Skarpen
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Posts posted by Skarpen
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33 minutes ago, Elerond said:
Required doping test for professional athletes show how futile it is to appeal to privacy of medical records when you want to do sports for living.
Doping is not medical treatment. It's a way to cheat. I don't really see any parallel here.
But still anti doping regulations are codified both by internal country laws and internationally. It's not like some sport organization does it on it's own.
As I stated before to BruceVC, you want to make this vaccines mandatory, please do. Legislation exists it's not like anyone would need to reinvent a wheel to do so. Until then no entity state or private should have any right to force anyone to take unmandatory medical treatment.
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Just now, ComradeYellow said:
Not sure why this got to the Coronavirus thread
My phone tricked me. Already asked the mod to move it where it should be.
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9 minutes ago, Gromnir said:
if a shipping/freight company is hiring a truck driver, chances are they require proof o' a clean driving record, a current class whatever driver's license and likely the prospect is asked to pass a drug test. not require such stuff and the new driver kills somebody in an accident while on drugs while driving one o' your trucks and chances are the shipping company gets sued and loses a whole lotta money. again, require basic proof o' safe driving record and being drug free is a reasonable precaution for the employer o' a truck driver.
Drivers license is not a personal information. It's part of the job competency like education degree skills etc. This is something employer can verify as well as personal traits which I already mentioned.
The truck company is only liable if they knowingly let intoxicated driver to drive. Otherwise only the driver is liable which is reasonable. But Europeans are far less frivolous with lawsuits then US. So maybe they just fighting with the problems they created.
Here if an employer suspects a hired driver to be under the influence of some substance he can only call the police to check it as he have no right to check it himself. Which is reasonable as he is in no way competent to perform such a test.
As stated before if a job requires any medical verification it is done by medical professionals as they are competent to perform such. And the employer only gets information there are no contraindications for the employee to work.
Then again, it's all codified. What conditions should be taken into account for what type of work. For example truck driver will have some different set of medical examinations than welder. Still nothing specific is going to the employer as again, and I cannot stress this enough, employer have no business dwindling in employees personal sensitive information.
This is a very fundamental principle for Europeans and East Europeans especially since we have been under Soviet occupation for decades where our life was substantially constantly invigilated and state owned. And I understand that Americans might not understand how it's important to us.
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10 hours ago, ComradeYellow said:
Democracy without the Rule of Law isn't democracy, it's chaos. Trumpism is fascism and chaos.
As someone who actually met fascists and communists face to face I can safely say no. Not by a longshot.
10 hours ago, BruceVC said:But now we cant be worried about the collapse of the USA due to chaos and fascism because its got a long to go before its anything like China.....when it gets to that level we must all get worried
It would be too late then wouldn't it? Being worried is good. Keeps one vigil.
9 hours ago, ComradeYellow said:U.S.A. will not collapse or be like China, ever.
Wouldn't be so sure. Would be nice if it wouldn't. But too many people are willing to surrender freedom for illusion of safety which is a slippery slope in that direction.
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14 minutes ago, BruceVC said:
Gorthfuscious why you making assumptions? Skarpen may be Uighur, he could a refugee ?
@Skarpen Are you a Uighur? Its okay if you are ....we all respect all opinions and feedback
No, I'm not Uighur. I'm mostly Slavic with some Lithuanian, Jewish and Kashub ancestry. But it's nice you didn't automatically made assumptions and asked
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1 hour ago, Gorth said:
I don't see a conflict there. You're the one who seems to flip flop a bit about whether it's good or bad to have a free market economy, support entrepreneurs etc. but now that is suddenly bad and now you want the state to overrule private companies decisions. One moment you don't really like the EU and the next moment their data protection laws are suddenly a good thing. Not much point in a debate if you keep changing your mind. If I don't a work place, I'm happy to leave and have done so in the past.
Edit: Explained in simple English:
Yes, I do favour things like minimum wages to prevent workforce exploitation, I do favour work safety regulations to prevent workers from become a literally expendable asset, I do favour the enforcement of anti discrimination measures etc.
No, I don't believe in a "top down" economy, where everything is decided by the those party members who are either the most ruthless or the most servile boot lickers. I do not believe people should be tied to hospital beds under guard while being forcefully injected with AZ vaccine.
I do believe companies have the right to require people to get vaccinated as part of their employment conditions.
It's a balancing act and we can disagree about where the sweet spot is between the extremes.
So you support government telling companies what to do in areas that actually affects the business but refuse government involvement when businesses stick their nose in areas they have no business interfering like employees private life and health? That's quite a weird position. Why would anyone support some schmuck right to dictate persons life just because he can afford to set a grocery store and hire someone is beyond me.
And I don't flip flop on EU. EU is such a vast organization that it's impossible for all it's decisions to be bad or all good. So I rather criticize the bad and praise the good. I know nowadays it's shun upon such stance and people rather deal in absolutes "this is all good", "this is all bad" but I think my approach is more reasonable. It's not like there wouldn't be some state regulations protecting personal freedom if the EU wouldn't have such laws. So it doesn't matter to me if it's from EU or local state.
Sure the free market and support entrepreneurs is ok. But I don't see how my personal health information is any part of business of the steel industry company I work for. Business can make business decisions all they want but they have no right to make decisions about my personal life, duh.
I lived under government tyranny and I'm not to eager to surrender to a corporate tyranny.
I agree it's a balancing act but I'm more in favor of balancing it around personal freedom rather than which master have more power government or corporate. I'd rather have no masters.
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7 hours ago, Hurlsnot said:
What, like tuberculosis?
What about it?
4 hours ago, Gromnir said:hurl works as a teacher. am assuming at least previous to initial employment he were tested for drugs. quite a few occupations require regular drug testing. commonplace. no more a liberty denial than covid-testing, eh? pee in a cup v. nasal swab?
in the US we current do tb tests at local state and fed facilities which has a high likelihood o' tb transmission. you wanna work in such a facility? prerequisite o' employment is you get a miniscule injection and two-to-three days later you need return so a medical practitioner can inspect the injection site to see if you are tb positive. furthermore, if there is a tb outbreak at the facility, chances are you need get regular tb tests. such testing will be accepted at va hospitals, jails, prisons, and is our understanding such tb testing may be done at schools if there is an outbreak.
before we began working for county level probation and previous to working at USAO, we had extensive psyche evaluations including a polygraph review. am thinking many law enforcement agencies make psyche evaluations standard, though am not certain how prevalent is polygraph testing. am recalling one o' the questions from a written psyche test asked us 'bout alice in wonderland. the rumour 'mongst applicants were that the question were meant to divine a likely embrace o' drug culture, or somesuch. anyways, when we were done with the verbal portion o' the psyche exam for our us attorney position, the psychiatrist asked us if we had any questions, so we asked 'bout the alice in wonderland question as part o' the written test. we mentioned how we answered honest (we did indeed enjoy alice) but we noted how there were a belief amongst those taking the test the question were linked to drug affinity. the psychiatrist seemed a bit surprised but he said he believed the question were not solo relevant but that collectively it represented a kinda aesthetic preference as 'posed to any kinda drug use susceptibility.
regardless, psyche profiles and testing is commonplace in the US and pretty much nobody complains 'cause there is at least a few jobs where being a psychopath is gonna be viewed as a negative.
nfl preseason is in full swing. the nflpa has worked extreme hard to avoid olympic standard drug testing, but drug testing is done. physical exams is also common and required as a prereq and for continued employment as an nfl player. suffer a concussion? if docs say your level o' concussion requires an mri, then you are getting an mri if you wanna stay employed in the nfl. sure hippa prevents your medical records from being shared w/o your approval, but as an nfl player if you don't wanna share med information with your team, you can go use your football skills elsewhere, perhaps becoming an all-time great ups driver or somesuch. the current group o' nfl players who is routine needing provide medical info to their teams but who is balking at nasal or oral swab testing to help limit the spread o' a deadly disease is hypocrites or profound stoopid.
etc.
HA! Good Fun!
Wow. So much for the land of the free, I guess. Are those at least codified somewhere or employers just do it willy nily? In Poland employers cannot even make breathalyser test on employee. They have to call the police if they suspect a person is intoxicated, to check.
There are some professions that require health certifications but the checking is made by health care providers, not the companies themselves and no medical records are ever held by some company. All they get is a plain "no contraindications for working" so if you have a condition that is not affecting the occupation employer will never know and if you do employer will never know what exactly that would be.
As stated above persons medical records are considered sensitive private information in Europe.
2 hours ago, Gorth said:It's entirely optional. Unlike say skin colour or gender, getting vaccinated is a choice. You can chose not to work there if you don't like the job requirements. Part of living in a free market economy. Unless you want the state to control those companies.
Aren't you a supporter of minimum wage and fair working conditions? You don't seem to mind state control of companies in that area.
It's kinda funny you guys consider for example Trump as despicable human being but are willing to give him your sensitive personal health information if he happens to be your boss. Wierd.
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1 hour ago, Raithe said:
"Especially if you're male...."
I always supported the girls right to wear shortest skirts, midriff tops and whatever they felt like wearing when I was in school
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10 minutes ago, Gromnir said:
now don't sacrifice what little integrity you might possess.
Ok, i'll try not to
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2 minutes ago, Gorth said:
Not entirely. It's also about the damage you can cause your workplace if not vaccinated.
OK, then why only covid? There are literally dozens of viruses, diseases, bacteria, funghi etc. you can bring to a workplace. Should your employer just be given your whole medical history? How about mental state? This can also bring damage to workplace if you have problems. Should your doctors just email everything to Katie from HR? How much of your personal life are you willing to give up to random people in the name of safety?
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21 minutes ago, BruceVC said:
And I am not saying this ban made sense, of course it didnt but to suggest it was a Muslim ban also cannot be true. Several countries on this list aren't even Muslim !!!
I know that. But someone at some point used the term Muslim ban and you know how nitpicky Gromnir is.
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8 minutes ago, BruceVC said:
Gromnir you are sounding a little annoyed
It seems for Gromnir the banning of whole religious group is so fundamentally against the principality of what USA is as a country that no amount of argumentation or rationalization that you could provide would change his stance on the matter even by inch. You cannot argue with someone's fundamental principles.
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2 hours ago, BruceVC said:
, you make me laugh
But on a serious note it shouldn't matter what people think if you support Trump, it is your choice and only you can decide. But can you share why you support Trump, their are many different reasons but they can differ from person to person ?
Trumps presidency did have several successful policies but you cant ignore how he handled the pandemic. But I am well aware how he connects with people
And another important point is Trump could be the next Republican presidential candidate....its not what I want but it has nothing to do with me.
Looking forward to him running again.
Look, if it's about Jerry from another department then yes it doesn't matter what he thinks of me. But get enough Jerries and it will matter. Did it matter what whites thought about blacks in SA during Apartheid? Or what Nazis were thinking about Jews in the 1940s?
1 hour ago, ComradeYellow said:Yeah well that's how white puritanical superstitious Westerners/Americans see China and especially North Korea, even though China offers lots of cheap public services and living costs are low, it's 40% cheaper to live in Shanghai than New York.
Massachusetts, for instance, is consistently ranked as the smartest state in the union, yet it's 40% above the national average in living costs. You'd think the smartest state would figure out a way to reduce costs but I think they like it that way. Why? Elitism. most likely.
Anyway it looks like the U.S. won the Summer Olympics, though it was a close call. China had adopted the Soviet model of state funded and regulated Olympics training for youths, I guess it might need more funding if the want to really kick @$$ next time around.
China and especially NK? You consider them to be one and the same? Anyway, no I don't. I had the opportunity to meet many Chinese students and they are a decent folks. And my close friend worked for 5 years in China. So on the matter of NK and China I'm not fond of their governments not the people as such.
Why would smartest people reduce the cost if they find the cost to quality ratio to be acceptable? It may be cheaper to live in Shanghai but are the standards the same?
Kudos to US athletes.
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38 minutes ago, BruceVC said:
But taking the vaccine is about your health
Yes, exactly. It is about health and personal medical information is protected by The General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR), the Data Protection Law Enforcement Directive and other rules concerning the protection of personal data. You know the EU laws and regulations you are so supportive of. And no entity can check, gather or require any medical information be it a store cashier or my employer. Therefore companies banning people on the basis of having a medical procedure or not will not fly in EU.
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1 hour ago, Gorth said:
You don't need to "actively" punish people to get a point across. Sometimes rewarding those who embrace an idea can do the same. I.e. like some of the major financial institutions are doing in the US. If you want to work for us, you better prove you've gotten two vaccine shots or you are not a proper fit for this company. Then it's entirely up to the individual to prioritize what they want in life. A job for said institution or look for work elsewhere (and elsewhere is shrinking). Nobody is forcing them at gunpoint. It's a free country after all.
Answer me this simple question. Would it be OK for companies to say:
"Prove to us you are 100% white or you are not fit to work in our company"
"Prove to us you are not a Muslim or you are not fit to work in our company"
"Prove to us you will not get pregnant or you are not fit to work in our company"
I don't know about you but I don't think any of those should be legal and companies should discriminate on basis other than job qualification and personal traits. In fact at least in Poland it's illegal for companies to do so. Definitely no one should be banned from work for not having an unmandatory medical procedure of any kind. Employer is not the owner of the employees.
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33 minutes ago, BruceVC said:
But yes it can be considered if we cannot achieve citizens being compliant and ignoring how the virus spreads
Compliant with what exactly? You must understand that right now the covid vaccines are not mandatory by any law anywhere. Yet constantly there is a talk how to punish or force people to take vaccine. Where do you see law and order in this equation? You cannot punish people for not doing something that is not mandatory in any way.
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2 hours ago, BruceVC said:
But before I go into more detail I just want to know if you are interested in understanding some of reasons Trump had support from certain countries and people.
You need to understand BruceVC that for some people Trump have to be the antichrist and his supporters all need to be bloodthirsty demons. They cannot be humanized or understand in any capacity beyond that they are all inherently evil from the day they were spawned in this world. Otherwise worldviews would crumble and some people would need to look in mirrors and see their own reflections and that's something they don't like to do. So don't get your hopes up on actually discuss the Trump and Trump supporters unless you want to be labeled as dissident
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14 hours ago, BruceVC said:
@Amentep, you were right....people are bypassing the vaccine passport system. But what is the next step? Should people be arrested to send a message
Why not whack them like you want to do to all unvaccinated?
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10 hours ago, Raithe said:
It's funny that this also works in reverse.
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4 minutes ago, Maedhros said:
It's just a way of giving nicknames over here. You take the adjective (in this case skarp/sharp) and add an en/one ending to the word to attribute it to someone in particular, as a situational nickname. Won't work in a written text, but it's relatively common when just talking.
No matter the adjective you can just add an "en" ending to it and it works as a nickname. When you think someone said something clever you call him "Skarpen". Though it's more often used ironically.
(I get that you probably didn't know this, but I still think it's a funny coincidence).
Interesting to know, thanks.
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So, I provide a couple of examples how different methods give different results and you still beat the same drum.
8 minutes ago, Gromnir said:and again, w/o any explanation as to your divination.
20 minutes ago, Skarpen said:Y
1 hour ago, Skarpen said:You are the only poster who regularly reference the guy since I got here and you don't always use his full nick
so I didn't have to divine anything just read your posts for the last couple of months...
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29 minutes ago, Gromnir said:
so, the person o' whom you were unable to discover 'cause there were no such user, you divined alternative names for your search?
You have some serious problems, you know. I just wrote to you:
1 hour ago, Skarpen said:You are the only poster who regularly reference the guy since I got here and you don't always use his full nick
so I didn't have to divine anything just read your posts for the last couple of months...
~30% Searched for 'Sharp_one, sharpie, sharp' in All Content (obsidian.net)
~50% Searched for 'sharpie' in All Content (obsidian.net)
~75% Searched for 'Sharp_one' in All Content (obsidian.net)
BTW: You clearly are not obsessed
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5 minutes ago, Gromnir said:
so again, you didn't actual search as claimed. you assumed
You are projecting. Yet again I might add.
What I actually wrote was:
"the search only returns mostly you referring to this guy"
Now you assumed:
1. I was using the forum search, which I might do or not. Google has better algorithms for searching forums content for example or I might have referred to a memory search.
2. I used only the phrase "Sharp_one" and not any variations. Which skyrockets your 2% you came up with.
3. I didn't narrow the results in any way, which for example a time frame of a 6 months would skyrocket your 2% to almost 100% at the time of my search.
So maybe take advice from yourself and stop assuming you know better what others did, do, would do, will do, think and meant.
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3 hours ago, Maedhros said:
(Also, I still think it's pretty funny that "skarpen" is slang for "sharp one" in my country).
Norway have a slang for some obscure forum nick? Weird.
Mine comes from:
Which is in Sweden and Sweden is not Norway. I think I have to clarify to not be accused of not reading links I post
Google also found some landmarks bearing the name in Norway, but search for skarpen slang meaning didn't return anything.
1 hour ago, Gromnir said:2%?
is another example o' you not doing as you claim. you said you did a search for sharp_one, but is clear you did not. can't reasonable get "mostly" from less than 2%. for some reason unclear, you assumed a level of interaction 'tween Gromnir and the bumbling fool who were sharp_one. the sad and funny o' it is if you had actual done as you claimed, you woulda' avoided the embarrassment o' the near identical mistake you made earlier by linking Grace's usatoday contribution. and predictable, you now feel compelled to defend yet another exaggeration/inaccuracy/mistake, just as @Gorth suggested the former poster known as sharp_one were incapable o' avoiding.
Sorry for triggering you. You are the only poster who regularly reference the guy since I got here and you don't always use his full nick so you might search for variations of the spelling. Regardless, it's clear even from your calculating the number of results that the obsession is strong. Seek help and I will try not to trigger you in the future.
, you make me laugh
A Fifth of Coronavirus
in Way Off-Topic
Posted
No it's not. Not even close. I edited my previous post, please check the addition.