabra Marie Warbow; wood elf; 15/7/18/18/17/3 (ok I only make one change, 1 point less than MIG to give 1 more point to INT, just that.).

My doubts come in that I am not sure what skills to put to this cipher, I already made a game with the one of enough hours, in fact I arrived at Stalwart of the first DLC, with “everything done” up to that point, that is, I did all the missions, including the bounty hunter, just leaving for the last part of the base game in the Burial Isle, that means I arrived at Stalwart with level 14, Adra dragon, the dragon of the sky and Concenlhault were already dead.

I was not clear at any time what skills to give this cipher (at each level up), I was putting what seemed right to me, if I followed the skills recommended by MaxQ in that build guide, even though I made a couple of changes by preference staff, but I had doubts about what to put:

- "Two-handed weapons" goes well when using a two-handed arc, right?
- "It's worth using weapon focus" for war bows (in this case, because I use that type of bow as indicated by the guide and it seemed brutal to me xD) to gain that precision, knowing that I play in difficulty "difficult"?, the prior to POTD.
- "Apprentice's Sneak Attack", how does it work exactly? When does your damage come into play? is it ok for this cipher?
- "Psychic Backlash" is recommended? I think it's a good skill, but I have NEVER taken it because somewhere I read that it was not worth it, however I can watch videos on google where this skill leaves the boss stuned constantly xD
- "Any specific recommendations for armor?" Angio's and Blaidh Golan according to the situation is going well at play early / half right? I do not dare with light armor, the enemies go for me first, at the slightest carelessness I die xD even later there are light armor with good DR, so I end up using some.

In general I am not sure what skills to give the cipher, I like to put the one that increases the slots, because in the end between potions, scrolls and figurines I use all many item slots, my group consists of game characters, I like to follow his stories, even if he already knows them, are:

Eder -> It may not be a pure tank, but with the right equipment I have perfectly endured anything, it is a fierce xD

Aloth -> I am very used to it, it has CC magic especially at higher levels that help me a lot, and it does good damage, I always wear it with plate armor, but I use it at a distance, it would be better with plate and 1h + shield ? Any recommended combination of weapon and shield in that case?

Durance -> It is another essential for me, I endure a while with his initial armor, but then I put plates, and I always carry it with "Arquebuses", Durance is always next to my remote cipher for that reason, do you see it well? Would it be better to take it with a plate and 1h + shield? It seems to me that it performs quite well, but I need an opinion.

Hiravias -> Not long ago I tried the druid, and now it's another essential, in fact, Druid and Cipher are now my favorite classes hehe so Hiravias enters my group for its usefulness for both CC and area damage (as you call it ? DoA?)

Kana -> My off-tank, badge, 1h + shield and tank-focused skills in general (defenses, deflection, etc etc), dragon thrashed, just love the chanter, and Kana with the right equipment and skills practically endures me same as Eder, in fact it is curious how his deflection is placed above that of Eder reached a point xD

Ok that would be the group, plus my remote cipher, any recommendation regarding the skills (not cipher, of the others like the ones I set an example above) will be welcome, and any advice also, weapons on the partners, if better 1h + shield or other combination, etc.

Thank you!

Edited February 13, 2020 by davoker

[Boeroer]

10 hours ago, davoker said:

- "Two-handed weapons" goes well when using a two-handed arc, right?

Doesn't work with ranged weapons in PoE (does in Deadfire).

Weapon Focus: +6 stackable passive accuracy is always worth it.

Apprentice Sneak Attack works exactly as the normal Rogue Sneak Attack. Just lower dmg bonus. It's good on a Cipher. 

Psychic Backlash: used to be limited per encounter but that got lifted in one of the latest patches. It now retaliates every time your Will gets attacked. It is absolutely devastating for any dragon because they attack your will every few seconds with their terrifying aura. If you add Brutal Backlash this can kill a dragon.

Skills are things like mechanics, survival, athletics etc. I guess you mean talents? 

 

[davoker]

12 hours ago, Boeroer said:

Doesn't work with ranged weapons in PoE (does in Deadfire).

Weapon Focus: +6 stackable passive accuracy is always worth it.

Apprentice Sneak Attack works exactly as the normal Rogue Sneak Attack. Just lower dmg bonus. It's good on a Cipher. 

Psychic Backlash: used to be limited per encounter but that got lifted in one of the latest patches. It now retaliates every time your Will gets attacked. It is absolutely devastating for any dragon because they attack your will every few seconds with their terrifying aura. If you add Brutal Backlash this can kill a dragon.

Skills are things like mechanics, survival, athletics etc. I guess you mean talents? 

 

Yes, sorry for the confusion, my doubts are directed at talents, not skills hehe

If two-handed talent does not affect the bows, does it not affect other weapons at a distance? Arquebuses, etc.

Edited February 14, 2020 by davoker

[Silvaren]

1 hour ago, davoker said:

Yes, sorry for the mistake, I meant talents, not skills.

If two-handed talent does not affect the bows, does it not affect other weapons at a distance? Arquebuses, etc.

It affects only melee weapons.

[davoker]

https://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Psychic_Backlash (Psychic Backlash)

This talent is broken? says one per encounter, but I kept Adra Dragon constantly stunned, it was quite funny because he didn't give it time or to take a breath, he was stunned all the time, I just had to deal with the mob while 2 other characters were dedicated to giving the Dragona, it fell quite quickly, in less than 1 minute xD (I have broken my own record, with a lot of haha)

Edited February 19, 2020 by davoker

[Silvaren]

Iirc it was changed to initial state when it worked without any limits.

[davoker]

3 hours ago, Silvaren said:

Iirc it was changed to initial state when it worked without any limits.

Aa ok, thanks, then I can use it without fear, if it were the case that it is broken/bug, I would not use it hehe

[Boeroer]

It got changed to unlimited procs with one of the latest patches - before it was just too weak. I guess devs simply forgot about dragon auras proccing it non-stop. If they hadn't those pulsing fear auras it wouldn't be so OP.

[davoker]

On 2/21/2020 at 5:17 PM, Boeroer said:

It got changed to unlimited procs with one of the latest patches - before it was just too weak. I guess devs simply forgot about dragon auras proccing it non-stop. If they hadn't those pulsing fear auras it wouldn't be so OP.

It almost hurts to use it, it hurts for the bosses , when I came to adra dragon with this talent, which is the first time I use it, I was speechless, literally the whole fight was stuned, I did not get to throw any breath and I think it did not even arrive to attack, he might attack once or twice with his head, but that's it, it was very easy to beat her, this talent is a lot of talent xD

Edited February 22, 2020 by davoker

[duncan37]

Hello, I want advice, a build of Cipher to start with story mode (easy)  and NPCs.

Better Culture and Background to start ?

 

I found builds but they all date and I don't know if it's still valid, some contradict themselves a little:

 

Tips for building basic PNJs ?

 

I have POE1 and WM1 & 2 on PC

 

Thank you

Edited April 6, 2020 by duncan37

[mr_raider]

9 hours ago, duncan37 said:

Hello, I want advice, a build of Cipher to start with story mode (easy)  and NPCs.

Better Culture and Background to start ?

 

I found builds but they all date and I don't know if it's still valid, some contradict themselves a little:

 

Tips for building basic PNJs ?

 

I have POE1 and WM1 & 2 on PC

 

Thank you

Il tell you a little secret, race and culture change nothing in the long run. Regardless of race and culture combo, you always get the same number of stat points. The main difference is the racial bonus. As such your race should be based on playstyle.

Wood elf is good for ranged characters. Coastal amaua for toughness. Hearth Orlan for roguish types. Boreal dwarf will make your life a lot easier for the first 2/3 of the game.

For stats, I suggest a balanced approach:

 

M:15

C:10

D:15

P:15

Int:15

R:08

Regardless of playstyle I would suggest your first three talents be Greater focus, Draining whip and biting whip.

 

After that you can focus on ranged, two handers or two weapon style, or even go defensive. If you want to specialise in slaughtering Drake's and dragons, get the two backlash talents. Apprentices sneak attack is always good too.

[Boeroer]

I would argue that weapon focus should be your first talent since its impact is biggest in the early game - but the rest:  

 

[duncan37]

Hello.

The stats are balanced. I'm ok

I found this guide (3.05) but no update to 3.07.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=871584933

what are the changes for a cipher melee dps build.

what do you think ?

Spell : Antipathetic field>whisper of treason>mental binding>psychovampiric shield>recall agony>soul ignition>puppet master>silend scream>borrowed instinct>disintegration>time parasite.

@Boeroer What talents can i take ?

Greater focus> Draining whip>biting whip>

 

Ps : i want to begin easy mode before to start in a more difficult mode

 

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by duncan37

[mr_raider]

5 hours ago, Boeroer said:

I would argue that weapon focus should be your first talent since its impact is biggest in the early game - but the rest:  

 

Yeah on POTD it would help. On normal, it can probably wait. Early on you may be better off using whatever you get your hands on. I used durance's staff until level 5 or so. Then switched to dual wielding sword of daenysis and march steel dagger, to finally settle on ruffian weapons with dual sabres or stillettos.

 

The good news is ciphers are fairly cheap to Respec. You can always switch weapon focus talents later as better weapons become available.

[duncan37]

I like the idea of a little role-playing and consistency game.

who can do the most, can do the least

Edited April 7, 2020 by duncan37

[Boeroer]

2 hours ago, mr_raider said:

Yeah on POTD it would help. On normal, it can probably wait.

As PotD player I am biased. You are right. On normal or even easy it can def. wait.

[duncan37]

15 hours ago, mr_raider said:

For stats, I suggest a balanced approach:

 

M:15

C:10

D:15

P:15

Int:15

R:08

i can't with Pâle Elf !

[Boeroer]

2 hours ago, duncan37 said:

 

@Boeroer What talents can i take ?

 

Here's a list of talents that I find useful for a cipher (no particular order):

• Weapon Focus (whatever weapon group you like best)
• Biting Whip
• Draining Whip
• Greater Focus
• Apprentice's Sneak Attack
• Outlander's Frenzy (until you get Time Parasite)
• melee Cipher specifically:
  • Veteran's Recovery
  • Two Weapon Style / One-Handed Style / Two-Handed Style (depending on your weapon choice)
  • Weapon and Shield Style (with shield)
  • Savage Attack (especially after getting Borrowed Instincts)
  • Vulnerable Attack (melee Cipher when reaching 0 recovery, thsi can be done with dual wielding and/or any speed weapon + Time Parasite; especially when using light weapons)
  • Spirit of Decay (with Bittercut)
• randed Cipher:
  • Marksman
  • Gunner (ranged Cipher with guns or crossbows) OR
  • Quick Switch & Arms Bearer (Island Aumauan ranged Cipher with 4 guns or crossbows, switching after each shot)
  • Penetrating Shot (ranged Cipher with blunderbuss or Golden Gaze - or a ranged weapon with speed enchantment + Time Parasite after reaching 0 recovery)
  • Dangerous Implements (with wand, scepter or rod)
  • Heart of the Storm (with Stormcaller)

 

[Boeroer]

5 minutes ago, duncan37 said:

i can't with Pâle Elf !

Yes you can.

You should get 78 points with race and cultural background (like e.g. Living Lands). The background also gives you a bonus point.
All in all you'll have 78 points to distribute. And in the example there are 78 points. So it should be possible. 

[duncan37]

yes i forget Culture

Thank you, i read this

 

The choice of my weapons and equipment will have little importance in a not difficult game mode.

Antecedent are a few importance  to start ?

 

What talents can i take for compagnons ?

 

Edited April 8, 2020 by duncan37

[duncan37]

My build

 

Quote

Pale Elf / The White that Wends / Explorer

Cipher Melle dps / 2 weapons or shield

15/10/15/15/15/8

Spell : Antipathetic field>whisper of treason>mental binding>psychovampiric shield>recall agony>soul ignition>puppet master>silend scream>borrowed instinct>disintegration>time parasite.

 

But I don't know how to build my companions ?

 

[mr_raider]

2 hours ago, duncan37 said:

My build

 

 

But I don't know how to build my companions ?

 

Look at this thread for ideas:

 

 

I used Kana for the chanter build. Hiravias for the druid build. And Aloth for the wizard. I subbed in ranged implement talents on Aloth instead of melee. I custom built my Paladin and Priest. Pallegina comes fairly late in the game. Durance is only useful for his staff which I swipe. After that he sits at the stronghold doing escort duty.

My suggestion is to have priest with you, regardless of party build.

[duncan37]

I wanted to say companons npc (Aloth, Ader, Durance...)

but I can help myself with these build ?

[mr_raider]

3 hours ago, duncan37 said:

I wanted to say companons npc (Aloth, Ader, Durance...)

but I can help myself with these build ?

Yeah. You wont get the exact stat spread, but you can use the talents listed there. It doesn't matter since you can compensate with gear for crappy stats.

 

For Eder look at the fighter builds in the builds thread for inspiration. If you want specific recommendations someone can help, since I rarely use fighters in my party.

[duncan37]

ok thank you