Civilization 4

[Oerwinde]

http://pc.ign.com/articles/614/614551p1.html

 

Sounds awesome, looks awesome, hopefully its as good as it sounds.

[Antagonist]

They updated the graphics to 1995. Sweet.

[Oerwinde]

They updated the graphics to 1995. Sweet.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

They're using the same engine as the new Pirates!

[kirottu]

Sounds sweet.

 

I found this bit funny:

We will not be including any espionage options that are terrorism related.

 

[Oerwinde]

I miss detonating nuclear weapons and poisoning water supplies with my spies.

[Reveilled]

IGNPC: How do governments work this time around?

 

Barry Caudill: There are no set governments anymore. In Civilization 4, you can choose from various civics and combine them to make the type of government you want. For example, you may have a Theocratic Police State that also has Universal Suffrage or you may have a Pacifist Slave State with Hereditary Rule. The Civics are divided into five major areas - Government, Legal, Labor, Economy, and Religion - and each of those has 5 possible choices depending on what you have researched. In addition, AI leaders will have certain favorite Civics and they may ask you to either switch to theirs or stop using the one that offends them.

 

Thank god! Social Engineering was one of the best aspects of Alpha Centauri. Nice to see Firaxis finally realised it should be in Civilization.

 

IGNPC: How does the overall combat system work? Will it still just be a one-on-one, winner take all affair? We hear that the individual units will have more specific uses. Can you explain?

 

Barry Caudill: Units will have strengths and weaknesses against other types of units. For instance, pikemen will have a decided advantage over mounted units and axemen will be especially good against melee units. We have also removed the idea of separate attack and defense values and replaced them with a single Power rating.

 

No attack and defence rating? This worries me. It worries me a lot.

 

Barry Caudill: Balancing is always high on our priority list and we are definitely working to even out the pace of the game. One new thing is that you can choose different game speeds depending on your preference and available time. You can choose Quick, Normal, or Epic. Normal would be like a standard game of Civilization in previous versions. Quick and Epic are scaled in every aspect to provide the full experience of Civilization in either a quicker or much longer format.

 

The only problem is that you might start off plaing a normal game, and wish it went on for much longer, because of some interesting circumstances. I hope there is an option in game to lengthen it.

 

Otherwise, this game looks like it will be t3h r0xx0r. Especially if they are bringing back the advisor movies. They were so unbeieveably cool. Especially the modern era trade advisor when you still hadn't discovered Trade: "Trade, Sir! Discover it! This is you! This is a clue! Get a clue! Discover Trade!"

 

Ahh. Can't wait. :D

[Darque]

It's not Alpha Centauri... so... meh...

[SteveThaiBinh]

I like the idea of AI governments pressuring you to change your government system (abolish slavery, adopt democracy etc.), and I missed this in Civ3. I hope the new complexity and freedom of civics doesn't get in the way of this.

Alliance victory looks good - I hope they can make alliances more stable and the AI more respectful of them in this game. I got tired of being attacked by countries with which I had a mutual protection pact, then seeing other countries happy to sign similar pacts with them in the future.

[random evil guy]

ok, this is just wrong:

During early prototyping, it was determined that more is not always better. In order to streamline the process as much as possible and to highlight the new promotion system, we decided to actually reduce the number of units some.

 

morons! this is supposed to be an epic game; not some dumbed down board game... i guess the mod community will have their hands full once again.

[Ohma]

I like that they're adopting a SE system like Alpha Cetauri had.

 

I do hope they let you choose how long your game will be...Civ3 mad me a bit mad when I was forced to retire in 2050 (or whenever it was).

 

I also hope that they don't screw over the units and combat...

[Oerwinde]

The combat system bugged the hell out of me in previous Civ games. What with Spearmen and such killing my tanks. I hope thats fixed with the new combat system. The whole adaptive/promotion system sounds neat, as does the religion system.

[Reveilled]

ok, this is just wrong:

During early prototyping, it was determined that more is not always better. In order to streamline the process as much as possible and to highlight the new promotion system, we decided to actually reduce the number of units some.

 

morons! this is supposed to be an epic game; not some dumbed down board game... i guess the mod community will have their hands full once again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Having less units doesn't mean a dumbed down game. This promotion system sounds quite a bit like the workshop in SMAC, so there will be less units, but you can tailor the units in-game to make them individual. Why have Infantry and Mountain Infantry, when you can just have Infantry and give some the mountaineering ability?

 

Less units, more choice.

[Oerwinde]

One thing that bothered me in the screenshots was the complete lack of cities. One of my hopes for it was for cities to look more natural, more like sattellite views of cities as big grey grids sprawling out over the land. Instead there are no cities at all, just an empty space with a name over it. I hope that just means they just haven't implemented the city graphics yet.

 

EDIT: Whoops, they added new screenshots that show the cities. Though you can barely see them because of the military units completely obscuring them.

[random evil guy]

ok, this is just wrong:

During early prototyping, it was determined that more is not always better. In order to streamline the process as much as possible and to highlight the new promotion system, we decided to actually reduce the number of units some.

 

morons! this is supposed to be an epic game; not some dumbed down board game... i guess the mod community will have their hands full once again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Having less units doesn't mean a dumbed down game. This promotion system sounds quite a bit like the workshop in SMAC, so there will be less units, but you can tailor the units in-game to make them individual. Why have Infantry and Mountain Infantry, when you can just have Infantry and give some the mountaineering ability?

 

Less units, more choice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

no. less units, less options, less advanced. look at a game like hearts of iron; tons of units. tons of options.

 

like the carrier; why is there only one type? there's a big difference between modern carriers with nucluear propulsion and the old carriers from the 40s... like i said; dumbed down.

[Oerwinde]

Having less units doesn't mean a dumbed down game.  This promotion system sounds quite a bit like the workshop in SMAC, so there will be less units, but you can tailor the units in-game to make them individual.  Why have Infantry and Mountain Infantry, when you can just have Infantry and give some the mountaineering ability?

 

Less units, more choice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

no. less units, less options, less advanced. look at a game like hearts of iron; tons of units. tons of options.

 

like the carrier; why is there only one type? there's a big difference between modern carriers with nucluear propulsion and the old carriers from the 40s... like i said; dumbed down.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Less units, more options, more, or just as advanced. There are fewer units, but the units they do have have much more depth to them. Thats different, not less advanced.

[Ohma]

The combat system bugged the hell out of me in previous Civ games. What with Spearmen and such killing my tanks. I hope thats fixed with the new combat system. The whole adaptive/promotion system sounds neat, as does the religion system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, that did bug me, and I hope that they fix all the *weird* quirks that the Civ3's combat had. I just hope that they manage to strike the right balance between simplicity and complexity.

 

And I love the Pirates! engine, at least (if nothing else) the water in a Civ game will look good for once.

[SteveThaiBinh]

What with Spearmen and such killing my tanks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I always try to imagine how that could happen. I suppose a particularly strong and well-aimed spear might get into the wheels or tracks or whatever and jam them, leaving the attackers to swarm over the tank. Archers might have a lucky shot and hit the 'Open Hatch' button, then rain down arrows into the interior.

[Oerwinde]

What with Spearmen and such killing my tanks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I always try to imagine how that could happen. I suppose a particularly strong and well-aimed spear might get into the wheels or tracks or whatever and jam them, leaving the attackers to swarm over the tank. Archers might have a lucky shot and hit the 'Open Hatch' button, then rain down arrows into the interior.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If it was only once in a while that it happened it wouldn't be bad, but when one unit of spearmen kills 3 units of tanks, thats when it bothers me.

[random evil guy]

Having less units doesn't mean a dumbed down game.  This promotion system sounds quite a bit like the workshop in SMAC, so there will be less units, but you can tailor the units in-game to make them individual.  Why have Infantry and Mountain Infantry, when you can just have Infantry and give some the mountaineering ability?

 

Less units, more choice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

no. less units, less options, less advanced. look at a game like hearts of iron; tons of units. tons of options.

 

like the carrier; why is there only one type? there's a big difference between modern carriers with nucluear propulsion and the old carriers from the 40s... like i said; dumbed down.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Less units, more options, more, or just as advanced. There are fewer units, but the units they do have have much more depth to them. Thats different, not less advanced.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

that is if the system actually work, which i find very unlikely... combat and units have always been the biggest weakness of civ...

[Darque]

If they use the AC model, it'll be fine.

 

The game will still suck though as it's not AC2. <_<

[Oerwinde]

If they use the AC model, it'll be fine.

 

The game will still suck though as it's not AC2.  <_<

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well apparently they're having a crazy amount of Mod support. So chances are an Alpha Centauri mod won't be far off once its released.

[Darque]

Actually I've read that it seems they might be making an AC2 as well down the road.

 

I just want it........... NOW!

[Reveilled]

ok, this is just wrong:

During early prototyping, it was determined that more is not always better. In order to streamline the process as much as possible and to highlight the new promotion system, we decided to actually reduce the number of units some.

 

morons! this is supposed to be an epic game; not some dumbed down board game... i guess the mod community will have their hands full once again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Having less units doesn't mean a dumbed down game. This promotion system sounds quite a bit like the workshop in SMAC, so there will be less units, but you can tailor the units in-game to make them individual. Why have Infantry and Mountain Infantry, when you can just have Infantry and give some the mountaineering ability?

 

Less units, more choice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

no. less units, less options, less advanced. look at a game like hearts of iron; tons of units. tons of options.

 

like the carrier; why is there only one type? there's a big difference between modern carriers with nucluear propulsion and the old carriers from the 40s... like i said; dumbed down.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Uh huh, so you take a carrier unit, fit it with the nuclear propulsion upgrade, upgrade it with a bigger deck, add x, y, and z, and you have a modern carrier. Without the upgrades, you have a carrier from the 40s.

 

And if you want to look at Hearts of Iron, why not look it's predecessor, Europa Universallis? That had only three units, infantry, cavalry and artillery, and that was hardly a "dumbed down board game" for it.

[Darque]

What I find sad is that AC had this a looooooooong time ago, then ol' Sid decided to take a step down for Civ3...

[Oerwinde]

What I find sad is that AC had this a looooooooong time ago, then ol' Sid decided to take a step down for Civ3...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Personally, with what it looks like they're doing with Civ4, I think AC should just be an expansion. Have 2 modes for it, one you can just play a standard AC game from the start, or in a regular game it bypasses space race victory and starts you up on AC once your colony ship reaches the planet.