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metiman

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Everything posted by metiman

  1. metiman
    I think it's important to back up in this sort of discussion and ask the question: "What is it that makes cRPGs fun?" or "What is it that makes the spell casting aspect of cRPGs fun?" Because that's what one is monkeying with. The fun aspect. I'd rather have more tedium in backtracking back to camp then eliminate all the fun of the game entirely for a whole class of players. Again, playtesting. What if people find the cooldown version boring but don't have a good reason why? It's just something they feel. Fun is not always logical.
  2. metiman
    Using the SR system of Toughness checks and fatigue? I like the fatigue mechanic but it is mostly just a variation on the mana mechanic. Eventually your fatigue pool drops. Could be just a few high level spells before it happens. Then you either suffer some kind of physical injury and then have to go rest to gain back your fatigue or you just have to go rest to gain back your fatigue. The refill mechanic is still there.
  3. metiman
    I never seem to use potions except in the most emergency of emergency situations and even then I sort of regard it as cheating.
  4. metiman
    How old are you? Old enough to have been playing D&D for twenty years or so. Which, it turns out, is plenty of time to develop a deep-seated hatred of Vancian magic. Okay. Just curious. In the early 80s I dont recall too many alternatives for PnP fantasy RPGs. So if you hated them then you pretty much hated PnP RPGs.
  5. metiman
    Abusing the rest feature isn't strategic mastery. it's just ruining the fun for yourself. The most enjoyable way to play those games was to try to survive as long as possible before resting. What is fun and what isn't is highly subjective and not part of the rules so you can't take it in to consideration when determining optimal strategy. The fact that optimal solution isn't the most enjoyable (or even enjoyable at all) is the point of my post. Do you have a better solution? Mana pools have the same problem. They don't last forever and then you need a way to regen them. Usually involvign sleep or waiting around for half a day. Cooldowns are not a solution for obvious reasons. So what system is better? One with no limits on casting spellsl at all? That might work if everyone in the game is a spell caster.
  6. metiman
    How old are you?
  7. metiman
    Well I'm definitely in favor of time being a resource.
  8. metiman
    The danger is in choosing a model that oversimplifies actual combat situations and thus does not fully appreciate why the non-cooldown version is actually more fun to play in practice. What these sorts of theories really need is playtesting. And not by people who already prefer cooldowns to other mechanics.
  9. metiman
    In designing any cooldown system I think that's a very important question to answer. What am I doing differently such that I can succeed where every previous attempt by other developers has failed?
  10. metiman
    Only if spells can be cast instantly. What's your point?
  11. metiman
    It's important to remember that those trips are one of the biggest drawbacks to having a spell caster in the party. By removing it you do kind of make the class more powerful.
  12. metiman
    Or you learn that's acceptable behavior and just keep doing it since it's easy. The problem is there is no challenge here, so anyone can do it, it's JUST a waste of time. reward players for being good, they will strive to be better to get those rewards. "Punishing" bad players with tedium will just waste their time, they'll still be bad players. Ok, lets pause for a moment to make a couple of things clear. First, A consequence does not have to be "hard" to successfully deter the player and make him re-think his strategies. It mearly has to be unpleasant enough to make the player not wish to do it anymore. (which is what back tracking in a dungeon does. I hated, absolutely HATED having to walk back to the surface for any reason, when I was in level 2 or 3 in Dragon's eye in IWD. Therefore, I learned, real qucik, to do whatever it takes so I wouldn't have to trek back) Second, what is with you guys and your erroneous belief that Old-school = Hard? The IE games weren't hard. They were easy. But what made them so great was that they still maintained their complexity, despite being easy. Are not hard compared to what? Firkraag isn't hard? Even with SCS or improved anvil installed? Kangaxx isn't hard?
  13. metiman
    I don't think you'll be getting this. That does sound like dragon age type mages that are basically just archers but more colorful. No because in any lengthy battle the mages spellbook would quickly run out. In most mana based systems it's usually only a matter of a few rounds and then that's it. I've found most difficult battles are decided in the first 5 rounds. After that the mage can go take a nap for all I care. If you don't like the rest mechanism in BG2 for instance you don't bring any mages along with you.
  14. metiman
    Is the better prepared adventurer supposed to somehow hold back and conserve their spells? What if the battle is difficult and they are required? Intentionally not using your spells except when absolutely necessary reeks of exactly the sort of intra-casting cooldowns that I loathe. Sort of like voluntary cooldowns. I want the mage to cast every round until he cannot or I would rather not bring a mage to the fight at all.
  15. metiman
    It's true. You could make the choice an option. Ah yes. Optional cooldowns as I've posted about elsewhere.
  16. metiman
    Would not a 3 minute animation of leaving the dungeon and setting up camp also be a punishment? It certainly would for me. Just not as much of one as actually having to do it.
  17. metiman
    But how can you always prepare for a sufficiently large battle? Come back at a higher level? At some point your spells will be exhausted and your mage will become less useful. To me this is not a major problem. Not enough to make me leave a dungeon at least. The major problem is what happens when most of your party are down to 30% of their hit points and you still need time to flee the battle. In that case you still have to go through all of the motions described (and hope that you can actually get away before getting creamed). This circumstance really only arises if you are not going all the way in terms of what your party can do before regrouping. Some encounters may be so difficult that that sort of strategy is necessary but not all.
  18. metiman
    I must admit this is an interesting puzzle in itself. A role playing game has a lot of pretending. I think as long as pretense is preserved whether or not you actually go through the tedious process of leaving the dungeon and making camp is not particularly important. But most cooldowns don't respect narrative requirements.
  19. metiman
    Yes, but then you could leave the dungeon and find a safe place to rest and then return, right? I guess Josh is at least wondering about the possibility of eliminating a potentially tedious experience from a hopefully fun game. I'm not really sure what I think of this issue except that the idea that you are leaving the area should be respected. Whether this is done with a quick animation or not doesn't seem too important to me.
  20. metiman
    Nothing is good about the experience of the walking itself. I will admit that just waiting the equivalent amount of time for a cooldown period is less unpleasant. You can go do something for a few minutes and come back. But the walking has the advantage of a better conceptual framework. You understand why it is "necessary". You can't go to sleep right near where monsters would be. With an equivalent cooldown I guess you could show an equivalent animation of you going to the campsite, sleeping, etc. I suppose it would also mean that code may not have to be written for all of those extra functions saving programming time for other things.
  21. metiman
    But people have raised the idea of a only-sleep-when-actually-tired function which certainly doesn't seem unreasonable or unrealistic. So you have to find a way to wait for up to 16 hours before going to that inn.
  22. metiman
    Well the where of resting is limited in the old systems as well. As to how often, every 16 hours would seem to make sense, but if there is no wait() function that would mean continuing to play the game until the full 16 hours of wake time has elapsed. But then they would have to avoid a fast travel function as well, because you could just travel back and forth until the 16 hours had elapsed. Lots of speculation. We actually know very little. Personally I would like to see a 16 hour waking period actually enforced mage or no mage. An adventuring party isn't going to function very well without sleep.
  23. metiman
    It depends. Do I have to wait 9 hours of real time to get the wish spells back?
  24. metiman
    Well if that's the case and fatigue happens every 18 hours, say, then the presence/absence of a wait() function is key to whether leaving the game running overnight when you actually sleep will be a useful strategy or not. It's interesting that people have ruled out intra-encounter cooldowns solely based on his "Pretty much." comment. Maybe it's true but it hardly seems conclusive. If he wanted to he could just come right out and say that there will or will not likely be cooldowns within a given encounter.
  25. metiman
    So spells are recovered without sleep, but there will be a sleep() function implemented. Hmm. Seems like (if you are away from enemies) you could just go to sleep to pass the time and the time will recharge your spells instead of sleep directly. If a wait() function is also implemented it just means that you don't have to get away from enemies and find a safe place before you can recharge your spellbook (or mana bar). Seems fine to me except I'm still not convinced that that is the sort of "cooldown" that Josh was referring to when he refused to rule them out. Of course maybe a wait() function will not be implemented, but then you would still be able to recover your spells through the sleep() function indirectly through the passage of time.
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