Canadian Election 2008

[Oerwinde]

So Belarus has an election thread so why the hell not the great white north.

 

So far its looking like a Conservative majority is in the books, which is only bad if you consider that they have the support of something like 30% of Canadians. Yay first past the post is a multi-party system! The NDP though are making significant gains and are looking to gain the most seats they've had since 1988. Dion was a terrible choice as the leader of the Liberals and I see his leadership as the main reason for the Liberals dramatic decline this election.

 

I'll likely be voting NDP again. Layton is the only leader I like, and I agree with most of their platform, though I do agree with the Conservative stance on youth justice. Just because a violent criminal also happens to be under 18 doesn't mean they should be sent on vacation rather than to jail.

[Deraldin]

I've been looking around for the past week for some information on just how dysfunctional this parliament really was. It looks like they managed to pass 63 bills, which is about average, but what I'm really interested in is how many of them were confidence motions. It seemed at the time as though every other bill was a confidence motion that the Liberals walked out on, but I can't seem to find any numbers for that.

[Humodour]

Please vote in a centrist government that decriminalises marijuana.

[Volourn]

"though I do agree with the Conservative stance on youth justice. Just because a violent criminal also happens to be under 18 doesn't mean they should be sent on vacation rather than to jail."

 

If you are gonna have laws that limit youth rights on what adults have they also shouldn't have the same obligations or face the same punishments as adults do.

 

It seems silly to say you arne't mature enough to have the rights of an adult; but darn it, we're gonna punish you like you are an adult. Society should make up your mind.

 

If teens aren't mature enough to be allowed to smoke, they most certainly shouldn't be mature enough to br tried like an adult.

[Oerwinde]

Please vote in a centrist government that decriminalises marijuana.

 

Marijuana is decriminalized in BC. You get fined for posession, but its less than a speeding ticket.

 

"though I do agree with the Conservative stance on youth justice. Just because a violent criminal also happens to be under 18 doesn't mean they should be sent on vacation rather than to jail."

 

If you are gonna have laws that limit youth rights on what adults have they also shouldn't have the same obligations or face the same punishments as adults do.

 

It seems silly to say you arne't mature enough to have the rights of an adult; but darn it, we're gonna punish you like you are an adult. Society should make up your mind.

 

If teens aren't mature enough to be allowed to smoke, they most certainly shouldn't be mature enough to br tried like an adult.

 

I'm not necessarily saying they should be jammed into genpop in a standard prison, but when you attack a guy with an axe and cripple him, house arrest just isn't enough IMO.

Edited October 2, 2008 by Oerwinde

[Humodour]

Please vote in a centrist government that decriminalises marijuana.

 

Marijuana is decriminalized in BC. You get fined for posession, but its less than a speeding ticket.

 

Oh seriously? That's like half the states here. I thought in Canada it was illegal and criminalised, but the cops and courts always looked the other way unless you were a dealer or they wanted to bust you for something else. But if BC actually decriminalised it, that's excellent news.

 

Oh, I just noticed the Criminal Intelligence Services of Canada recently filed a report that explains how marijuana prohibition fuels organised crime. Nice to see a country waking up.

Edited October 2, 2008 by Krezack

[alanschu]

So Belarus has an election thread so why the hell not the great white north.

 

So far its looking like a Conservative majority is in the books, which is only bad if you consider that they have the support of something like 30% of Canadians. Yay first past the post is a multi-party system! The NDP though are making significant gains and are looking to gain the most seats they've had since 1988. Dion was a terrible choice as the leader of the Liberals and I see his leadership as the main reason for the Liberals dramatic decline this election.

 

I'll likely be voting NDP again. Layton is the only leader I like, and I agree with most of their platform, though I do agree with the Conservative stance on youth justice. Just because a violent criminal also happens to be under 18 doesn't mean they should be sent on vacation rather than to jail.

 

 

Do you honestly feel that way when the party you vote for gets a huge majority gov't?

[Humodour]

I just read up on the NDP. Definitely sounds like the best option available.

[Oerwinde]

So Belarus has an election thread so why the hell not the great white north.

 

So far its looking like a Conservative majority is in the books, which is only bad if you consider that they have the support of something like 30% of Canadians. Yay first past the post is a multi-party system! The NDP though are making significant gains and are looking to gain the most seats they've had since 1988. Dion was a terrible choice as the leader of the Liberals and I see his leadership as the main reason for the Liberals dramatic decline this election.

 

I'll likely be voting NDP again. Layton is the only leader I like, and I agree with most of their platform, though I do agree with the Conservative stance on youth justice. Just because a violent criminal also happens to be under 18 doesn't mean they should be sent on vacation rather than to jail.

 

 

Do you honestly feel that way when the party you vote for gets a huge majority gov't?

 

Yup, the BC Liberals a few years back, I voted for them and they got every seat but 2. Thats a terrible way to run a government, you need to have everyone represented. We need to switch to a proportionate representation system. Which is what the NDP are pushing for, which is one of the reasons I vote for them.

[alanschu]

Weren't you critical of the fact that the current government was a minority government, and hence not going to be effective?

[Humodour]

What are you trying to say? Don't vote for them because they won't get enough power? That's like saying vote for the guy you're against so that he gets enough power to do the things you probably don't agree with.

 

The first-past-the-post system that America and Canada use is pretty ****ed up, for these reasons and more. I'm surprised they haven't switched to proportional representation or preferential voting yet.

[alanschu]

Were you talking to me?

[Oerwinde]

Weren't you critical of the fact that the current government was a minority government, and hence not going to be effective?

 

No, I like minority governments because the parties with fewer seats actually matter and are somewhat able to push for their platform where in a majority they're pretty crippled.

[Humodour]

Were you talking to me?

 

Yes.

[alanschu]

I am not even sure how you read my post to make you post the questions that you did. How did you think I was trying to say any of that stuff?

[Humodour]

Instead of answering my question with a question, you could simply clarify what you mean.

[alanschu]

About what?!?

[Oerwinde]

Well, that was uneventful. NDP picked up a few seats, liberals lost a few, Conservatives picked up a couple more, and we have a conservative minority again. See you again in 1-2 years.

 

The way Canadian people vote bothers me. If people voted for who they wanted to win rather than against the people they don't things would be better IMO. It was amazing how many people said they would vote NDP if they were voting, but they're not because someone elses vote would just cancel theirs out, or they were going to vote NDP but voted Liberal because they figured they had a better chance of winning, then having the Liberal candidate in their riding come third.

[Deraldin]

Well, that was uneventful. NDP picked up a few seats, liberals lost a few, Conservatives picked up a couple more, and we have a conservative minority again. See you again in 1-2 years.

 

The way Canadian people vote bothers me. If people voted for who they wanted to win rather than against the people they don't things would be better IMO. It was amazing how many people said they would vote NDP if they were voting, but they're not because someone elses vote would just cancel theirs out, or they were going to vote NDP but voted Liberal because they figured they had a better chance of winning, then having the Liberal candidate in their riding come third.

 

I'm severely disappointed in the people in my riding. We re-elected a complete idiot. The guy takes credit for things that he has no say in what so ever. He's claimed that he is the only one that could have gotten certain things accomplished, despite the fact that nothing has actually happened yet and whether or not it gets funding is all down to the federal government. He's gone out and contacted several companies to plan out a new hotel/convention centre for the city without talking to city council or anyone in the area. He constantly bombards us with stupid flyers telling us how great he is and somehow he got back in and did so with even more votes than he got last time when the Liberals were running a really crappy candidate.

[alanschu]

Well, that was uneventful. NDP picked up a few seats, liberals lost a few, Conservatives picked up a couple more, and we have a conservative minority again. See you again in 1-2 years.

 

The way Canadian people vote bothers me. If people voted for who they wanted to win rather than against the people they don't things would be better IMO. It was amazing how many people said they would vote NDP if they were voting, but they're not because someone elses vote would just cancel theirs out, or they were going to vote NDP but voted Liberal because they figured they had a better chance of winning, then having the Liberal candidate in their riding come third.

 

 

I tend to vote conservative, but really have no ill will against the Liberal Party, and tend to alternate between the two determining how long someone has been in power and for how long.

 

 

In the past the NDP plan has always seemed so fiscally irresponsible (I remember one time Layton being asked in the previous election of how he plans to pay for the measures he wishes to implements, and his response was something akin to "We'll worry about that") that I kind of find them a laughing stock and don't pay much attention to them anymore.

 

They talk about how other parties are letting jobs disappear overseas, but maybe it's just because I'm in Alberta...but I have seen nothing of the sort. I think our unemployment is negative!

 

I always hear about how evil other parties are for reducing taxes to corporations (As far as I can tell, my personal taxes of gone down too...but what do I know?) and favouring big business. Except...no one escapes taxes. If you tax the crap out of corporations, then they will raise their prices and the consumers will pay for it. If you tax the crap out of customers, they'll have less money and corporations will lower their prices in order to compete, yet have to pay workers more in order for them to survive. It's always been a continuum and no matter where you place a tax increase or a tax break, both people and businesses will benefit/suffer.

 

Starting with the Liberals, and continuing with the Conservatives, huge chunks of national debt have been paid off, and Canada now has the lowest debt-to-GDP ratio of all the G8 countries.

 

 

I have also been surprised how Canada has for the most part staved off recession for the past 7 years since 9/11 (though things are on the downswing now...but hey, it's always cyclical) when the US economy went into uncertainty, in addition to the effects the prolonged conflicts of the US Armed Forces. I think we as Canadians have it pretty good, and I'm a "starving student" in evil right-wing Alberta...

[Oerwinde]

I mainly vote NDP in the hopes that they'll be in a position to push through some of the issues they champion such as proportional representation, fixed election dates, marijuana decriminalization/legalization, etc. I don't expect them to ever form the government, nor would I want to outside of maybe a minority. I just find their views on social issues are the closest to my own. I like some of the programs supported by other parties, but I like the general NDP values. IMO it is stupid to vote for a party that doesn't match your values.

 

Aside: Another victory for the first past the post system. The Bloc gets 10% of the popular vote and 50 seats, the NDP gets 18% of the popular vote and 37

Edited October 16, 2008 by Oerwinde

[alanschu]

I think there are fixed election dates...assuming a majority government.

 

My votes tend to be what I feel is best fiscally.

[Deraldin]

I think there are fixed election dates...assuming a majority government.

 

My votes tend to be what I feel is best fiscally.

 

There are fixed election dates so that the Prime Minister can't call an election whenever he wants. The opposition can still bring down the government on a confidence motion in the case of a minority government though. Of course, none of this really matters because Harper is god and thus is free to ignore his own laws.

[Oerwinde]

Some quick research finds that there was a fixed election date bill in the commons but under it Harper wouldn't have been able to call this election, it would have had to come from a no-confidence vote.

[alanschu]

I think there are fixed election dates...assuming a majority government.

 

My votes tend to be what I feel is best fiscally.

 

There are fixed election dates so that the Prime Minister can't call an election whenever he wants. The opposition can still bring down the government on a confidence motion in the case of a minority government though. Of course, none of this really matters because Harper is god and thus is free to ignore his own laws.

 

 

Yeah the calling of the election did irk me somewhat. I'm a fan of fixed election dates.

 

I heard second and third hand that the explanation for calling an election was due to a minority government, though it's easy to see that it is advantageous for Harper to call it now, just before the economy takes a downward swing.