Playing a tank (PoTD)

[Brimsurfer]

Hey guys I am planning to start a new PoTD campaign as a tanking class, either Paladin or a Fighter. As we know that tanking has changed a lot since the game came out and now the tanks have harder time to keep the enemies engaged. 

 

I would like some advise on stats, items and the type of abilities I should go for to successfully play the role of the main tank.

 

This is for PoTD and what works on Normal may not work on PoTD so please be mindful of that.....

 

All tips and advise will be greatly appreciated, thanks

[Koth]

There are a few threads going around at the moment that discuss the possibility that neither Fighter nor Paladin make the best tanks now largely due to the fact that the AI has changed in 2.0 and 3.0 patches to make them ignore super defensive / low dps tanks by activly ignoring engagement and running over to pound your squishies. Consequently you don't want to make your tanks "too" tanky if that makes sense.

 

So, the alternative is to make the main tank a Monk which only produces more damage the more that they get wounded which means that the AI is less likely to ignore the rules of engagement. Just some food for thought, I'm probably not explaining this well as I'm by no means a tank expert, but have a look over on the class builds forum for some relevant threads on the matter.

 

Cheers,

 

Koth.

Edited February 25, 2016 by Koth

[KDubya]

A Paladin with stats of 10+ everywhere, with three at 15 and then 3 points left over works well. Get a two handed weapon, heavy armor and you are tanky enough as well as dishing out enough damage to deter dis-engagement. Plus you get all the usual Paladin goodies. Paladins make the team better, Fighters don't.

 

A tanky monk like the Juggernaut works really well. For extra fun have both and then add in a melee chanter. Two Paladins, a monk and a chanter make any team better and can hold the line against whatever comes.

[Boeroer]

Druid tank with Returning and Relentless Storm. My favorite. And chanters, too.

 

A fighter can be very tanky and still do great DPS at the same time. Boost his self healing as much as possible and get him Armored Grace, Vigorous Defense and so on while also taking all the damage/ACC related talents and you will get a superb frontliner who doesn't go down easily and does very good single target DPS. Blade of the Endless Paths is my tip for that setup. Bittercut & Shield is also nice.

[cavemandiary]

I prefer the paladin, 1h and shield. Supportive tank with high might, int and con. Kind wayfarer with both reinforcing and liberating exhortation. Until lvl 13, mostly just soaking up dmg and supporting the team. At lvl 13 sacred immolation turns you into a powerhouse on your own.

[InsaneCommander]

I'm gonna play with a paladin (Bleak Walker) with high Might, Con and Resolve, in Hard. I want her on the front line killing as many enemies as possible, so I imagine she might need to be a tank. Would it be too bad to have Intellect 9?

 

I'm considering these two possibilities:

 

Might 19               Might 16

Con   16               Con   15

Dex     8               Dex     8

Per      8               Per      8

Int       9                Int     15

Res   18               Res    16

 

Edit: I wrote 10, but I'm actually considering Int 9. It's corrected now.

Edited February 26, 2016 by InsaneCommander

[Merina]

Your aura will suffer and not be large enough to include more than your direct neighbors.

 

Paladin base aura range is 4.0m ... which only covers a bit more the Paladin and two melee neighbors ... since the diameter of one hero is 0.5*2=1.0m. Anyone a few more steps away from the Paladin ... as your casters and summons ... would not benefit from the aura.

 

Lower INT will also reduce the duration of a few talents you may want to use.

 

When I'm playing an offensive Paladin, the attributes are distributed differently.

[InsaneCommander]

How do you distribute them? Do you think it's better to have better perception and dexterity?

[Merina]

Yes to that ... if you want to kill enemies quickly before they hit you. And even more so, if there is a bit support from within your party.

[InsaneCommander]

I think I'll have another character as my tank. I wanna play with high Might and Resolve because of the dialogue options and a low Int would be bad for a Paladin.

 

I'll probably go with: Might 16/Con 14/Dex 10/Per 8/Int 14/Res 16

[Brimsurfer]

I think I'll have another character as my tank. I wanna play with high Might and Resolve because of the dialogue options and a low Int would be bad for a Paladin.

 

I'll probably go with: Might 16/Con 14/Dex 10/Per 8/Int 14/Res 16

If you are not planning her to be your tank than I would go for Cons 10 and Per 12, because Per governs accuracy, i think your accuracy will be too low because of your Per score......

[KDubya]

If you will have two paladins then one of them can get by with a ten intellect, just give the dumber one the DR aura, let the smarter one (Pellagrina) have the accuracy aura.

 

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 10

Per 15

Int 10

Res 15

 

I've done this as a two hander Kind Wayfarer using TideFall and had a good time in PotD. Led the team in damage. Gets good dialogue from Per and Resolve. The might makes up for the average intellect as far as healing goes. Plus you can eat cassita casserole for +2 and wear a +2 item to easily bring intellect up to 14. Once you get Sacred Immolation and Scion of Flame you burn everything down.

[Merina]

I think I'll have another character as my tank. I wanna play with high Might and Resolve because of the dialogue options and a low Int would be bad for a Paladin.

 

I'll probably go with: Might 16/Con 14/Dex 10/Per 8/Int 14/Res 16

 

Low INT is not bad for a paladin ... you only need to be aware of the consequences. That's the tricky part.

 

It's not as bad as ... say, a fighter with low INT and gallant's focus, which has a much smaller aura base range that barely includes two heroes. There are other classes where INT does not affect much, because the base duration is short or the base range is small ... and trying to modify that by 9% or 15% takes several attribute points already. You can as well fix that with an item and an inn resting bonus.

 

If, however, the paladin's aura size is key to the functioning of your party ... or you don't want to hurt the duration of late talents like sacred immolation (base 30 seconds), you better not touch INT in ways it would interfere with your plans.

 

As what defines a tank ... uh, well, some enemies don't care at all whether you come with constitution 14 or lower endurance. They would kill you nevertheless ... and it would be the job of your party to keep you alive. Thaos alone does something like close to 300 damage over a few seconds with his cleansing flame. And groups of enemies, let them flank you or surround you and hit you fast, because RES 15 alone is not much for a paladin either, and you won't survive that for long if you don't reduce their number.

 

All I can add ... I've played a solo bleakwalker paladin with much lower INT ... and CON 14 would not have helped me much ... so this is personal experience and nothing I've made up. No party to benefit from the aura, sure, but adjusting attributes in POE when playing a full party is merely a matter of personal preferences.

[Brimsurfer]

How about some of the other unusual choices as tank? e.g. Rogues or Wizards etc ? Are Rogues viable as tanks or even tanky dps? I used Devil as a front line off tank and she was quite promising, so I thought may be I could create a rogue with better stats and build him up like a tanky dps, also there is a rogue talent that distracts enemies from attacking their current target, which may prove useful in distracting enemies who attack my squishies.........may be I can also incorporate retaliation in that build........

 

Has anyone had any experience with building a rogue along these lines?

[DreamWayfarer]

How about some of the other unusual choices as tank? e.g. Rogues or Wizards etc ? Are Rogues viable as tanks or even tanky dps? I used Devil as a front line off tank and she was quite promising, so I thought may be I could create a rogue with better stats and build him up like a tanky dps, also there is a rogue talent that distracts enemies from attacking their current target, which may prove useful in distracting enemies who attack my squishies.........may be I can also incorporate retaliation in that build........

 

Has anyone had any experience with building a rogue along these lines?

It is technically possible, since the only stats Rogues generally need to deal damage are PER and DEX, and depending on your gear(speed enchantments, durgan steel) the later also becomes optional to increase, giving you a lot of points to put on things like RES and maybe CON.

[Merina]

How about some of the other unusual choices as tank? e.g. Rogues or Wizards etc ? Are Rogues viable as tanks or even tanky dps? I used Devil as a front line off tank and she was quite promising, so I thought may be I could create a rogue with better stats and build him up like a tanky dps, also there is a rogue talent that distracts enemies from attacking their current target, which may prove useful in distracting enemies who attack my squishies.........may be I can also incorporate retaliation in that build........

 

Has anyone had any experience with building a rogue along these lines?

 

The base Defl penalty is too high in my opinion:

 

Rogue

    End: Very Low

    Health: Low

    Accuracy: Very High

    Deflection: Low

 

 Fighter

    End: Average

    Health: High

    Accuracy: Very High

    Deflection: Very High

 

That's a difference of 15 already.  How many points would you want to pump into resolve and talents to get better deflection on a rogue? ... And what about the other three defenses? Fortitude, for example. A squishy rogue can concentrate on dps and will help the party much more. Fighters, on the other hand, don't need to raise resolve to godlike levels.

 

How about ...?

 

 Monk

    End: Average

    Health: Very High

    Accuracy: Very High

    Deflection: High

 

You want them to be hit ... for the wounds ... so typically you don't raise their deflection level much ... if at all. Support them a bit, and let them decimate the attackers.

[KDubya]

How about some of the other unusual choices as tank? e.g. Rogues or Wizards etc ? Are Rogues viable as tanks or even tanky dps? I used Devil as a front line off tank and she was quite promising, so I thought may be I could create a rogue with better stats and build him up like a tanky dps, also there is a rogue talent that distracts enemies from attacking their current target, which may prove useful in distracting enemies who attack my squishies.........may be I can also incorporate retaliation in that build........

 

Has anyone had any experience with building a rogue along these lines?

 

For a tanky rogue (Devil can do this as well).

 

Might 10 - Rogues get a lot of damage adders

Con 10 - I don't like to dump con on PotD

Dex 18 - faster actions

Per 18 - better accuracy, interrupts and more crits

Int 4 - the minimum with +4 from food/items to be able to chain prone with We Toki or Tall Grass

Res - 18 - to balance out the low will from intellect and for good dialogue

 

1 - Crippling Strike - two uses instead of one

2 - Weapon Focus - axes, warhammers, spears, sabres whatever you like

3 - Reckless Assault - +8 acc, -8 defl, +20% damage

4 - Weapon and Shield style - +6 defl and shield adds to reflex

5 - Deep Wounds - raw damage and resets with every hit so low intellect does not matter

6 - Superior Deflection - +5 deflection

7 - Persistent Distraction - great ability, lets you set up deathblows with flanking

8 - Deflecting Assault - +5 deflection

9 - Dirty Fighting - 10% hit>crit

10 - Vicious Fighting - 10% hit >crit

11 - Deathblows - the reason to be a rogue

12 - Wild Card - Savage Attack (I'd skip if you are going with an on crit weapon), interrupting blows, fast runner - avoid things with durations as they won't last long

13 - Adept Evasion - You have a good reflex save, or Sap is another OK choice

 

Compared to a Fighter you will have +8 accuracy from Reckless or be even if you go with large shields. For deflection you will be 15 behind at start, -23 with reckless, with talents you will get back 16, plus the shield. Damage wise consistent deathblows will get you +150% damage compared to a Fighter at +25%. A tanky Fighter is way more tanky than you can ever be, but a Fighter going for DPS - that guy you can be as tanky as plus do more damage.

 

Your Rogue will have  Fortitude and Will saves that are unaugmented but your Reflex save will be really high. You won't have a lot of health and endurance. You will have enough deflection that you can flank and survive the counterattack without needing to be ready to escape. With a Durgan shield and a durgan weapon you can have a pretty fast attack that will have 20-30% hit to crit with a really high accuracy, use We Toki and you can prone them one at a time and kill them quickly.

Edited February 27, 2016 by KDubya