sniggy Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 as the "questions to devs" thread is dying with nonsense, i'll post this question separately: how is the transition to prestige going to take place? in kotor, the player had to decide at the jedi temple. will there be a similar moment regarding the choice of prestige classes? will the character have to go prestige? or will it be possible to not choose a prestige class and continue in the same class. how will prestige classes change the character (meaning his abilities, reaction of others towards him, his fighting style, appearance...)? are companions going to be able to pick prestige classes as well? that would require prestige classes for other classes (scoundrel, soldier...) as well, right? what will happen to other characters while progressing into prestige? if the level cap is at 20 with other classes, companions won't progress any further and are likely to be kindda useless if the ain't jedi themselves. it'd be nice if you could answer to any of those questions. It's very hard to be polite if you're a cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opus131 Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 Frankly, i don't think prestige classes are going to work very well. Jedi classes didn't work all that well either. The thing about prestige classes is their uniqueness. Unfortunatly, when it comes to Jedi, there isn't much you can do. You can be a melee master, or a force user master, all in different shapes and levels, and that's about as unique as you can get. In KOTOR, i played as a Gardian, a Sentinel and a Consular, and though my playing style varied with each character, it really didn't feel like i was playing a different class. As far as i can see, prestige classes seem to offer very little in terms of customization, and i think Obsidian is sort of slapping them there just because the Biowenies are asking for them. Plus, with the ridicolously high level cap, we have 30 levels at our disposal and no unique skills to gather, just new force powers after the other, frankly, by the middle of the game i'll propably loose any interest in leveling... Opus131 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge Hades Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 A jedi is a jedi is a jedi. There is no variance in gameplay regardless in the Jedi classes and it will be the same in KotOR2. You play a Jedi, you will kill everything with ease. End of Story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berserk Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 Plus, with the ridicolously high level cap, we have 30 levels at our disposal and no unique skills to gather, just new force powers after the other, frankly, by the middle of the game i'll propably loose any interest in leveling... So the levelcap has been set at 30? Unless KOTOR2 is significantly longer than the first then this might be really ridicoulous. You leveled with such a speed in KOTOR that I reached the levelcap on the fourth planet That is not how it is supposed to be so I can only hope that Obsidian makes the worlds you visit larger or we'll end up with the good'ole 8 levels per step Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drakron Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 Well I hope is that even if The Munchkin Lords have a lv30 cap the game aims to the player reach lv15-18 at the end. Having a character that could beat Yoda and dont even get XP for it is kinda ... insane. And its true that prestigue classes are pretty much useless if we keep with the same limited skill numbers of the previous title, a rework of the skill system to include more skills sould have been done but ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge Hades Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 That is why forcing the player to be a Jedi is stupid. There is no challenge in playing a Jedi and if there is no challenge there is no fun. I hope Obsidian's next game will be better than this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniggy Posted May 24, 2004 Author Share Posted May 24, 2004 hmm. i think that opus is pretty much right in all of the stuff he said right there. still, i'd like to get some news froms the devs on that. i guess i'll have to wait for the game development to advance a little further... anyhow, to me, it also felt like playing "the jedi" no matter what i chose. i'd like to see the roles of these classes reflected in the quests and the dialogues as well. though i realize that the last bit would be kindda tough on the crew. It's very hard to be polite if you're a cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zane0 Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 KOTOR 1 wasn't very challenging, but it garnered some pretty impressive sales and quite a few awards. This is all of course my opinion, but the core of KOTOR's popularity didn't hinge on it being a challenging game. My prediction then, is that Obsidian will do just what they're saying; KOTOR II will be more of the same, except with more depth and with perhaps some nicer graphics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adria Teksuni Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 I agree with the severe lack of diversity in the Jedi classes. Whoever said "A Jedi is a Jedi is a Jedi" hit the nail on the head. When it came to straight stats, there just wasn't enough of a difference. Hopefully, choosing a Prestige class will give you more of a sense of individuality in your character. We shall see. Not that I didn't have fun as a Jedi, I did, and still do. Never assume malice when stupidity is to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderAndrew Posted May 24, 2004 Share Posted May 24, 2004 Drakron, KOTOR isn't Star Wars D20. KOTOR doesn't give stats for Yoda. The rule systems are fairly different. Regardless, within the context of the story, it made sense for Revan to be uber-powerful. And we haven't heard anything official about a level-cap. It seems to be popular speculation based upon the dev's statement that there will be prestige classes of a sort. Everyone is assuming that these prestige classes work just like D20, when in fact, the dev's had said the prestige classes will be considerably different from their D20 iterations and won't have level requirements. So, you may have access to a Prestige Class after level 6 if you tweak correctly. Who knows? The level cap may be at 20 again for all we know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adria Teksuni Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 All I know is that LA refused to say ANYTHING about the level cap. Sheesh. Never assume malice when stupidity is to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drakron Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 There are epic levels in The Munchkin Lords, that much have been confirmed. I dont feel like posting "epic on Star Wars" again because I am tired of it, like it or not SW:KotOR used the d20 system and like it or not so does Star Wars d20 and there are several reasons for why there are no epic levels on Star Wars d20. Anyone who wants +20 levels on a d20 system wants a greater challange or is a munchkin (powegamers dont care as long they can have the most powerful character possible) and since Star Wars really does not gears towards that kind of high power only munchkins want to have epic levels on a system were epic levels dont exist. Epic levels were put in because of the Xbox cry babies (since OE started to work before the PC cry babies started to complain) wanted their lv 56 characters, not because the system needs then. Npw the only question is if the game aims at the party being around lv18 in the end or not, if epic levels is just to shut up the munchkins that can go around with their lv 30 characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adria Teksuni Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 Yup, it is based on the d20 system, and in the pnp the Prestige Classes are available to add greater diversity and customization to a character (in all the WoTC d20 systems that utilize the "AD&D rules") for players who want to keep playing their character in power games, but dont' necessarily want to turn them into gods. Unfortunately, as Drakon stated, a lot of people abuse it simply to get that insanely-uber character, which is the fault of the GM in pnp games, IMHO. Hopefully, Obsidian will remember the first rule of gaming; "There is always something bigger and badder than you." Never assume malice when stupidity is to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 Prestige classes are supposed to be balanced in relation to core classes, and really have little to do with powergaming or not, though it is true that nearly anything can be abused. Hopefully our GM (OE), using their hybrid of d20 and CRPG convenience, keep that in mind when implementing the prestige classes they plan to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drakron Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 True but some PtC classes such as Jedi Master are simply better, pre-requisits and losses many times are what balances such classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderAndrew Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 I take my earlier comments back. After hunting, I did find a dev confirming levels above 20, but did not state a specific level cap. You will be able to go beyond Level 20 in KOTOR2: TSL. -Chris Avellone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniggy Posted May 25, 2004 Author Share Posted May 25, 2004 well, it's not so much the classes as the powers as well. you can pick force wave no matter what jedi class you have. though that may be quite fine, it blurs the difference between these classes. maybe some powers should only be available to some classes? (before you contradict, yes i am aware that force breach is only available to councelors as force jump is to guardians- i'm speaking core powers here, such as lightsaber throw) It's very hard to be polite if you're a cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaguars4ever Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 (before you contradict, yes i am aware that force breach is only available to councelors as force jump is to guardians- i'm speaking core powers here, such as lightsaber throw) You mean "Force Focus", not "Force Breach", right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge Hades Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 Man, this game looks like it is going to be a powerlamer snooze fest with Jedi. Just sad to see the boyos who did Fallout and Plansecape Torment forced to make a piece of garbage this game is looking to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adria Teksuni Posted May 25, 2004 Share Posted May 25, 2004 Man, this game looks like it is going to be a powerlamer snooze fest with Jedi. Just sad to see the boyos who did Fallout and Plansecape Torment forced to make a piece of garbage this game is looking to be. Not that you're biased or anything. Never assume malice when stupidity is to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniggy Posted May 25, 2004 Author Share Posted May 25, 2004 (before you contradict, yes i am aware that force breach is only available to councelors as force jump is to guardians- i'm speaking core powers here, such as lightsaber throw) You mean "Force Focus", not "Force Breach", right? ummm. no. but it was late when i posted that one... so... lets settle on a maybe. It's very hard to be polite if you're a cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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