Osvir
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Posts posted by Osvir
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Personally feel like something like this should be considered:
Critical Hit Chance
Hit Chance
Miss Glance Chance (Ti-hi!)
Critical Miss Chance
Now to go advocate Lance weapons!
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Additionally, something like this? (updated)
If you own Dishonored you can start up a game and when you encounter the Empress you'll notice her placement and also notice that she is shrouded by an invisible wall, this is because (I think) she has her own "assets" and her own "Animation Box" which renders it impossible to enter her "Bubble" basically, because she an animation sequence within it.
"Can combat be handled somewhat similarly?", is what I am flirting with, and you share those "Bubbles" with enemies and encounters.
The second picture (with the 3 monsters) could also be a single monster, you could stretch the "Bubble" depending on distance, and at a certain distance the "Animation" that Player+Enemy share together "activates".
Additionally in the third example (overhead) there is a box surrounding the 3 monsters+Player.
Could there be a difference in combat animations between Party vs 1 enemy and Party vs 3 enemies? Do the 3 enemies use a certain tactic that 3 enemies together can use? Does 1 single enemy use another tactic?
What I'm trying to say is, could those 3 monsters+Player be specifically animated together as one "Bubble" as well, and still retain the "1v1" experience? Could you get the 1v3 experience even?
In some ways I'm thinking "Skeleton Guard" from Legends of Grimrock, in one "unit" they are just 1 Skeleton, but in others they are 4 Skeletons walking together as one unit (even if they are copy+paste, that's kind of the thing I'm going at).
Are there hitboxes? Does there need to be hitboxes if the animation is fluid enough in design/development at a get-go?
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^Great insight and something I think should be accountable for.
Enemy Rangers giving cover fire and using guerrilla tactics on you if their morale goes down. Perhaps even employ some specific "Low Morale" tactics (on the AI that is). Rogue's throwing traps at you..
But it could also make the climatic battle draw out to an annoyingly "too long" chase where the enemy (that you can take down in 1 hit) throws traps at you. Shoots arrows to cover their Fighters and generally pokes at you with great frustration.
One scenario that I can see though which could be pretty epic is if you've taken down most of the enemy but there still some left who actually manage to turn the tide to their favor (Rangers shooting arrows on your party, the Fighters re-routes and re-positions themselves, flanking the group and manages to deal some damage before my party takes them down in an epic and intense showdown).
EDIT P.S: Chasing some of the paniced enemies in Baldur's Gate was a bore by itself somehow, I'd rather the enemies not run away (unless fast enough that you can't catch up to them unless you throw an arrow to their face at the edge of the Fog of War as they are about to get away).
An enemy getting away should also yield more reputation from the faction the enemy was apart of.
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One thing at a time I think Lephys.
Get the "Main Health" (in essence, Stamina) right and you can add additions to it.
Priority should be something like:
1. Get "Main Health" right (Stamina)
2. Get Mortality right based on the "Main Health" factor
3. Get Combinations right between the two.
Just some thoughts/brainstorming/developer insight armchair philosophy on how melee combat could be somewhat handled:
"Attack"
1. Attack (Stamina)
2. Hit or Miss?
3a. If Hit. Go to 4.
3b. If Miss. See "Block" 2b
4. Enemy Block Roll (Same as "Block" really)
5a. If Hit, Enemy looses Health (Mortality)
5b. If Psuedo-"Miss", Enemy+Player looses Stamina in a new dice roll (See "Struggle")
6. If Critical Hit: Hit entirely and powerfully
7. If Critical Miss: Miss entirely (Lose Stamina+Morale/Effect+Health sometimes?)
"Block"
1. Hit or "Miss"?
2a. Hit: You take Health damage (with Mortality "Off" you'd instead take Stamina damage?)
2b. Miss: Block/Dodge/Parry etc. etc. (See "Struggle")
3. Critical Hit: Player takes more damage
4. Critical Miss: Enemy misses entirely.
"Struggle"
1. "Missed" attack.
2. Block/Dodge/Parry, could they statistically have different tactical values?
3. Who wins the struggle?
4a. If Player, lose less Stamina.
4b. If Enemy, lose more Stamina.
If I were to scry in the matter I would guess we're at some "0.4" in discussion with actual discussion on about a 3.5 level, in development it sounds something like "0.1" or "0.2" even.
What is Critical Hit and Critical Miss then?
Josh is only talking about Hit and Miss no? Critical Miss+Critical Hit aren't taken into account at this point so (or thought about at this point?)... maybe those will accommodate to those who want the possibility to miss? (me too!) In my opinion it adds intensity, "The party can miss attacks" and gives them this sort of "No one is perfect" feeling to combat.
It'll make me sit on my toes and be frustrated on higher difficulty yelling "Why did you miss!?!?" in an important battle which is a sense of odd enjoyment as well, because when the character in question manages to get that vital last hit on a random encounter I'll be celebrating in adrenaline and joy
Note and general suggestion (for a broader consensus): Just because "Parry/Dodge/Block" might not be a part of P:E visually or graphically, perhaps it could be represented in dice rolls and in the form of a "Log".
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What is a Hit and what is a Miss?
Sounds simple enough and I don't think anyone needs to explain that.
To me it sounds more like "This is what we've got thus far" more so than something about "This is what we are intending to do" (that whole Formspring discussion).
How is Obsidian thinking about this? You "Hit" the enemy, does that remove their health or their Stamina? What kind of strike did you manage to do? Likewise, what does it imply when you are getting hit? Do you lose Stamina or Health? If Stamina I can see how you lose half your stamina if the enemy "misses" you. What is it that you do that makes them miss you? (Kind of)
Example of suggestion/if this is how it works (let's say you've got 100 stamina):
1. You attack enemy (lose some minor 1-5 Stamina? Does a critical hit cost more stamina? Critical miss?)
2. Enemy attacks you, does the 1/2 "miss" attack. You lose 1/2 of the stamina of if they had hit? (Because you blocked/dodged) if they had done 20 Stamina damage originally, you'd lose 10 Stamina.
Narratively, in the combat log, it could say "You blocked!" or "You parried" or "You dodged!" etc. etc.. Hence mitigating some of the Stamina loss you could have taken. If the attack would break through that, however, you'd take health damage.
The point to remember when discussing this topic: Don't forget that it is Stamina that is your "Main Health Pool", Mortality is a second layer which probably gets implemented on top of the Stamina mechanic.
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I guess in some ways it is "Smileys" that I'm advocating for (and I bare no shame in it). But more stylishly artistic to the character appearance.
And in some ways it is easier to express gratitude in two symbols
Than in a long passage of words. An even greater effect is when the words and the two symbols are combined.
- Full plate and packing steel.
- Full plate and packing steel.versus
*with happiness* - Full plate and packing steel.
*with sadness* - Full plate and packing steel.
The end effect is the same.
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Or a riddle inscribed on several different weapons, leading into a great plot and scheme of things. Either unique weapons or "random loot number" (but if random loot number there's the struggle of picking up every single thing as a design. Just saying a personal "No" to the latter).
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As a Low Profile character, can a Cipher read minds and pick up quests for people in a different way? Magically and miraculously for the NPC's all of their purposes were fixed. They praise some God, but in truth it was you.
Does a quest necessarily have to be "finished" by turning it into the NPC? Can you instead of "interacting" with the NPC through standard use kind of... make them realize it was done somehow. Does a complete quest always end at face-to-face conversations and gift-givings?
How do you pick up quests? Can a quest be given to you by hearing chatter through a door?
Can you solve a quest before it has been realized? (e.g., having an item in possession all along that turns out to be the key to redemption or whatever cliche you can think of). Maybe you stumble across a rock that is of some importance in a greater scheme elsewhere, on a stranded lost island you and your group (or whatever quest), decides who does what by the decisions of the rock.
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An intelligent (or sentient) weapon doesn't necessarily have to be the case, but an intelligent weapon in it's finding and intelligently being inserted in various plots in other side-quests a la entering the bar tavern and the barkeeper yells out:
"THAT IS MY GRANDFATHERS GREAT-AXE! THIEF!" and will cause "Barfight"-mechanic between factions @bar and according to your reputation with factions. Maybe?
A tactical weapon, intelligent in its use for the player. Such as a Torch. I think this goes into here as well (Weapons that Enemies react to).
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What is effected by morale?
Stamina? Reputation? Resting outdoors gives less stamina/morale but doing it too much deteriorates stamina/morale over time? (i.e. have to go to an inn every now and then again). Taking down an enemy gives morale? Getting to point B (stealth) gives party morale/courage?
Is Morale and Courage the same thing? (Simplified: Yes, but could one apply for one type and the other for another type?)
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Very much an "if" but, if you could become a master swordsman, or you do some great task for a village. Could your reputation not spread? Could it even strike fear into an opposing faction narratively and mechanically (morale)? If everyone speaks about the main character in one town, could not messengers/traders pick it up and spread it somehow? Depends on how Obsidian does it.
How can you mechanically deal with reputation as well?
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Additionally: Would an action in South Dyrwood be noticed by the North Dyrwood mechanically directly, or does it take a "messenger" (like in BG) who needs to travel (physically-in-game time) from point A to point B before Northern Dyrwood knows what you did or talk about the things you did (though not knowing that you are the one maybe?).
How does Reputation spread across the world?
Personally I would like to avoid the "World News Flash!" where suddenly everyone knows who you are. If I help out a town with some quests, they should like the character depending on how I do it. I could be a High Profile character in one town, but a Low Profile character in another town.
Then there's the question of this, which hauntingly has this feeling of "Alignments":
High Evil Rep
High Neutral Rep
High Good Rep
Mid Evil Rep
Mid Neutral Rep
Mid Good Rep
Low Evil Rep
Low Neutral Rep
Low Good Rep
How I see it btw..
Reputation = Explains what your character does in the world.
Alignment = Explains your characters personality and what they did in the world.
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What if someone spills the beans? "Hey hey!!! This is the guy who is the guy who's done this thing thing, so coool!!! *yells* Hear ye hear ye!!"
How would you represent your reputation? By a banner? Can you lose reputation? Can you go into "hiding" if your reputation becomes too "hot"? How do you change reputation and would equipment play a part in "reputation"? (Changing Light Armor to Medium Armor makes people start to forget who you are or do you need some better and stronger method?).
Is the Reputation based off of 1 character in your party or your entire Party? Or is it only based off of the main character?
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This post pretty much:
This goes into this thread too I guess:
Items reacting to certain types of enemies. Glowing or whatnot, advantage of having weapon out is that you get more vision+know that enemies are around. Likewise, the disadvantage is that you are clearly easier to spot in the darkness if you have it out. Could allow for some strategical and tactical decisions and emerge interesting situations.
Suggested thread by mrstark.
Love the idea of weapons/equipment reacting to enemies nearby! That idea absolutely deserves its own thread, Osvir
. There's tons of potential in that idea!Having the "Orc Slayer" makes Orc's lose morale? Maybe they hate the sword and they instead gain morale? (that's only related if there's going to be some sort of "Morale").
Likewise, having a Torch/Light source out could allow you a safe passage through a horde of bugs/wolves or whatnot that back of due to the light? ("I don't like the light"-monster)
Thoughts? What's the potential with the idea?
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Of course, all I am saying is that if anyone deserves the privilege it is the ones who paid for the privilege. No?
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Awesome idea!
Give the reputation to the Quest giver :D
But that would require you to do the quest (depending on its impact and/or structure) rather low profile-ish as well. Leaving witnesses or someone sees you somehow, would the Quest giver get the credit even if you gave it to him?
"You caused too much ruckus!! Now no one will believe that it was me!" could you do a quest with some sort of "Mask" (Dishonored) and then give the mask to the quest giver? Could that cause people to hunt the Quest giver instead of you? (E.g., a couple of days "in-game time" later the quest giver is gone from where he was standing~ and "Commoner" banters can talk about it as if something that "happened").
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Basically:
High Profile (High Reputation)
versus
Low Profile (Low Reputation)
How many chases after you as a "High Profile" character, how many wants autographs? How much ego stroking? Quests that you wouldn't find before? (Some old man trusting the White Knight wherein he doesn't trust the random Low Profile character).
How many assassins go after you? How many who would've attacked you on one playthrough just don't because you have a high enough reputation, how many wants to challenge out of honor?
As a "Low Profile" character, does that necessarily mean that you are a Rogue/Stealth/Non-Lethalist? No I don't think so. It just implies you don't leave any witnesses of your passing and are very adept at covering up your tracks. Might not get as many assassins after him, but could end up in fights where a "High Reputation" character does not.
How does Reputation affect the game, on low's and high's?
Is Mid-Reputation important?
Does a Low Profile open up more possibility for more suburb Quests, thieves guild or whatnot, but locks out from some High Profile quests? Vice versa.
Hugs, have a great day
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Absolutely love this idea and excellently presented Solonik!
edit 2: Have factions take over your stronghold and fight back and forth across it / destroy anything in it in the process while you can't defend it / they aren't aligned with you. Whereas if they are aligned with you, one faction can help you hold it when they enemy is clear. Would make a lot of players hilariously mad.
This however... I like it but I am wondering.. what if my Batcave is hidden and secret?
Will there be several different places/locations to get a stronghold?
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Inspiration seems to be waning in the new year...
Nominates this as the silliest idea yet proposed on the forums...
Heh, I think the topic title "Player Karma" would've been better tbh but oh well..
Karma basically needs to be designed, it's not some spiritual fluff that happens by itself (entirely).
"If I do A I get punished by B but if I do B I get punished by A"
Basically yes it is a silly idea, but it is not my idea ->, it is something that is being used in many games... I think even Lands of Lore has some "I'm bored!" banters. I am simply asking if "Hey, is there some way to tweak it up some levels or not?".
In Baldur's Gate you can get hit by a lightning bolt as well (Why does Khalid always get struck though? In like 3-4 games I've played, always Khalid).
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Isnt a private backers forum exactly what BSN is? You cant comment unless you have bought the game? Never did like that mentality.
There is a clear difference between BSN, Wasteland 2 forums, P:E forums and PV13 forums.
The most clear one is that BSN is discussion about already released games, P:E, Wasteland 2 and PV13 is all games in development.
At BSN you discuss the past, and paying for it... yep I agree with you that f- sucks.
At the rest of them you discuss the future. How could it not be good to have a more direct-intent-on-purpose discussion for a better future on a private forum where people (on this forum!?) discuss with the developers? Go go go!! Make the most epic game ever
P.S. I'm advocating for a higher tier private forum (250$+ or so). I wouldn't even be a part of that forum, but if I could guess what's best for the development... introduce some of these people on these forums to some more direct communication regardless
as I've said in some other posts across the board:The people (probably you who read this
) here has some wicked ideas, thoughts, reason, loyalty, intelligence etc. etc. that I think could be beneficial."Creative Quality Assurance", maybe even be able to be a part of the "Technical Quality Assurance" during Beta Test as well (or those who are Beta test tier could go for the Creative QA as well?).
Though, I remember reading something somewhere where an Obsidian developer spoke about that they want to create some sort of "Beta environment" as quick as possible so that they can hear opinions or whatnot, so they're probably already on it. That's probably going to create some sort of private forum as well.
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In theater, the actors and director's fret over an emotion "reading" well to the crowd. Books can give the audience direct access to thoughts and motives. In film the script and the cast's acting are what gives the audience the motivation and emotions of the characters. Video games are a newer story telling medium, where do they fall in.
Is PE, when it comes to dialogue and story, more interactive book or a theater stage? The OP seems to be a fan of the Sin Megami Tensei: Persona series (JRPG's with actual role-play, branching paths, multiple endings), and while I think the kawaii angle is a bit overplayed in this thread, I agree that using a similar approach to telling the story in PE could benefit the story telling if a theater approach was being taken.
I don't think that a few pics do the system justice. Play Persona 4 on the PS Vita or PS2 (if you can find it), or find game play on Youtube and mute the video.
Out of the 4 examples/methods in my original post is that I provided only 1 jRPG example.
See what I'm saying about the jRPG thing?
Also, I think people don't read all the post so *shrug*
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I think it could be fruitful, if done right.
I think that what we are doing here is pretty much Creative QA with no developer/boss interaction (and it shouldn't be, but on a forum that would be private and on purpose) there could be some actual discussion of what could be in the game and direct feedback.
Basically a private forum could allow developers to bounce their ideas more privately with the fans. It would require dedicated and loyal fans, which I think there's a lot of here.
All I'm saying is that if they did a private forum with some of the people here on this more public one and directly communicate with some of you guys, I believe P:E could become so much better. So many wicked ideas
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Probably because you've gone great length to cite and create examples that are overflowing with kawaii?
Those are simply just "This is method A, B, C, D" and I thought people would understand that but oh well... Romneys are just jokes
Like I said in the other post: We are pretty much on the same page up until the portrait aspect (I think that a portrait with visual expression could add a lot, whilst you don't).
- Full plate and packing steel.
) here has some wicked ideas, thoughts, reason, loyalty, intelligence etc. etc. that I think could be beneficial.
Reputation; The Famous One vs The Shaded One
in Pillars of Eternity: Stories (Spoiler Warning!)
Posted
I'd like to get a reputation (based on actions) as the Lucky or Unlucky one.
Getting a ton of cash, or stumbling through a quest poorly but with lots of luck.
Or being the "Unlucky" one, people kind of marking you as "Cursed" because you've got such a bad luck. Additionally what ogrezilla says: Trying to do good but failing at it horribly, but really really trying, branding the party as an unlucky party and some people might even scurry away in some fear.
"It is a marked one! Poor sod.."
Could a reputation be noticed by Gods? With a Low Profile, a God who enjoys darkness and subtle approach might even "contact" the Player. Likewise, a high-born noble and kind soul with a High Profile might draw the attention of other Gods.