New combat mechanic: Dodge combos.

[mdf25]

I would love to see the ability to dodge attacks but not so it removes the bug attack homing on to you like in the very beginning of the game.

I think a rolling type mechanic where you can duck and roll out of the way of different attacks would add to the combat. I also think that some bugs are so big that it should be theoretically impossible to perfectly block an attack. Example: Roly Poly's curl jump where it lands on you. Your shield and you would be crushed under the sheer weight of the insect, and in the best case you'd take serious injuries if you perfect blocked it with enough force to knock it back.

They could be three ways  to dodge. Q (roll left) E (roll right) and SPACE (jump out of the way). In some cases, combinations of moves would be needed to perfectly avoid an attack. Regular dodges will mitigate most of the damage, perfect timing will mitigate all damage, and give you a couple seconds of Hyperstamina.

Example use cases:
Lawn mites: You'd want to dodge left and right from their jumping attack since jumping yourself might cause you to collide with them.
Bombardier beetle: When it veers back to fire the close range spray, you'd want to roll, then jump, as to not get covered in the spray from the liquid hitting the ground.
Ladybug: Its close range headbutt attack you'd want to roll left or right - perfect blocking will still result in you taking some damage and getting knocked back. When it turns to body bump you, jump, landing on the insect to give you an advantage (an attack to buck you off could be added to counteract cheesing the ladybug from above, which will stun you and do some slight damage but not as much as what it currently does)
Antlion: When it uses the attack to pull you into its pit, jumping should render the pulling effect useless, the dirt would still need to be perfectly blocked to avoid it hurting you slightly. For its other ground attacks, jumping would allow you to dodge the small and long frontal charges, whilst rolling would allow you to avoid its jump from underground. I think the pincers on that antlion would probably be able to wrap around your shield so perfect blocking that insect for the most part should theoretically be impossible (and it's quite easy to predict his moves, so would be a nice challenge to an otherwise underwhelming Tier III foe)
Wolf spider: When it uses its swift strikes, jump backwards twice to avoid the first two sets of two, then roll to avoid its forward charge finisher. When it uses its jump attack, rolling in either direction will make it miss, blocking would stun you (and poison you if not perfectly blocked)

Pros & Cons:
+ PRO: Dodging consumes less stamina than blocking and won't stunt stamina recovery.
+ PRO: Successfully dodging an attack gives you a couple seconds of Hyperstamina, encouraging its use as opposed to blocking.
+ PRO: Dodging consumes no durability on your weapons / shields, unlike blocking.
+ PRO: The ability to dodge will allow your gear to potentially last longer if you master it.
+ PRO: Dodging could give a new mutation, which extends the window to achieve a perfect dodge.
+ PRO: A new armor set could be made (perhaps aphid!) which will be the lightest and least defensive armor, BUT rewards you for perfect dodges similar to Dazzling Riposte, allowing you to land critical hits. Could theoretically be a T2 armor since it could be bound with spider silk and berry leather.
+ PRO: A new playstyle for people who want to try something new or make their combat more exciting!
+ PRO: Would find a new challenge for those who master perfect blocking and memorizing attack patterns, as now not all attacks can be perfectly blocked on medium and above.
+ PRO: Would allow difficulty settings to be more dynamic to tune the experience, Would not punish those who want to just adventure and build in Mild mode.
- CON: The timing window for a perfect dodge is much smaller than for a perfect block. Executing it would be more difficult.
- CON: Dodging the wrong direction or failing a combo would stunt stamina regeneration slightly, as well as cause you to take slightly more damage.
- CON: Medium difficulty will become a lot harder in the late game, early game would not see much change.

Difficulty settings:
For those who don't like the dodging, its effects could only be felt fully in Woah! mode.

Mild: All attacks can be perfectly blocked and will deal no damage if done correctly.
Medium: All but the largest / most forceful attacks can be perfectly blocked. Perfect blocking a heavy attack will still result in you taking 25% of the damage you would have taken otherwise.
Woah!: All small attacks can be perfectly blocked. Medium and heavy attacks must be dodged. Perfect blocking will still result in you taking 25% / 50% of the damage you would have taken from a medium / heavy attack otherwise (which would kill on the largest insects even in full armor + shield)



 

Edited October 13, 2021 by mdf25

[Boneless pizza]

39 minutes ago, mdf25 said:

(an attack to buck you off could be added to counteract cheesing the ladybug from above)

this is already a thing for me, it happens every time i attack a ladybug while on it's back. 

[Nicholas Berstecher]

6 hours ago, Boneless pizza said:

this is already a thing for me, it happens every time i attack a ladybug while on it's back. 

Yeah, that got me and a friend by surprise. We were fighting a ladybug, she was on it and I was near it, then it jumped and killed both of us at the same time. That was like 0.8 if I remember when it was added, the new ladybug attacks. And now they are adding more moves to creatures.

[mdf25]

Edited my original post for the ladybugs bucking you off - tried that myself today just to experiment and yep it hurts!

I think it should probably hurt a lot less than what it does, since it's just propelling you upwards, but hey I'm glad they stopped the cheese strategy for it  If anything I'd say it should stun you and make you drop your equipped weapons, making you scramble for them and regroup before the lady of the clover forest mows you down

[Nicholas Berstecher]

Like what the new infected gnats do? I didn’t get to that part of the game yet, but I saw videos on the new Haze creatures.

[ScritchOwl]

Stink bugs buck you off too.  Though not alot of people probably notice due to their toxic area of effect.

I like you dodge idea but I see one problem. I don't think the current engine can support it. The problem is that the physics of the game react negatively to collisions.  I should post my megaleap video. Basically I tripped on I piece of stem while fighting orb weavers. This happened at the last opening gap in the fence by the hedge/pond and catapulted me sideways through the air past the ponds juice box.

I could see someone harvesting material to dodge an attack only to take massive fall damage from  this in-game occurrence.

[Krimson Rose]

I love this whole idea! This would make battles with bugs a little more dynamic.

[OneZombieHorde]

On 10/13/2021 at 11:23 AM, ScritchOwl said:

I don't think the current engine can support it. The problem is that the physics of the game react negatively to collisions. 

A dodge could be treated as a sideways jump, with more horizontal push and less vertical momentum within the current system. Not that it would work great, but wouldn't have any more physics problems than jumping does currently. Like simple sidestepping instead of a full dodge roll. 

Any game with melee combat should try to incorporate a dodge mechanic.  The reality though is you probably cant dodge a wolf spider anyway. XD 

[ScritchOwl]

Yeah this is a link to my flying excursion on grounded. With incidents like these. I can see people killing themselves as it register horizontal momentum as fall damage if it exceeds certain thresh holds

 

Edited October 17, 2021 by ScritchOwl
Mis click

[ScritchOwl]

Also if you leave lots of debris covering the ground occasionally you can launch wolf spiders and ladybugs. Unfortunately that's what caused the great Kaiju battle on the bridge I made to the pagado in that video

[mdf25]

I think they need to remove certain collision physics from fallen objects, ie just let you walk through them if they are small enough like clover leaves, web fibers etc. Would probably stop things flying all over the place

[PliantWalkJojo]

On 10/17/2021 at 6:57 AM, ScritchOwl said:

Also if you leave lots of debris covering the ground occasionally you can launch wolf spiders and ladybugs. Unfortunately that's what caused the great Kaiju battle on the bridge I made to the pagado in that video

I was bombing the roly poly and many times it stepped on some grass planks and flew into the universe and disappeared that I have to reload.