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Madzookeeper
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Posts posted by Madzookeeper
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I believe that reputation for buggy releases has much to do with publisher pressures as well--release dates, contractual obligations, stuff like that.
This Kickstarter is the perfect--the only--opportunity for Obsidian to both break that reputation and stick it back to the publishers.
It's still partially their fault. It's not unreasonable to poke at them every now and then about this.
it's only their fault if they're the ones handling the quality assurance. if they aren't, and it's the publisher doing it, then it's on the publisher.
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also, having another writer/developer means the game is going to be a fair amount larger because of it. there's only so much that each person can do, and by adding someone else to at the very least write another area it is going to make the game bigger by at least said area. which i think we can all agree is a very good thing.
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last i'd heard about paypal, it was around 35k donated (i know it's more, i just don't know how much) with about 700 backers. will get updated figures next time feargus is around.
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the screenshot/lore will be on thursday, so we're still one update away on that.
but otherwise, agreed with the FP. this was an amazing update, and shows that they're really listening and trying to do as much as they can. which is awesome.
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news on if they're going to continue taking pledges post kickstarter:
Creator Obsidian Entertainment 21 minutes ago
@Ink Blot Sorry! Saw that and the slipped my mind about answering. Yes, like Wasteland 2, we will keep on taking pledges / donations after the Kickstarter is over on PayPal. I posted this a bit ago, but this is what Wasteland 2 is doing.
http://wasteland.inx...ertainment.com/
so i'd say that's a definite yes. they are talking about adding to pledges in the next day or so. but if they're taking pledges, i'd imagine they'll up them as well, since most things have.
EDIT
i just explained to feargus how the wasteland 2 guys did the post kickstarter pledge additions, and he's sending it over to darren. so there's an even better chance that it will be possible.
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concerning the post kickstarter stuff, there isn't an answer yet, but feargus said he was going to ask darren (one of their tech guys i believe) about doing something like that. will keep you guys updated as i can.
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I will be the discordant voice here...
While I am happy that Obsidian considers adding to its design team a valuable and experienced designer (and for that reason, I wish we will reach the 2.8M), I am more wary (to say the least) toward the addition of two new classes.
New classes... again... Once again, the stretch goals unveiled are only about mechanisms, old school features, instead of offering story and exploration oriented features : increased world size, new city, new questlines...
I know that story remains a key objective of PE. Nevertheless, how does it come that Obsidian prefers to focus its communication and its aims regarding the develoment of the game on mechanics ?
There were able to offer very story oriented features in former updates : look at sretch goals 1.6M and 2.2M. I wish Obsidian would offer new updates like these ones. After all, wasn't the Shadowrun Returns additional city stretch goal one of the most exciting offered by this project ?
Based on previous comments on this update, it looks like adding new classes generate quite an appeal in the community. Yet, I think there are many people that would love to have more story oriented stretch goals. I do not blame Obsidian for adding some mechanism related stretch goals, I reproach them to do ONLY mechanism related goals.
So I hope we will be able to add Mr Ziets to the team, but I also wish for story oriented stretch goals. Maybe a 3M USD new goal ?
probably because the mechanics and world lore are what they're working on figuring out now, more than the story? this is really at the very beginning of the project, so they don't have all of those things figured out.
and as i said before, with each stretch goal the story DOES get increased. feargus said this two weeks ago (or something like that) more money = more story. it's that simple.
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not sure if this has been answered in other topics, but i'm curious.
what will hapen to these classes/dungeons/levels...etc if the stretch goals aren't met? i.e. will pallys/chanters (bards) be added in with a future expansion (paid?)
I played a bard in my first D&D game, and totally rocked it. I'd love to give it another go.
Thanks
there is a very, very good chance of that considering they normally add skills/etc, not just story and areas.
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loved the update. also love how while the classes are "generic" they have a very different twist on them than what you'd expect. good job.
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What we are also doing is adding the first expansion pack for the game to the $165 Tier (and above).
now, what's the point of tiers below $165? We help to finance the project, yet we have to pay for the expansion. Without backers there would be no game, thus no expansion...I might as well cancel my pledge and wait for the "GOTY" edition, I don't want to own/pay for half a game.
been having a really long discussion with someone else about this, but suffice to say it seems like you're viewing this through the lens of ME3 day one DLC, i.e. javik. it was obviously cut from the game to make more money. that isn't what they're doing here. you are still getting everything they promised to you, the main game, and whatever other things you decided you wanted from whatever tier you went for. the expansion is a separate entity, that is being made AFTER they have completely finished the base game. basically the kickstarter, and everything connected to it, stops at the base game. they are basically giving a gift to those that can pledge that high, and who are basically spending more than enough to get the game and expansion three times over. you will still be able to get the entire game experience, that isn't going to have anything cut from it. which was all that they promised to you.
what saying they're making an expansion really means is that they are committed to continuing this world. they are going to be paying for the expansion's creation at first out of their own pocket, which means obsidian is paying to make it, not us in any way, shape, form, or fashion, and then using the funds generated from PE sales. if they were using kickstarter funds to make the expansion pack, you would have a point. as things stand now you don't. they aren't ea/activision/ubisoft. they are basically trying to do something more like old world blues/mask of the betrayer. that isn't a continuation of the main story, it's a new story set in a new place. you may use your character, but you won't be losing anything from the main story/base game because of it.
make sense?
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@ rabain
well, they might make more money overall doing a triple a title, but how much of it would they actually see exactly? i don't know the answer to that, but i'd be willing to bet it might be somewhat comparable if this sells even remotely well. and i can get behind having the expansion pack as an add-on. doesn't effect me one way or the other, but definitely see the appeal.
what i was saying was that adding it to the 25$ tier just didn't really make any sense at all. so we seem to be on the same page really.
@ merin
ok, we pretty much agree on that. but i do think they have some ideas left, because they've pretty much said that they do have more stretch goals. i'm curious what, mind you.
they've basically already stated that they want to do expansions AND a sequel, the sequel would be kickstarted though (based on what feargus said the other day). i can find that quote if you want, but it was addressing funds from PE going to an expansion, not happening at all, and he said that they wouldn't kickstart an expansion, that they would save that for the sequel if we'd still have them.
so... *shrugs* i have no clue what they have planned for the rest of the week, but they spent the last two weeks trying to get not only those weeks taken care of but ready for this one. all i can say is i'm looking forward to it.
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welcome to all the new people! happy to have you aboard.
@ lordcrash
very nice mate. have to say i definitely like it. i'm currently working on my shield, trying to figure out exactly what i want with it.
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i.e. yep, you sure do.
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hey merin, my only thing with putting the xpac at the 25 level si how much money are they losing long term since that's basically underselling not one, but two items? they basically have two tiers where they have undersold the price of the game, the 20 and 25 tiers just to raise the money to make it, but long term... doing that even more just doesn't make that much since. they're probably hoping those people that just won't go higher are willing to by the xpac after release. at least were i to guess. they're having to balance both the now and the future, which is where things get tricky.
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I agree with OP regarding the nature of stretch goal. While I am glad that better tiers are offered to high pledger (it is only fair, in my opinion), I am concerned with the fact that, since the 2,2M USD stretch target, new goals have only been about game mechanisms and the introduction of "old school / hardcore" game features, instead of being about the story, the universe to explore.
Look at Shadowrun Returns and Wasteland 2 : the stretch goals were about expanding the universe (WL2), adding a full new city (SR:R), increasing the quality of writing (WL2, with the addition of Avelone to the design team), and more generally, making the game better.
Many are arguing the fact that mechanism are more appealing to potential or existing pledgers. I think, on the other hand, that storyline & universe stretch goals can also be pretty appealing. What about (just examples):
- Adding a long and intricate side-questline to the game, the kind of side quest that are almost as memorable as the main one
- Providing depth to a new city
- adding another region
- creating n NPCs that would have their own history, intricate dialogues, specific quests, the kind of well written and memorable NPCs
I do not mind having mechanics based stretch goals, as mechanisms are part of the game. I mind having the recent stretch goals being only about mechanisms.
Well, they are to post an update today. let us hope for the best.
basically with every stretchgoal they reach, the story additions and the game getting longer, side quests getting added, etc, is happening in addition to the mechanics based stuff. so that is happening. people have questioned feargus about that one repeatedly, and he's always had the same answer, more money=more story. it's really that simple.
there are also over 120 NPCs to be added by the backers at that particular tier, and the ones above it. someone said that they thought all of those would have a sidequest to go along with them, but having not gotten a direct quote on that one i can't really comment on it. but there are going to be more than that many NPCs running around the world.
but overall, the money going towards the game is not just hitting the goals, but hitting every other aspect of the game as well.
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there actually is a quote concerning the paypal post kickstarter:
"@Chris Buck We will continue to take donations for a while after the Kickstarter campaign. We are working on our own storefront that will take donations and also let everyone buy the latest in Obsidian wear."(Oct5)
dunno if that was feargus or not, but i'll still ask him and get a quote myself on it. but it looks like you will probably be able to for a time.
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@ jumble
i'm pretty sure that lordcrash will give it to you if you ask him, he did me not that long ago. but since he made it i'd rather not distribute it myself.
@ s_d
welcome!
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on a different note, there's no need to be insulting. it doesn't do anything but irritate people. and that doesn't gain anyone anything.
You are right. Sorry. If anyone was offended by my rage post, I apologize. It was just that I read the new update and was very dissapointed and then I came to the forum and saw lots of people just writing it off. "They do what they have to do to get more money", no they are not, they are making bad assumptions about their userbase. We don't want pets or tacked on levels to a dungeon, we just want a solid good game and even hard as it may, they should create good stretch goals which really get you excited about the game and want to have in. But perhaps it's just me who thinks like that
.Also wasteland 2 at 165? Seems pretty weird choice to me. Most want the cheapest "get the game" pledge so a 35-40 would've been more appropriate even though I think most RPG fans has already pledged for that game.
didn't upset me, just thought it was best to not have that get started in here was all.
part of why they added a pet was that a LOT of people did ask for it in the comments... i don't even know how many days ago. and there was a lot of buzz around it on there, so i guess they thought it would appeal to people. personally i think it's a nice gesture (everyone is getting a pet BTW, it's just that everyone over 50 is getting a unique KS one (comes from feargus... i don't even know how many days ago now)). doesn't do much, but it can add a little flavor.
on the stretch goals, they've been having a devil of a time with those. there's really just so much they can do with this kind of game. they can't add multiplayer, as no one wants it. they can't do... well a lot of things that have been done in other kickstarters, and i think within the constraints of a cRPG, they've done a fairly good job. but again, there's only so much that really CAN be done with it.
they aren't just doing what they can to get more money out of this, although that's part of it. they're trying to give people things that they think they actually want, and get whatever marketing out of it they can. there's always going to be people that aren't happy with stuff, but if they can hit with the majority, then that's a good thing. and overall, i think they have for the most part as seen by this being the highest pledge day since the 20th of september, both in amount (57k), and number of backers (830).
given how wasteland 2 happened to get added to this, (and i think it's partly again from the comments section about saying add another game, or say that you'll fund another game as a stretch goal), it's not really that big of a deal. as you said most of the people here have probably backed it, but i know a number of people that have been very thankful for it because they missed the kickstarter, and this lets them kill two birds with one stone. that new tier already has almost 200 backers at it, so some people must like it.
Btw, don't defend ****ty tiers by saying "it does what it has to pull in money". We are gamers here, we want cool tiers that make a better game. Not a ****ing optional unfitting pet.The problem isn't the pet, it's that certain tiers are excluded from having the pet. It is very similar to the bs publishers are pulling with pre-orders at various stores (ironic given Kickstarter's recent announcement that it is NOT a store). Exclusive content really is the kind of bs that needs to die in fire.
Give everyone the same content in game, what is so hard about that? Obsidian has a chance to make a great F'n game without the typical bs from publishers and they are pulling the same bs that publishers pull and further blurring the lines between Kickstarter and a pre-order store.
how many of the kick starters promise additional stuff in game for backing? as far as i know, there hasn't been one that i've seen that didn't do that. in this case it's a pet (which everyone is getting, just the 50+ are getting a special one). no one is complaining about the special in game item that's been there since day one, or the backer only trait in wasteland 2. it's just part of the way things are not, but this is not doing it the same was as publishers and all of the bonus DLC stupidity. nothing in these will effect the balance of the game, this is just a way of saying thanks for helping us be able to make this, not a "give us moar moneyz and we'll give moar weapons!"
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yep, you can angus. you just have to post your title here, and it'll be added within a day. we can only get a list to the mod once a day, and it gets done all at once.
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Another sucky update. Guys, you guys suck too for sucking it.
I'm still excited for this game because it's probably just the PR guy being bananas. Seriously, why can't we just get information about the game and pledges that jumps the quality of the game in big increments?
Btw, don't defend ****ty tiers by saying "it does what it has to pull in money". We are gamers here, we want cool tiers that make a better game. Not a ****ing optional unfitting pet.
They should've just prepared this kickstarter better beforehand, might've gone way better, but hey, they made it atleast
.given the way it's gone and what they were expecting, it's not that shocking. they thought they had a 50/50 chance of getting what they needed during the full length of the kickstarter, not getting it in basically a day. so it's kinda understandable that they didn't expect to need stretch goals.
on a different note, there's no need to be insulting. it doesn't do anything but irritate people. and that doesn't gain anyone anything.
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"i meant that the base game was going to be that long, not the expansion. was basically saying that they aren't cutting things out of the base game to put them in the expansion so we wouldn't get a full game experience. we're definitely getting that. "
Oh. But, this is the expansion thrad. I ASSumed. My bad.
Anyways, modern vs ancient. *shrug* Plenty of modern games are 40+ hours. Plenty of old games are really realy short. It shouldn't be an old vs new thing.
i'll give you that, but that's just what the example that i was given from feargus. so i figured keep it as close to what he said as i could.
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Is it just a little little bit too early to be talking about expansions? o.O
it's one of those things that come up when they're figuring out what they can and can't do in the game. some of the ideas that are really big, but wouldn't fit in with the time/funds that they have for this. so while doing that they'll be like, well what if we used that in an expansion? and from that point on they have a basic idea of what they're going to do for that, and they don't have to worry about it. they can also figure out how to fit stuff from that into the game to make it tie more into the expansion. so really it's a good thing overall.
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happy to help.
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So I finally got to donate. Now I just have to wait until I can donate the $20 for international shipping.
Ooops. Donated 65 buckaroos for the boxed version, but i forgot extra 15 for shipping, now what? Do another bid on 15 or....?
you can add an additional donation, and they'll basically credit it to you in a tally/combination of the donations you made. if you were trying to do it from the original thing, you'd have done your own amount, obsidian would send a survey to you asking exactly what you wanted to do with the funds (what level you were going for, if you were doing any addons, etc), and then you're good.
I'm worried. I still have received no confirmation from Obsidian that they recieveD my donation. L0L
I'd like to up my pledge to $165 but can't do that until I get some sort of email/confirmation that they've received my original pledge and time is running out.
basically they can't right now because it would be too much work, but they do have the paypal totals, and paypal is a rather trusted site. the money goes where it's supposed to if you do it through them. if you wanted to up your pledge you'd basically just do a custom amount, and NOT do the entire pledge again just what you need to reach the one you want from what you already did.
concerning changing tiers/adding pledges post kickstarter, i'm planning on asking feargus about that the next time he gets on. i even directly quoted one of you guys doing it (the e-mail above specifically), so as soon as i get an answer it WILL be posted in here. a direct quote.
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PayPal Support is Now Live
in Pillars of Eternity: Announcements & News
Posted
thanks.
and not really, if they do what wasteland 2 did. they basically made a site so that you could link your paypal e-mail with your kickstarter one under a single account, and it's really easy to upgrade your pledge that way. i've already done it twice with wasteland.