global_74

arent you the genius that suggested KOTOR II is BETTER than KOTOR I?

your grammar is as lucid as your logic when you hit reply. here's a link for you: http://odl.vwv.at/english/odlres/res8/Grammar/grammar.htm

did you read my first post, or can you read?

as usual, the syncophants come to the rescue. a predictable response from a non-critical thinker fact 1 Obsidian developed KOTOR II fact 2 Obsidian made some FATAL errors in the game design fact 3 If Obsidian makes KOTOR III, intelligent people wont buy it (this doesnt apply to you) fact 4 you and all the other morons on this site that continue to defend this game will buy ANYTHING that Obsidian puts out. Therefore, your opinion doesnt matter fact 5 The gaming community doesnt tolerate bad games being sold for $50.00 retail. Obsidian is on thin ice and if they slip again even your adoring words wont save the company PEACE

KOTOR2: The Incompletion Controversy By Craig Dixon Upon reaching the later events of KOTOR2, it becomes clearly evident that the game has suffered greatly from its short time in development. It's been uttered on forums around the internet but no major site has been willing to admit it or say it...LucasArts rushed this game onto shelves for holiday sales before it was ready to be released. The latter part of the game is clearly missing cut scenes, certain subplots and many elements of the main plot are left unresolved, gaping plot holes emerge that are never explained, supporting characters of the player character's party completely disappear from the game, never to appear again, with NO explanation as to where they are (evidence of these issues can be found by clicking on the hyperlinks that are provided at the bottom of the page). Bugs have ruined entire files, many gamers have reported constant crashes, having to restart the game entirely, quests that cannot be completed due to bugs, and a generally poor frame rate. The final cut scene, what some people have called a "cliff hanger" is lacking in even the slightest bit of resolve to be considered a cliff hanger. Let's take a look at "The Empire Strikes Back", which some people have inaccurately compared the game to. "Empire" was a true cliff hanger, it was an example of masterful story telling, and though it was a cliff hanger even it had some resolve, enough to let you comprehend the story. Luke is rescued from his certain doom and is given a new robotic hand, Leia and Luke look out from aboard a Rebel ship into the galaxy knowing they face more challenges. I won't give away any "spoilers" (if it's possible for this non-ending to have any) but the ending would be comparable to ending "Empire" at the moment when Han is frozen. Complete games, books, movies, or any form of medium that is telling a story simply do not end in such a manner! It's preposterous! In the past few weeks, problems that have arisen as a result of the game's incomplete state have become more and more evident. Numerous audio clips containing lines of cut dialogue have been found within folders on the game discs, events from the games original script that were cut (such as a more fleshed out ending) have also emerged. One of the strongest pieces of evidence to support the accusations of the game's incompletion is a sub-plot involving G0T0 and Bao-Dur's remote droid. A conflict arises between the two in a video sequence that was left in game and yet a resolution is never shown on-screen. According to the development team themselves in a recent interview with RPG Vault "...we had this incredible design for a planet of droids. We actually did the first pass on art and built the character models for the location. But we had to look at the schedule and make a big cut after E3. We cut the entire planet. " Not surprisingly, it was a planet you were to visit late in the game

I was utterly ridiculed by the syncophants on this site when I expressed my displeasure over KOTOR II. I was called all kinds of names for expressing my opinion on an incomplete game. http://www.theforce.net/jedicouncil/editorials/030405.asp now (as I predicted) Obsidians reputation has been tarnished by the problems/glitches/bugs in KOTOR II. They have gained notoriety for all the wrong reasons. I have since traded in KOTOR II , but I kept KOTOR I. why? because KOTOR I is a superior game with a superior story, gameplay, and ending. I hope that Obsidian can listen and learn from the many mistakes they made and somehow salvage their reputation or they are gonna have mad problems in the future......

KOTOR set the bar very high. In terms of replay value and innovation, few games can touch it. TSL has some good qualities, but the storyline and character development were god awful. its funny now that KOTOR II is out, all the obsidian apologists try to discredit KOTOR instead of admitting to the problems in KOTOR II.

there is nothing subtle about telling a plague carrier to kill himself. Kreia will praise you for this act of persuasion. there is nothing subtle about telling a starving man to piss off. Kreia will scold you if you help the weak or heal the sick. so, FROM A LS JEDI PERSPECTIVE, Kreia is a terrible teacher. She doesnt believe in the Jedi Code, and therefore, isnt capable of retraining a LS Jedi. which is why the game made no sense when I played LS. but when I played DS, Kreia had nothing but praise for me. each time I mind tricked a person into doing my own selfish bidding, Kreia was there to praise me and I gained more influence over her.

for a Jedi, Kreia makes a terrible teacher. she discourages you from helping others (the beggar on Nar Shadaa, the Ithorians on Telos) she encourages to create more "echoes" in the force by killing or by forcing others to kill themselves. (the plague carrier on Nar Shadaa) she is a Sith and Sith dont make good trainers for Jedi because she doesnt believe in the Jedi code.

yes, I have had those probs as well as an error message that says the KOTOR II disc is a DVD and that I need to install the proper converter to use it.

Ive played both LS and DS and DS makes much more sense. As a LS guardian, it makes NO sense to keep Kreia (an obvious Sith) in your midst.

The game makes much more sense. Kreia really opens up to you early. She gives you much needed answers about Revan, Atris, the Sith that hunt you etc.... I even made her mention Darth Traya while we were on Peragus. Unfortunately, The ending goes VERY bady after you kill all the Jedi Masters. When you return to Dantooine, if all the Jedi are dead, the game completely falls apart. I had the handmaiden in my party after Kreia/Traya inexplicably assaults me, and Kreia is supposed to leave with the handmaden to Telos. But as soon as I wake up, the handmaiden is back in my party! its just not a very good game LS or DS. but at least when you play DS, more answers are available to you from the beginning.

agreed. I played KOTOR II, twice. Once as LS - terrible terrible experience Once as DS - better experience. you get alot more answers out of Kreia/Traya if you're evil. but its just not a very good game.

exactly. each game is supposed to be a self contained storyline. KOTOR II leaves too many questions to be considered a good game this game was nothing compared to KOTOR I in terms of story line, NPC's, load time, robustness, etc....

this thread is about a sub-par sequel to a great game.

Bring on Jade Empire, Im ready!!! If Bioware doesnt get it, then give it to a third party.

how.... clever. Bioware: hands down. Obsidian shouldnt be trusted with the third installement. They TOTALLY dropped the ball with part 2

Im with you. The game was lacking in some very important areas. I gave it a 6.5 myself, and now Im being attacked on all sides. I wonder how many times you have been insulted in this thread?

[translation] Laozi: "I have no logical reason to hate the Kyle Katarn character, in fact I never even beat the Jedi Outcast game! I just thought it would be cool to join in on the fun and start insulting someone I disagree with." [/translation] ahhh... clarity

***uses force sense*** I predict that I will be insulted many more times by the dark forces of the sith (and by the sith,I mean the fake sith;not the true sith)

well I've been taking some Ginko Biloba, but its just not working. perhaps Yoda will share some of his 'special' herbs? hmmmm?

thanks again. it takes alot of courage to call people names that you disagree with. why are you so hostile? Kyle was a way better character than 'The Exile' In fact, 'The Exile' is not a very interesting character at all. I would have rather played the entire game as Bao Dur or even Visas. if you disagree, can you tell me why without the grade school level insults? thanks!!

***waits for GhostofAnakin to grow up and stop the name calling*** (w00t) are you gonna act like an adult or what? Im not gonna call you any names, Im here to discuss a GAME. thanks! :cool:

thanks for the clarification. Seeing as how is such a MAJOR CHARACTER in KOTOR I, I mean, her is a pretty important power. So, if Obsidian chooses to show , then they could at least explain why the Sith aren't hunting her, or why she gave up the Order, or something. They give no clear explanation for her being there and thats a major hole in the plot. I never read the guides, and I saved Yuthura in the first one. She ends up on Dantooine. Obsidian had three choices 1. Yuthura was slain 2. Yuthura was spared 3. Yuthura was saved thats not a alot of coding to do, especially if its ONLY FIVE YEARS from KOTOR. this was a sequel wasnt it?

your agenda has already been exposed. go back and read the thread BEFORE you call someone (or their actions) ignorant its just plain courtesy :cool: BACK TO THE GAME DISCUSSION: the notion of an exile from the Jedi Order has already been done in the Star Wars Jedi Knight II : Jedi Outcast game. I enjoyed that game more than TSL because 1. Kyle Katarn was a more interesting character 2. The story was well thought out and lucid 3. The ending was actually an 'ending' 4. IT WAS AN IMPROVEMENT when comparing it to its predecessor: Jedi Knight