How to build a Mindstalker?

[feainnewedds]

I've rolled up a Mindstalker (Soulblade/Assassin) for this playthrough but I'm not too sure on it. I'm only a couple hours in, just cleared the Engwithan Digsite. I enjoy all the separate components, like the crits, sneak attacks, and using stuff like Whisper of Treason to charm enemies, but overall it feels kinda meh. I've been dual wielding swords/daggers. Obviously my MC is pretty squishy with the additional damage taken by Assassin.

Would a better choice be the Beguiler subclass? Maybe a different rogue subclass as well? Ranged instead of melee? I'm not really concerned with minmaxing as I'm only playing on classic difficulty, so many of the builds online are a bit extreme for my tastes. I've been using the Corvo build on here as a guideline thus far. It's worth noting that I'm playing with the Berath's Blessings of bonus attributes and bonus skills.

Does anyone have any pointers about how I can make a Mindstalker that is solid in combat and also perform as a decent 'face' of the party? What should I be looking at in terms of skill point distribution (and what should I put on my companions rather than taking myself?) and choices of weapons?  

Thanks!

[Drew8limbs]

I played a Beguiler/Debonair and it was awesome. I did dual pistols, and it was extremely powerful. I am relatively new so I just followed a build guide (puppet master on fextralife) and it just decimated veteran difficulty before I had any blessings or anything. I found two really good pistols super early and it made the build just vaporize stuff. 

I couldn't tell you details or why it worked so well for me, but I know it did work super well for me and it was very fun. 

[Tomucci]

My personal experience with cipher multiclasses is that I havent really enjoyed them, despite really wanting to because I love the class thematically.

I think the problem for me is always that in theory I want to play like a magical warrior that buffs themself to become powerful in melee but in practice all the buffing takes too long and detracts from what I'm trying to do in essence.

In that sense I might recommend you try playing a ranged mindstalker using your rogue to to augment your cipher and not the other way around, if that appeals to you anyway. Focusing on ranged will make organising stats easier, and focusing on spell casting might feel more intuitive for the cipher.

If youre set on melee a trickster/beguiler or trickster/soul blade is good I think. I like beguiler because you can use solid cc abilities to generate focus, and those cc abilities will help regardless of whether you're playing melee or ranged. Trickster gives really good illusion spells that will be particularly useful for a melee mindstalker, and you're only trading a small amount of your sneak attack bonus for them.

[Drew8limbs]

1 hour ago, Tomucci said:

I think the problem for me is always that in theory I want to play like a magical warrior that buffs themself to become powerful in melee but in practice all the buffing takes too long and detracts from what I'm trying to do in essence.

Yo idk how viable it is on PotD but I played a great sword devoted berath priest that was actually really fun. Spiritual weapon great sword a buff or two and it kinda slapped. You saying that reminded me of that build I tried haha. 

[crdvis16]

For Soulblade/Assassin you typically want to use a 2Her.  Assassinate only benefits the first attack out of stealth so when dual wielding your 2nd swing loses the buff.

Your survivability when playing an Assassin usually comes from being invisible a lot and just not getting hit.

Soulblades usually want to spend their focus on Soul Annihilation for that sweet raw damage.  There's a little bit of anti-synergy between Assassin and Soulblade because Assassin adds a lot of penetration (from the Assassinate bonus to penetration as well as the bonus to penetration when critting) while Soulblade is often hitting with raw damage which ignores armor vs penetration altogether.  But that's a minor point. 

What about this combo felt underwhelming?  Assassin benefits a lot from some specific items (slippers of the Assassin, ajamuut stalking cloak) so I could see it feeling a little weak early.  I've only played a soulblade once but it felt decent to me, though that was a Soulblade/Barbarian multi.

If you're set on Mindtalker:

Soulblade could pair fine with Assassin, Trickster, and Streetfighter.  I've never found a good use for Debonaire personally.

Psion probably shouldn't pair with Rogue at all- not taking advantage of Rogue damage for focus gain would feel weird. 

Ascendent could work but I'd probably go Streetfighter.  The fast recovery could be useful to take advantage of the Ascendent buff.

And I wouldn't multi a Beguiler personally.  If I did it would be with a class like Monk, Wiz, or Fighter that has some instant cast buffs that wouldn't get in the way of casting Deception spells.  They can cast deception spells basically non-stop so they usually don't do well paired with another class that wants to use up their casting time.

Edited February 5, 2022 by crdvis16

[Tomucci]

10 hours ago, Drew8limbs said:

Yo idk how viable it is on PotD but I played a great sword devoted berath priest that was actually really fun. Spiritual weapon great sword a buff or two and it kinda slapped. You saying that reminded me of that build I tried haha. 

Sounds fun, I've been wanting to try a warrior priest build, was thinking priest of wael and black jacket for the utility, I played black jacket trickster on my last run and it seemed really strong, swapping between shield and duel wield for 0 recovery when I'm attacking or defending was busted lol and both classes gave me great offensive and defensive abilities

[limaxophobiacq]

9 hours ago, Tomucci said:

Sounds fun, I've been wanting to try a warrior priest build, was thinking priest of wael and black jacket for the utility, I played black jacket trickster on my last run and it seemed really strong, swapping between shield and duel wield for 0 recovery when I'm attacking or defending was busted lol and both classes gave me great offensive and defensive abilities

I've played Fighter/Priest of Wael and its obviously super tanky, also while the weapon damage isn't that great casting Shining Beacon and Storm of Holy Fire with Tactical Barrage + Champions Boon gets you pretty respectable damage output for a tank. With blackjacket you could quickly swap to Magrans Favor + Sun and Moon in one set for up to +4 fire PL when you're blasting.

Edited February 6, 2022 by limaxophobiacq

[Tomucci]

1 hour ago, limaxophobiacq said:

I've played Fighter/Priest of Wael and its obviously super tanky, also while the weapon damage isn't that great casting Shining Beacon and Storm of Holy Fire with Tactical Barrage + Champions Boon gets you pretty respectable damage output for a tank. With blackjacket you could quickly swap to Magrans Favor + Sun and Moon in one set for up to +4 fire PL when you're blasting.

Sounds interesting, I'll def give it a look when I decide to try the build

[limaxophobiacq]

This is definitely a solid mindstalker build but it as you noted kind of extreme but a toned-down version of an Assassin/Cipher (any Cipher class but soulblade/psion) using the same weapons but skipping on the min-maxed attributes is still going to hit like a truck as long as you use stealth for alpha-strikes and then get out of harms way with escape or smoke veil.  For a 'face' a mindstalker doesn't usually have much use of Resolve (which is really only good for tanks) but Int and Per are both used in conversations and are very helpfull to a mindstalker.  You could just go 10/10/14/18/18/8 for attributes and be fine. Whispers of Treason, Biting/Draining Whip, Hammering Thoughts, and Disintegrate are the only Cipher abilities you really need, plus ancestors memory if you want to take a priest with you and kill some megabosses.

I played a build like this on Ydwin and she did pretty well even without the assassin bonus, you want Ring of the Marksman, Acina's Tricorn, Ajamuut's Stalking Cloak, and Slippers of the Assassin for sure, plus Kitchen Stove (with Thunderous Report) and the Red Hand as weapons. Might also pick up Arms Bearer for an extra weapon set to dual-wield hand-mortars.

Edited February 6, 2022 by limaxophobiacq