was the Great Hunt racist?

[metadigital]

Pfft. All monsters must die. Next you people will be coddling the zombies.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Zombie In-Human Rights Now! ZIHR-Now!

 

I played a NwN community mod where the undead were portrayed in a more forgiving, less stereotypical manner, and they had even settled next to some dwarves and goblins deep underground. Seemed like nice people, and they didn't keep trying to eat my brains or anything. Very genial. Nicer than some of my neighbours, in fact.

 

Of course, this is not what we want, this is what the Jedi ought to be doing. Jedi are meant to be Lawful Good.

[Archmonarch]

Heh.  I assumed you meant The Great Hunt...

 

 

 

 

...when I read the title.

 

And I couldn't think how it might be viewed as racist

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That man is my archenemy! He lives in my town and has stolen practically every idea in his series directly from popular mythology. He takes the easy way out more often than not and annoys me, on principle, as a writer.

[metadigital]

Heh.  I assumed you meant The Great Hunt...

[snip: http://ystig.com/greathunt.jpg ]

...when I read the title.

 

And I couldn't think how it might be viewed as racist

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That man is my archenemy! He lives in my town and has stolen practically every idea in his series directly from popular mythology. He takes the easy way out more often than not and annoys me, on principle, as a writer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, at least he reads the classics, I suppose.

[Yst]

That man is my archenemy! He lives in my town and has stolen practically every idea in his series directly from popular mythology. He takes the easy way out more often than not and annoys me, on principle, as a writer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well, many good fantasy writers, and most great fantasy writers, draw all their best ideas from mythology.

 

However, I don't at all disagree with your feelings on Jordan. While I don't impugn any writer for drawing his great ideas from mythology, and therefore nor would I Jordan were that his problem, I certainly do impugn Jordan for having simply run out of ideas altogether, mythological or not. As far as his use of mythology goes, if anything, I impugn him for not using mythology enough. When he became starved for ideas, he might have taken the time to find direction for his protagonists in the popular mythological sources of fantasy writers in general, but he lost direction altogether.

 

He had some ideas, and he's a sufficiently good writer, but he seems to have lacked the willingness or ability to edit those ideas down to a clean narrative framework and leave them behind when they'd been expended. If he had forced himself to compress every book in the series up to Book 6 into the size of one of Zelazny's Amber novels, then wrapped things up shortly thereafter, they would have made a lovely little fantasy series.

[Archmonarch]

Indeed, you are correct. However, nor do I impugn him for drawing ideas from mythology; its more the fact that he doesnt just draw ideas, he steals the whole story and drops it almost intact into his writing. Every book since the first has been steadily worse in quality and I have heard he plans a total of 12 books in the series. Also, I recently learned he intends to set a new series (if he ever finishes this one) in the same world where a man washes up on Seanchan land and is taken as a slave. No word if this new character can channel, though I wouldnt doubt it if he did.

[MTJ]

Once again we can't educate the children the difference between Racisim and specisim.

[metadigital]

Indeed, you are correct. However, nor do I impugn him for drawing ideas from mythology; its more the fact that he doesnt just draw ideas, he steals the whole story and drops it almost intact into his writing. Every book since the first has been steadily worse in quality and I have heard he plans a total of 12 books in the series. Also, I recently learned he intends to set a new series (if he ever finishes this one) in the same world where a man washes up on Seanchan land and is taken as a slave. No word if this new character can channel, though I wouldnt doubt it if he did.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is his name Odysseus?

[SteveThaiBinh]

...edit...compress...wrapped things up...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mr. Jordan doesn't know these words.

 

Every book since the first has been steadily worse in quality...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I read the first book when I was too young to be put off by the quality of the writing, and as you say, the earlier books were actually quite good at times. Yet here we are, a DECADE later, and now I am fully aware that I am reading dross, and furious with myself for paying for the privilege. But I really really want to find out what happens to these characters. Do you think he's procrastinating because he doesn't have a clue how it's all going to turn out?

[Archmonarch]

Given how little time he's given to his Main character, I'd say either the probability is great or Jordan is no longer enamored by Rand's story.

 

@ meta, he changes the names, but the stories are basically identical. For instance, a character named Mat is almost hanged to death for knowledge/wisdom, is given a spear with ravens on it (Hugin and Munin, anyone?), and is almost certain to lose an eye in the future. This is drawn straight from the legends of Odin. And the main character has been branded numerous times in reference to the story of Jesus and recently lost part of his hand, exactly like the Norse god Tew.

[metadigital]

I guess that doesn't matter if he can write. It doesn't sound like you are too impressed with his skills. I've never read any of his work, then again there ain't enough hours in the day to read all the good stuff ...

[Archmonarch]

Dont be misled: the story can be entertaining; its his execution. I simply find myself reading less and less of each book as smaller and smaller portions concern the supposed main character.

[metadigital]

Dont be misled: the story can be entertaining; its his execution.  I simply find myself reading less and less of each book as smaller and smaller portions concern the supposed main character.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think I'll read Homer's version (or whomever he lifted the plot from in the first place) ...

[Archmonarch]

Oh, and Ive been meaning to ask you: you've posted in my writing thread, yet I dont recall if you ever mentioned your overall opinion of it or commented on the later chapters. Remember, any encouragement to continue writing is sufficient impetus for me. "

[Eddo36]

Terentateks are intelligent. Where did any of you get the idea that they aren't?

 

This is a quote from Duron Qel-Droma (one of those 3 Jedi's killed in the Great Hunt) from Shadows and Light, a comic in Star Wars Tales issue #23-

 

Duron Qel-Droma: I don't want to kill anymore, Shaela! I'm sick of killing. Sick of hunting. I'm sick of the blood...

Shaela Nuur: Duron...

Duron Qel-Droma: You don't understand -- when I make contact, I hear their thoughts... they may be evil, but they think... they have a spirit and -- UNNGHH!

 

Does this change anyone's mind about terentateks? The Jedi are racist lightsiders. Don't believe in execution, hmph!

 

And btw- I'm so stupid, spelled "terentatek" wrong. This is the correct spelling.

[SteveThaiBinh]

If they're intelligent, as your source indicates, then they can be reasoned with and are capable of choosing not to be 'evil', or at least to stop harming others. The Jedi should try to communicate and negotiate with them. If they keep on threatening lives , then in effect you have a state of war, a war of self defense. This can be conducted according to the normal rules of war, and again, attempts to negotiate a peaceful solution should continue if possible.

 

Yes, a 'Great Hunt' looks like pre-emptive war - there's no imminent threat. So probably racist, certainly illegal and immoral. Those rotten Jedi - who'd have thought it?

[mstormrage]

Given how little time he's given to his Main character, I'd say either the probability is great or Jordan is no longer enamored by Rand's story.

 

@ meta, he changes the names, but the stories are basically identical. For instance, a character named Mat is almost hanged to death for knowledge/wisdom, is given a spear with ravens on it (Hugin and Munin, anyone?), and is almost certain to lose an eye in the future. This is drawn straight from the legends of Odin. And the main character has been branded numerous times in reference to the story of Jesus and recently lost part of his hand, exactly like the Norse god Tew.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

In book 2 or 3 it's alluded that he will lose at least one or both eyes (weighing his eye/s out on a scale) in one of Egwene's "dreams".

[Eddo36]

If they're intelligent, as your source indicates, then they can be reasoned with and are capable of choosing not  to be 'evil', or at least to stop harming others.  The Jedi should try to communicate and negotiate with them.  If they keep on threatening lives , then in effect you have a state of war, a war of self defense.  This can be conducted according to the normal rules of war, and again, attempts to negotiate a peaceful solution should continue if possible.

 

Yes, a 'Great Hunt' looks like pre-emptive war - there's no imminent threat.  So probably racist, certainly illegal and immoral.  Those rotten Jedi - who'd have thought it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Here is a big understanding: Evil /= Unintelligent

 

Didn't the Jedi council claimed they don't believe in execution? Jedi only contradict themselves. Terentatek killing is RACIST!

[Yst]

Here is a big understanding: Evil /= Unintelligent

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What's that mean? It's understood that 'Evil' is indifferent towards 'Unintelligent'?

[Petay]

'Save the terentatek, Save the terentatek' is all i could say if they still existed!!

If they are intelligent then whats the need to kill them :D

 

In fact.......whats the need to kill anyone group hug........

 

*hugs the world*

[metadigital]

Oh, and Ive been meaning to ask you: you've posted in my writing thread, yet I dont recall if you ever mentioned your overall opinion of it or commented on the later chapters. Remember, any encouragement to continue writing is sufficient impetus for me.  "

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, I've not been back to read further yet, I'll be back soon. I would hope that writing is something you enjoy doing, despite anything everyone else might say.

[jedipodo]

Jedi only contradict themselves. Terentatek killing is RACIST!

 

Did I get that right, in your opinion somebody is a racist simply because his arch-enemy belongs to a different species?

[Eddo36]

Or if his arch-enemy is an entire different species which can be left alone in peace but no... no... they are evil! All of them should die! What have they done that is evil? Nothing except defend themselves from our attempts to exterminate them, maybe?

[Darth Launch]

I say kill them...

 

They taste so nice with a little tabasco sauce drizzled on them

 

DL

[SteveThaiBinh]

Jediburgers were banned by the Republic because of their high midichlorian content, a chemical compound linked to Chronic Fall-To-The-Dark-Side-And-Slaughter-All-Your-Friends Syndrome.

[metadigital]

Jediburgers were banned by the Republic because of their high midichlorian content, a chemical compound linked to Chronic Fall-To-The-Dark-Side-And-Slaughter-All-Your-Friends Syndrome.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They're pretty popular in Sith Space, though. (Ewwww, cannibalism.)

 

BOT, I would like to meet a kindly, wizened old Terentarek that has learned simple BASIC and wants to reach out and build a bridge between the races ... maybe we could use the "The Man Who Ruled the Universe" template, by Alan Dean Foster (in one of his rare original manuscripts, and not a film-to-novel conversion).