Having Trouble with Kana Build

[misskayrae]

So this is the second time I've played, the first time just me winging absolutely everything. I'm still pretty early in game. Level 8 I think. And before I hadn't used Kana much.

My main is a crit rogue that basically sneak attacks and interrupts enemies, picks off the little guys. Eder is my main tank. Durance is Durance. Aloth is my controller/debilitator. And right now I have Hiravias in my party because I just got him and I love him. He's likely going to be dps/support. I was using Pallegina as a bruiser on the second line which was working but I very much had to micro manage her as sometimes she got overwhelmed. I put Kana back in for a few reasons. 1.) He is a super useful party member. I didn't understand how to use him before but now that I do, he's a strong member. 2.) He's quite versatile. Even if I build him one way for one thing I can always respec and rebuild him. I have my tank, healer, and dps. The other three are combinations of uses like dps/control dps/support and I wanted to use Kana as a combo as well. I just can't decide what to do with him. At first I was using him like a controller as well. Then I thought support, because he some nice AoE's that help prevent some spells but not really enough to make him full support. Then I thought to use him as a tank. There's just so many ways to go and so many ways to build him.

Here were some thoughts that I had:

1.) I saw a post for a war bow build and thought to have him a dps/summoner with the war bow. However, I am swaying more back to the gun direction simply because guns have a higher burst damage and penetrate more than a bow. I read somewhere bows are better late game but I haven't made it that far so I'm not sure.

2.) I like the idea of having him as a side tank or bruiser of some sort. But the positioning feels awkward to me. Eder and myself are at the front (me usually coming from side). Hiravias has a reach weapon so he comes in second with Durance. Aloth is in the back of course. So I can't have Kana using guns/bows in the back and act as a tank. Unless I just had him constantly pushing back enemies. Or switch him to shield and sword. And I know that is ideal. But I could always switch between war bow and sword and board.

3.) Once I get the Greiving Mother I will likely make her a secondary tank. This will allow me to use Kana more as a dps type of character. I'm not really having any trouble yet with controlling crowds with one tank but the harder fights are definitely going to be an issue, even when I micro manage.

I just think Kana is a good filler character. And I don't know where to put him right now. I just respec'd him and realized I haven't got a clue. I have him as a tanky war bow that has some crowd control, summons, and a buff or two. I thought the Rejoice, My Comrades would be handy but very circumstantial. But that was the last spell I got because I dunno what I'm doing as of right now. I've tried looking up some builds. For some reason I'm having a hard time finding solid builds. Even just ones I can glance at and modify as I go. I feel like I'm not making any sense but I'm hoping someone can. Is there like a Kana master post somewhere?

[Boeroer]

My recommendation would be:

when getting to level 9, pick "The Dragon Thrashed" and only use that phrase. When it overlaps the damage from it will stack on enemies. If you already have enough tanks then give him a single handed melee weapon for one weapon set. This will give his offensive chants (so, The Dragon Thrashed in this case) +12 accuracy. This bonus only applies to attacks with the one-handed weapon and offensive chants.  The talent (one-handed style) does not work for the chants so you don't need it. 
The second weapon slot is for a melee weapon (for example a hatchet) and a shield. Use Ilfan Byrngar's Solace first (you might already have it, it's a drop from that Drake in lvl 6 of the Endless Paths), then later use Little Savior (difficult, hoard of the Adra Dragon). Weapon and Shield Style is optional. 
Use the armor Blaidh Golan. This one is also an early armor to get (Brackenbury Sanatorium in a crate for free).
Give him a Ring of Overseeing and later the Voice of the Mountaintop (Dyrford Village, the arms vendor there) - they both stack for chant AoE size. Alternative amulet: St. Borragia's Tears.
Give him Veteran's Recovery and Ancient Memory+Beloved Spirits at some point. Use +MIG and +INT gear to raise the damage of Dragon Thrashed, the AoE size and the Linger time.
Third weapon slot is a an arquebus or arbalest or so.
Use a Belt of Bountiful Healing and Shod-in-Faith boots.

Now stand to the side of eder like your MC does, but on the other side and work like an offtank, catching bypassers who want to reach Aloth/Durance/Hiravias etc. while chanting Dragon Thrashed with +12 ACC and healing your party passively with your Ancient Memory aura. Should you get into trouble switch to the shield setup. Should you not be able to do much because it's all so crowded and your accuracy with the chant is sufficient, switch to the ranged weapon. You will be pretty sturdy even with no shield because Veteran's Recovery and Ancient Memory stack - and should you receive a crit you will trigger Consecrated Ground, too. 

The long goal with the shield setup and the armor is to combine it with Grieving Mother's Defensive Mindweb and Durance's Withdraw (as a spell mastery):

See, chants also work when Kana is withdrawn by Durance. You you can use Withdraw on Kana but his Dragon Thrashed will still work. This is the only way how a character can do anything when withdrawn: chant (and have auras like that from Ancient Memory and Little Savior). At the same time Withdraw counts as a stun effect. If you look at your shield and armor, they both have an effect that gives you +50 to all defenses when stunned. Since a shield is counted as a weapon and all weapon enchantments stack with everything, both effects stack to +100 to all defenses when stunned. Now - if Kana is withdrawn he gets +100 to all defenses. Wow - but that's not really useful because he's withdrawn anyway. Here Grieving Mother comes into play. Cast Defensive Mindweb on the party and everybody in the party will have Kana's absolutely stellar +100 defenses with no drawbacks. Kana will be out of the fight, but he can still contribute with a chant, dealing damage. When WIthdraw ends he will have cumulated enough phrases for a nice invocation of your liking.

Dragon Thrashed will do tremendous damage in the meantime. Even before getting to that little Mindweb/Withdraw trick it will be very impactful, especially with the +12 accuracy from one-handed usage. Invocations can be used for further damage, summons or support while Ancient Memory + Beloved Spirits + the healing bonuses will work nicely for your party while you will be a versatile offtank, too.

Later with Mindweb/Withdraw you will be the absolute superstar who grants unbelievable defenses and nice healing while still dealing great AoE damage.

 

A variant can be to double down on the healing an use a combiation of short chants (e.g. the starting March of the Kamoa which does +10 Will, Fortitude and Reflex) with the Mercy and Kindness chant (increased healing done). This is also very useful for the party because the healing will be so strong all the time. You will do no chant damage then but do nice support and more healing. I have a build that uses this:

 

     
  

[misskayrae]

On 11/21/2021 at 2:41 AM, Boeroer said:

My recommendation would be:

when getting to level 9, pick "The Dragon Thrashed" and only use that phrase. When it overlaps the damage from it will stack on enemies. If you already have enough tanks then give him a single handed melee weapon for one weapon set. This will give his offensive chants (so, The Dragon Thrashed in this case) +12 accuracy. This bonus only applies to attacks with the one-handed weapon and offensive chants.  The talent (one-handed style) does not work for the chants so you don't need it. 
The second weapon slot is for a melee weapon (for example a hatchet) and a shield. Use Ilfan Byrngar's Solace first (you might already have it, it's a drop from that Drake in lvl 6 of the Endless Paths), then later use Little Savior (difficult, hoard of the Adra Dragon). Weapon and Shield Style is optional. 
Use the armor Blaidh Golan. This one is also an early armor to get (Brackenbury Sanatorium in a crate for free).
Give him a Ring of Overseeing and later the Voice of the Mountaintop (Dyrford Village, the arms vendor there) - they both stack for chant AoE size. Alternative amulet: St. Borragia's Tears.
Give him Veteran's Recovery and Ancient Memory+Beloved Spirits at some point. Use +MIG and +INT gear to raise the damage of Dragon Thrashed, the AoE size and the Linger time.
Third weapon slot is a an arquebus or arbalest or so.
Use a Belt of Bountiful Healing and Shod-in-Faith boots.

Now stand to the side of eder like your MC does, but on the other side and work like an offtank, catching bypassers who want to reach Aloth/Durance/Hiravias etc. while chanting Dragon Thrashed with +12 ACC and healing your party passively with your Ancient Memory aura. Should you get into trouble switch to the shield setup. Should you not be able to do much because it's all so crowded and your accuracy with the chant is sufficient, switch to the ranged weapon. You will be pretty sturdy even with no shield because Veteran's Recovery and Ancient Memory stack - and should you receive a crit you will trigger Consecrated Ground, too.

You are seriously a blessing to these forums. Especially as old as this game is for you to be continuing to post here is awesome. I've read several of your other recommendations as Kana and they are part of the reason I was having such a hard time deciding. XD

But thanks to your previous posts and the recommendations of others, I've already gotten Dragon Thrash. I've seen builds based entirely around the chant. Which seems like this is kind of what we're going for, here. So I've taken a few of the equipment tips you gave which, granted, I had to move some stuff around. I had the boots on Durance at first and they worked really well for him, surprisingly. BUT ON KANA. Especially with the melee at hand. I have to say... this is working very well. The Overseer Ring, too, I moved from Aloth to Kana. There are a few things I have that other characters are using and will switch over to him eventually. But this is definitely working for my party. He's like my own personal tank while Eder is just holding the line. It's perfect! Thank you!

So I also want to add that I did remove Hiravias from the party for a few days because he was busy with a keep quest. I switched him out for Pallegina while I dealt with a few things in the Endless Paths. And let me tell you... they have been just killing it with battles against spirits and vessels. Granted, I did build Pallegina specifically for that purpose. But because she tends to die so quickly (I've read this is preventable, but I want her to keep her two handed swords) this Kana build is perfect for it.

I think really this build is going to work with anyone I throw in. He's definitely part of my main party, now. Thank you!

[Boeroer]

You are welcome - and thanks for the kind words. 

[lenkite]

@Boeroer Any build that allows Kana to tank dragons on PotD  ? Or is Eder the only one who can ?

PS: thanks for all the tips you have given on these forums. Has made the game more enjoyable. 

[Boeroer]

Facetanking dragons is hard. I've had some main tank chanters in the past but they didn't tank a dragon all on their own. I guess if Kana went with defensive and healing phrases and used summons a lot and combined it with defensive gear and consumables it could work. 

@Raven Darkholmedid a solo Chanter run against dragons iirc. So if that's possible without kiting it should be no problem in a party. Just don't know any particular builds for that.

Edited March 12, 2022 by Boeroer

[Raven Darkholme]

On 3/12/2022 at 8:18 AM, Boeroer said:

Facetanking dragons is hard. I've had some main tank chanters in the past but they didn't tank a dragon all on their own. I guess if Kana went with defensive and healing phrases and used summons a lot and combined it with defensive gear and consumables it could work. 

@Raven Darkholmedid a solo Chanter run against dragons iirc. So if that's possible without kiting it should be no problem in a party. Just don't know any particular builds for that.

Kana should be able to tank dragons fine, his stats are slightly less ideal than a pc, but in a party you have way more buffs.

Also you could just take a cipher in party and passively permastun all dragons with backlash. :P

[DubiousNixie]

Alpy is immune to stun, however, but my melee setup for this on vet the last time I played 1 was Kana and Cipher Watcher on melee frontline handling the dragon and its adds (while trying to make sure the dragon focused Kana), with Pallegina providing melee cover against the adds that swarm the backline in this fight and heavy healing. Thankfully everything in that room is pretty weak to fire and Kana and Pallegina can do a lot of fire.

I was mostly surprised that Kana can be somewhat useful in melee since I gave him the BotEP on a lark after I found out the soulbound arbalest is a buggy mess.

I did end up switching Kana to Pliambo per Casitas duty for WM2 and Sun in Shadows.

Edited May 14, 2022 by DubiousNixie