Wrathful Sinspawn and Blessings Deck?

[Acroyear16]

OK, so I've had this happen a couple times now, and man is it frustrating!

 

(Apologies if this has been discussed already, I find the search on these forums to be unfriendly!)

 

I'm playing Trouble in Sandpoint - Legendary difficulty (not that this matters) and it's coming down to the wire -

I am on turn ZERO - no cards left in the Blessings Deck on my turn, but it's the start of my turn, and my explore reveals the Villain Erylium.

 

I can pull this off and defeat her, and still win the day!

 

Her power triggers and I select a character to summon the henchman Wrathful Sinspawn.

I select a character, defeat the henchman, which triggers IT'S power of rolling d6, and on a 1-3 it discards a card from the Blessings Deck.

As I am getting ready to blast the Villain to oblivion, the d6 is rolled, and it turns up in the 1-3 range.

 

The Blessings Deck is already at Zero, the game focuses in on the Zero in the blessings deck and the game ends, saying I have run out of time!

Huh?

No, I haven't! I still should get to finish my turn, shouldn't I?

The Sinspawn power doesn't say anything about ending the current characters turn!

 

Anyone else run into this?

Edited November 12, 2016 by Acroyear16

[Hannibal_PJV]

If you have to draw a card from the blessing deck and you can not, you lose the game. So this sound like it should be. Same as if you for some reason have to draw a card from your deck and can not, you are dead.

[Acroyear16]

Well, if that's the way dying is supposed to work, that needs to be addressed b/c that doesn't work properly then:

 

I have had situations where I have had characters run out of cards, were forced to discard/draw/reset (Barl Breakbones for example) and should have died, but didn't b/c the active hero still finished their turn and defeated the Villain.

[Hannibal_PJV]

It is delicate timing issue. There is from time to time discussion about this in the Paizo Pages too. It all depends what things you have to do before the winning condition is registered and what would happen after the winning condition is registered. For example closing the location power is before the winning condition, so if location forses you to draw a card from the playing deck, it happens before the winning condition happens. But for example resetting your hand is after that.

So not easy to keep exact timing right.

 

But temporary closing definitely happens before the winning condition is registered, so anything that should happen when temporary closing happens before you go to check if you did win or not.

 

When in doupt in these matters we normally ask from the mighty Hawkmoon

Edited November 13, 2016 by Hannibal_PJV

[269Hawkmoon]

Sorry, super busy lately. But, yeah, the blessing deck action you described is correct. From the most recent rulebook (Mummy's Mask):
 

If you have to remove one or more cards from the blessings deck for any reason and there are not enough cards to do so, the party loses the scenario.

 

 

And yes, if Barl Breakbones forces a character to reset their hand and they don't have enough cards to draw to their hand size, they should indeed die right then and there. You wouldn't necessarily lose the scenario at that point. Though, if it was their turn, their turn would end immediately, meaning you wouldn't finish the encounter with Barl.

 

If you've had cases where you were force to reset your hand and couldn't fully draw but didn't die, you've found a bug and should report it.

[Ethics Gradient]

Sorry, super busy lately....

Glad to see you're back!  

I was beginning to suspect that you were kidnapped by Obsidian and locked in a basement somewhere to manually sort out all the rules interactions.