[1.04] Quest - The Theorems of Pandgram

[Luckmann]

As part of the The Theorems of Pandgram quest, Nedyn at the Brackenbury Asylum asks you to retrieve a book, the Theorems of Pandgram, from the Hall of Revealed Mysteries. She has been previously denied access, by the keeper, Grimda.

What is the first thing you do? You go up to Grimda and tell her that; Hey, I've been sent by Nedyn, because she wants to Theorems of Pandgram. Is there any way we could make that work? Any way I could persuade you? What's the issue between you two and this thing, anyway?
 

There's one option: "An animancer named Nedyn asked me to retrieve the Theorems of Pangram from the Elder Archives".

 

This immediately ends the quest and makes it impossible to secure The Theorems of Pandgram, by making the chest in which they are kept un-interactable.

...
 

... ...

 

I... I have nothing.

 

Completely and utterly blindsided me. I wasn't there to steal, unless it was necessary, or maybe I would've changed my mind after talking to Grimda, or maybe the Theorems of Pandgram could've been moved to a harder-to-reach location because I tipped Grimda off that Nedyn is apparently not going to give up.

This can't possibly be working as intended.

 

Also, if you do opt to just steal The Theorems of Pandgram right away, and never talk to Grimda at all; you need to lockpick the door to the Elder Archives. As long as you are in Scouting Mode, whether you are being seen or not, you can lockpick the door and walk inside just fine. But if you are not in Scouting Mode, the entire Temple/Library goes hostile.

Edited April 21, 2015 by Luckmann

[Enoch]

It makes a certain amount of sense, though, doesn't it?  Some people are not convinceable on certain things-- you're asking a priest to get a book of necromantic research to hand over to (from her perspective) a mad scientist.  Perhaps it could have used more warning at the outset that Grimda wasn't going to be talked into cooperating, but it's been a while since I read Nedyn's initial request dialogue. 

 

Apart from that, informing the target that you're planning on stealing something of theirs seems like a really dumb thing to do, so I don't have much problem with the game punishing the player for it.  The credited solution to the quest is probably to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, do her quest, get access to the archives legitimately, and walk out with the Theorems. 

Edited April 21, 2015 by Enoch

[Luckmann]

It makes a certain amount of sense, though, doesn't it?  Some people are not convinceable on certain things-- you're asking a priest to get a book of necromantic research to hand over to (from her perspective) a mad scientist.  Perhaps it could have used more warning at the outset that Grimda wasn't going to be talked into cooperating, but it's been a while since I read Nedyn's initial request dialogue. 

 

Apart from that, informing the target that you're planning on stealing something of theirs seems like a really dumb thing to do, so I don't have much problem with the game punishing the player for it.

 

The thing is, you're not. You're not sent there specifically to steal the book, and I cited the dialogue choice itself. If it was just a dumb choice that resulted in a "Oh, thank you for informing me!" followed by a loud "D'oh" on your part, the quest would be fine, and if the option was "An animancer named Nedyn asked me to steal the Theorems of Pangram from the Elder Archives" the situation would still be odd (because she never asked you to steal it), but the interaction would make a degree of sense.

 

As it is right now, Nedyn asks you to go get the book, you go tell Grimda that you're there to get the book for Nedyn, and then the quest ends. No ifs, buts or whats.

 

Or you go straight to stealing it, which is honestly just as odd, to most, I wager, unless they're specifically already playing as a thieving character.

 

The credited solution to the quest is probably to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, do her quest, get access to the archives legitimately, and walk out with the Theorems.

I never had the option of gaining legitimate access to the archives, nor the option to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, related to this quest.

Edited April 21, 2015 by Luckmann

[Enoch]

 

The credited solution to the quest is probably to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, do her quest, get access to the archives legitimately, and walk out with the Theorems.

I never had the option of gaining legitimate access to the archives, nor the option to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, related to this quest.

 

You couldn't talk to Grimda and accept her quest to track down the missing scroll without picking a Nedyn-releated dialogue opion?  (Not sure, but I may have visited Grimda and gotten this task before meeting Nedyn.) 

[eLPuSHeR]

That's why I skipped that dialog option altogether as soon as I saw it. It smelled fishy from a league.

 

That and I already knew by completing the robbed scroll quest before that I would be getting that grimoire anyway.

[Qbert]

 

 

The credited solution to the quest is probably to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, do her quest, get access to the archives legitimately, and walk out with the Theorems.

I never had the option of gaining legitimate access to the archives, nor the option to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, related to this quest.

 

You couldn't talk to Grimda and accept her quest to track down the missing scroll without picking a Nedyn-releated dialogue opion?  (Not sure, but I may have visited Grimda and gotten this task before meeting Nedyn.) 

 

Yes you can choose to not select the Nedyn related dialogue option. Through the other dialogue options, you can go on a quest to recover the scroll for Grimda.  Once this quest is complete, she opens the Elder archives for you and you are free to steal the book.  Once you do that however, it appears you can no longer decide to complete the quest any way except for giving the book to Nedyn.  This makes sense i guess since you did steal the book, but I know i was still unsure of Nedyn's motivations and it would have been cool to talk to Nedyn, then decide she can't have the book and give it back to Grimda.

[Luckmann]

 

 

The credited solution to the quest is probably to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, do her quest, get access to the archives legitimately, and walk out with the Theorems.

I never had the option of gaining legitimate access to the archives, nor the option to talk to Grimda without mentioning Nedyn, related to this quest.

 

 

You couldn't talk to Grimda and accept her quest to track down the missing scroll without picking a Nedyn-releated dialogue opion?  (Not sure, but I may have visited Grimda and gotten this task before meeting Nedyn.)

 

 

Completely different and unassociated quest. The quest to track down the scroll thieves is a Task called The Parable of Wael.

 

Yes you can choose to not select the Nedyn related dialogue option. Through the other dialogue options, you can go on a quest to recover the scroll for Grimda.  Once this quest is complete, she opens the Elder archives for you and you are free to steal the book.  Once you do that however, it appears you can no longer decide to complete the quest any way except for giving the book to Nedyn.  This makes sense i guess since you did steal the book, but I know i was still unsure of Nedyn's motivations and it would have been cool to talk to Nedyn, then decide she can't have the book and give it back to Grimda.

 

Which.. actually does nothing to change the weirdness of the dialogue choices or the quest, then. All it does is give you access to the Elder Archives, which can already get through just entering Scouting Mode.

Edited April 21, 2015 by Luckmann

[Qbert]

I agree that the Nedyn dialogue option looks like it should be the entry point to the quest, rather than the resolution.