Summoned Creatures Durations need a nerf

[Ceranai]

Get  back to me when other classes are set up to cast one spell per encounter.  I get that you have a thing for crippling this class, and I'm confident that it won't happen, so I'm bowing out of this thread.  Carry on/

I dont have a thing for crippling it... are you joking? Ive spent more time playing with chanters than any other class lol and thats why i know that this exploit is OP. limiting the number of summons to say 4 per encounter would not affect normal game play in the slightest, as if a fight is lasting that long something funny is going on so explain to me how that is crippling the class, similarly why do summons need vision? unless you are using this exploit why would they need to see seperately to the chanter, they arent supposed to stay active and scout the map after the encounter ends. 

 

Do you not see how OP it is to have an unlimited health pool of 50 HP every 12 seconds per chanter? with 6 chanters that's 300 HP, no enemy in the game ive encountered can out dps that, not to mention that the phantoms themselves hit for a sizeable amount of damage and you can even further increase this damage if you give your chanters bows and specialise them for ranged combat. No other build even comes close to being as strong, not to mention speedbuffs mean you can kite forever anyway, and the combined resistances that are basically free. 

[curi]

This sort of things ruins games for people who play normally.  I don't care, at all, that someone else somewhere can cheese their way to a win on a hard difficulty level.  I do care that a class built around summons doesn't get trashed to close a silly loophole in the name of "balance".

 

EDIT:  Sorry, I'm getting argumentative here.  I just dislike the MMO disease: grinding classes down because someone finds a loophole, and the designers then over-react, crippling what was once a fun things to do.  If summons poof when out of line of sight of players, for instance, it doesn't matter at all for normal play, and that would seem to solve whatever problem this is.  Also, regenerate when out of combat.  Neither thing breaks any normal thing that players do.

 

chanters can easily be fixed without hurting them for normal play. like the vision fix i suggested, where they don't create their own vision. this issue isn't about you and your playstyle, and fixing it won't affect you, so don't worry. although i do also think chanters are OP with normal play and the devs might want to nerf that.

Edited April 4, 2015 by curi

[Ceranai]

 

This sort of things ruins games for people who play normally.  I don't care, at all, that someone else somewhere can cheese their way to a win on a hard difficulty level.  I do care that a class built around summons doesn't get trashed to close a silly loophole in the name of "balance".

 

EDIT:  Sorry, I'm getting argumentative here.  I just dislike the MMO disease: grinding classes down because someone finds a loophole, and the designers then over-react, crippling what was once a fun things to do.  If summons poof when out of line of sight of players, for instance, it doesn't matter at all for normal play, and that would seem to solve whatever problem this is.  Also, regenerate when out of combat.  Neither thing breaks any normal thing that players do.

 

chanters can easily be fixed without hurting them for normal play. like the vision fix i suggested, where they don't create their own vision. this issue isn't about you and your playstyle, and fixing it won't affect you, so don't worry. although i do also think chanters are OP with normal play and the devs might want to nerf that.

 

This thread made me switch back to my chanter play through... god its so easy, its still PoTD but god... Its soooooo easy

[Ichthyic]

 

 

 

i think they should handle this like baldur's gate. summoned creatures cannot provide any map vision at all (and you can't click them to go fight at a location you haven't explored). i think that would be a nice way to fix the problem of risk-free exploring by running summons around, and fighting far-away monsters, etc

 

does that make sense to other people? i'd also be fine with limiting duration to like a minute. long but not infinite. but that would not solve the main problem of sending them around the map.

Please no, the micromanagement is fun element.The fact that you can choose target is why summons are so powerfull because you can focus your power on 1 target or tank with summons.

 

 

i don't think you played baldur's gate much? you aren't understanding. you can micro control your summons. they just don't grant vision, so you can't use them away from the party (without using a scouting spell at least), you can only control them in the area where you have vision. but this way you can't use summons as scouts or send 6 summons to go fight while you sit at the dungeon entrance.

 

Oh...was it icewind dale then?When they just run around you looking for targets?

 

yup.

 

having recently finished IWD EE, yeah... your summons will autoattack anything THEY can see.  you don't need to be able to see it yourself.

 

so, you can cast a summons around a corner, and it will happily go to town on the first thing it sees, even if you never see what it was, and just poke your head around the corner after the fightings done.

 

that said.... they DO have limited range as well, and will return to the party if they get too far away.  also, you couldn't change levels with them, but they would stay on the level where you summoned them until their timers ran out, so they would still be there if you popped back in before their timers were up.

 

I rather thought it was a perfect, rational system.  so much so, I immediately modded all the summons to have their own spell tables and abilities

 

I have to say I haven't really played too much with the summoning system in POE.  my chanter is the only summoner, and it takes so long to get a summon in that most fights are over before they play much of a role as anything but a brief distraction.

 

I'll have to try playing a chanter solo, or duo and see how that works.

 

or, as someone else suggested in another thread... specialize an entire team of chanters to play different roles.  a chorus of chants and summons and blasts.

 

could be quite fun, actually.

 

 

[Gel214th]

Problem: You can literally chain pull an entire dungeon with your party standing at the beginning and doing nothing while relying on your summoned creatures to go kill everything. All that's required is that you chain pull or keep a really weak enemy poking your tank to keep you in combat. 

 

 

Suggestions: Only be able to summon 1 creature per fight per character. 

 

Sidenote: It's sad that spiritshift lasts 10-15 seconds while chanter summons go forever...

 

Othersidenote: This would also help reign in the Overpoweredness of the "summon" items for non-chanters. 

It's a single player game. There's no abuse.

Just don't do it ? 

[Ichthyic]

speaking of chanter summons...

the phantom starts to fade in usefulness after a bit.  are any of the level 2 summons any good?

 

[Ceranai]

speaking of chanter summons...

 

the phantom starts to fade in usefulness after a bit.  are any of the level 2 summons any good?

 

 

wurms are ranged and hit decently hard, the 5 chanter 1 druid build i poster earlier becomes even stronger coz you get a few summons to act as a wall and then the rest focus down anyone you click on, i mean one of the only thing stopping phantoms being even more dps crazy is that in tight spaces they struggle to auto attack, when you get worms you can block doorways and unleach a rain of fire on anyone who comes close. 

 

PS and i havnt even seen what 5 drakes could do

Edited April 4, 2015 by Ceranai

[Ichthyic]

righto then, wurms it is.

I thought them a bit on the squishy side when I fought them below the keep, but they do have decent deflection scores IIRC, which should actually make them do better against enemies than they did against me.

thanks muchly.

[Ceranai]

righto then, wurms it is.

 

I thought them a bit on the squishy side when I fought them below the keep, but they do have decent deflection scores IIRC, which should actually make them do better against enemies than they did against me.

 

thanks muchly.

well they are a bit squishy but you get three of them, more importantly ive found wisps (the other option) to be pretty useless. very little tankyness, very little damge get a free charm though i guess, so thats two charms every 16 seconds

Edited April 4, 2015 by Ceranai