BruceVC

SA has been on lock-down for 1 month and its time to share an honest assessment of how we doing and what the future possibly holds based on choices we have made and had to make and also the economic future Firstly based on the reality of the corrupt previous president SA before the impact of virus had a deeply problematic public healthcare system and our economy was weak and we had been downgraded fairly by the credit ratings for not addressing imprudent and egregious government spending, greed of the unions around salary negotiations and government not being able to deal with our growing debt to GDP ratio. Basically I was very worried we would not address the virus reality well due to past experiences But as a country and government we have done the best and most effective job we can do under the circumstances based on our reality .....but based on our reality is the key question. We absolutely made the right choice around implementing a proper lock-down " early" and I give full credit to our government for not equivocating around this. Some key developments Trump phoned our president to express solidarity with SA and chat about how we are addressing the spread...Im unclear what was the real reason Trump contacted SA considering his general disdain for how poorer countries do things but this call is welcomed nonetheless The W.H.O has recognized that SA is doing an excellent job at addressing virus spread and heaped praise on us. I think this is actually unhelpful and premature as we honestly have very limited proper testing equipment and we dont even have all the PPE we need, so we dont know the true nature of the virus spread. This is a global problem but worse in SA. I dont want W.HO. to create a false sense of success for SA which in the next few weeks undermines our efforts as we become lax in our efforts or the true spread of the virus becomes apparent We are deploying our ENTIRE army to address the lock-down rules and enforce important lock-down regulations, thats 70000 military personal. As I mentioned I absolutely support the deployment of the army in SA but it concerns me why government feels the unprecedented historical deployment of the army is necessary if things are going so well https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-52387962 In summary as far as addressing the virus we are doing the most effective job we can do but our economic future is looking bleak...worse than ever before once the virus ends but that we will have to deal with that later

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Charlottes-Web This reminds me of the famous childrens story " Charlottes Web " Basically a young girl develops a love for a piglet and persuades her farming family not to slaughter it for meat but then as the piglet gets older it naturally becomes a legitimate target for food .....but then a spider saves its life by writing words in its web to create the impression the pig is I suppose divine or special Its a good story because the pig survives being killed

What an interesting link, I really learn new things on these forums

Goats make excellent milk and cheese and if you dont like them they delicious and healthy to eat https://draxe.com/nutrition/goat-milk/

Elerond !!!! Im shocked, disappointed and surprised ....I would never have thought of you as someone who uses bad language ....like cursing

Elerond did you do military service or alternative service, I see Finland is on the list ?

My comments around Ktchong was just making a point on his level of trolling The reality about conscription in the USA is its never going to be realistically implemented for numerous reasons but that doesnt mean we cant discuss its benefits because there are countries that nowadays practice, or offer alternative services, conscription that are Democracies and respect human rights However I then did some research and based on the list below most countries that have mandatory conscription actually arent Democracies at all or have appalling human rights records So in fact my point is moot because the majority of Democracies that I support dont have it or have stopped legalizing it which means you right overall about conscription not being a reasonable or feasible approach governments should follow https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription

Gromnir I want to get the input from you and others who understand the USA constitution and the principle of freedom of speech and how it can be abused especially now in the time of this global pandemic and more importantly going forward how this can be prevented My point starts with Fox news, I watched the excellent series " Loudest Voice in the room ", which is about Roger Ailes and the creation of the channel. Part of the success of this channel is that Ailes identified that many Americans didnt want to watch legitimate and necessarily factual news but would be more interested in theater and news that confirmed there aspirations and biases. So the news from Fox news basically at times didnt need to be always fact checked. The reality is he was right as we can see from the success of Fox I also recognize that Fox News does have legitimate news so this is not a sweeping generalization and we also see theater and questionable news from other channels But then the evolution of Fox, or some would argue the erosion of Fox news, reached the point below where Trish Reagan in the early days of the virus and before it became unequivocal the true nature of virus claimed basically it " was a left wing conspiracy theory and an attempt to impeach the president " https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/27/media/trish-regan-fox-news/index.html Trump has definitely exacerbated the "alternative facts and fake news " dichotomy but this problem did exist before Trump which leads to my final point How did the USA, the most successful and influential country and economy in the world , end up at this point and how do we prevent this or reduce this type of media hyperbole so that it cannot lead to misinformation in a time like the global crisis where misinformation can cost lives? If the likes of Fox news can spread fake news like Trish Regan did under the auspice of freedom of speech doesn't this need to be somehow changed Constitutionally, is that even possible legally ?

Also you assumed when I say I support conscription I meant deployment to military zones to see active combat like you did when you served your country patriotically I dont mean that and never did. The military has many other roles that are non-combative and people can serve there country in these other units as an exercise that could be both character building and constructive. I am not suggesting people need to fight wars Ktchong was trolling and race baiting as he normally does, I am not and dont do that when I make these types of points

Thanks for spending time understanding the video and then responding, I am going to use some of these points to dispute what some of the my family members have been raising around this video and what they say is " compelling evidence the virus could come accidentally from a lab and not from animals " Also I see there is now an improved Corona antibody test which should be available in most countries soon https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/19/gov-cuomo-says-new-york-will-roll-out-antibody-testing-in-aggressive-way-this-week.html

Yes I did, in 1993. One year before our Democratic election, I did my basics in 1 SSB which is an armored car regiment and then I was transferred to maintenance which is a non-combative unit that involved drivers, stores and other supportive units. But SA wasnt at war anymore as the Cold War has ended in 1989 in Africa so no one was fighting actively but we had real violence in the country as numerous groups wanted to prevent our first Democratic election

First time I agree with you on something, this could be beginning of a beautiful relationship If I ran the USA conscription program you would definitely be one of the first type of citizen I would conscript, I cant think of anything more beneficial to improve your general views than 2 years in Afghanistan or the ME...trust me you would thank me afterwards

Thanks for the detailed post , you have provided me information to ponder on Would you agree with GD that the police overall for you are more problematic than constructive in making society better through ensuring the rule of law and order is enforced?

https://biblehub.com/context/leviticus/11-13.htm " These, moreover, you shall detest among the birds; they are abhorrent, not to be eaten: the eagle and the vulture and the buzzard, and the kite and the falcon in its kind, every raven in its kind, and the ostrich and the owl and the sea gull and the hawk in its kind, and the little owl and the cormorant and the great owl, and the white owl and the pelican and the carrion vulture, 1nd the stork, the heron in its kinds, and the hoopoe, and the bat. " I came across this when I was reading about the practice of globally eating bats, in both the Bible and Torah they basically mention people mustn't eat birds and bats. I was wondering what insights older civilizations of man knew that made them come to this conclusion..similar to views both Jews and Muslims have about not eating pork ( I love pork and its my favorite meat ). I would guess they would have experienced in there time period what we have now proven through our understanding of medical and scientific empirical evidence that people became sick and did contract diseases and viruses like Corona I am interested in what others may think is the reason these religious texts mentioned you mustn't eat animals like birds, pork and bats ?

I agree, nothing worse than having the webcam on and seeing my face

In SA we had a major security breach in government using Zoom recently, this was probably due to the individuals not following normal software security protocol Personally we use Microsoft Teams during the lock-down, my customers are mostly in the financial sector and they have also adopted it as far as weekly updates meetings are required . I am very happy with it and its collaborative functionality, it allows me to share files, make calls and we can have our online meetings up to 50 people

So this particularly theory is not the normal fake news around the origin of the virus, it is interesting and some credible scientists have ostensibly supported it. If you want to believe the science and the absolute truth about the origin of the virus I am not sure we will ever know with 100 % certainty. I personally believe it absolutely comes from bats and from Wuhan animal market for the reasons below. However its incorrect to say " its well known that bats werent sold at the wet markets " , bats have been a stable form of food in Asia and some African countries and I have seen documentaries that were filmed about the Wuhan market made before the virus and you can clearly see bats and many other animals in cages about to be sold for food Its is well known that bats were and still eaten in Asia and Africa as I mentioned https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bat_as_food https://recipes.howstuffworks.com/menus/bats-delicacy.htm We know form the science and understanding of the genesis of viruses that bats are indeed carriers of many of these diseases https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/29/health/bats-viruses-coronavirus-scn/index.html So Im not saying you wrong, I am suggesting the most likely reason for this Zoonotic disease is the still the reason most believe which is the Wuhan market because of the many viruses that have been proven to come from animals like bats Finally the most important question is really " does it matter the true origin of the virus" because if it was accidentally created in a lab or transmitted from animals to humans we know 2 things with certainty it comes from China it can now spread from human to human and has become a global pandemic which needs to be addressed and this is the most important point

Tell your wife thats a classic " middle class problem " ....Im sure that will make her feel better

These type of factors also have a influence on my sleep patterns and this has been raised as a real issue causing insomnia or bad sleep So the virus has created a reality where many people are not working temporarily or have been retrenched or they work in the informal sector and this type of work has evaporated due to the lock-down so most people are just sitting at home and dont work which adds to the problem around not being " socially active " as you mentioned which adds to bad sleeping patterns

But surely by now you should be able to understand and recognize the difference between Trumps tweets and general vacuous comments and when he says something that is true? For example when he mentioned hydroxychloroquine as a possible " corona cure " in that same discussion Dr Fauci responded that there has to be extensive clinical tests on any cure or vaccine which basically translates to " ignore what Trump said " So in summary Im saying dont waste so much time analyzing and criticizing what Trump says unless its supported by some of his advisors who do know what they saying and actually understand the facts. And this applies to basically everything he says, this is exactly what his entire presidency has been about and Im always surprised how globally people are still fixated on what he says as if its official USA policy

Firstly thank you for sharing, I dont think your post is long-winded at all. Its honest, sensitive and makes perfect sense. I think many people share your experience and feelings especially at the moment I also believe people are fundamentally good and most people really try to right thing in these difficult circumstances and various life experiences This virus has made all us reflect on many things which include our choices and things we have done in the past. Sometimes we will ruminate on how these past choices have shaped our current lives. My view is you cannot change the past and all of us can continue to regret things but end of the day only one question really matters... " what are we going to do going forward " So my advice is try hard to not worry at the moment about past mistakes because realistically the virus gives us limited options but continue to do things that are altruistic as they do matter and there are always people we can help in this dark times, like the elderly Once the virus is over then make those choices that can change your personal life

I hear you, I must say you have someone who has moved more around the world and had to integrate into different countries cultures than anyone I have ever known. Its impressive and I think harder to do than people realize especially if you have never immigrated before. Just in the time I have chatted, since 2010, to you I believe you have lived in Denmark, Germany , UK and Australia I have also moved 3 times in the last 20 years but its all within my own country and all my numerous trips overseas have been on holiday or work related and never longer than 1 month so it doesnt count. Just my latest move to Cpt was " stressful " and yet Cpt is considered one of the best cities in the world to live in So I can honestly say I truly have respect for your mental fortitude and how you are able to seemingly adopt to new cultures and ways of life ....you may not see yourself in that light but you should

I was wondering how is everyone's sleep patterns during the virus? There have been many stories about how generally peoples sleep has been erratic with people experiencing intense dreams and or fever dreams. Most of this is related to stress and anxiety relating to the pandemic according to sleep experts and doctors who study sleep patterns My sleep the first 10 days of the lock-down was very inconsistent, I found I couldnt sleep until about 1 am and then would wake up at about 7 am but battle to get out of bed or just stay in bed for another hour or so and then feel disconnected and generally lethargic during the day despite having to work But my sleep has had a marked improvement since I have created a routine and structure to my day based on the reality of the lock-down, being able to work remotely makes a huge difference and gives me a real purpose outside other things I do at home

I have huge respect for people who during the virus help with deeds like you did with assisting elderly people with shopping, this is a good things and deserves kudos But why would you feel more useless and less altruistic about this, I am confused as you are doing something very constructive in your own way?

Happy Birthday Calax, you know how you can feel much better about your age ...imagine being 45/46, like me, and then ask how you would feel . The truth about getting older is its all good and has its own benefits , you just want to try to have as few regrets and or missed opportunities as possible. We all make mistakes in life and do indeed have regrets but try hard to not repeat mistakes and always remember you made certain choices at a specific moment in time that seemed correct under those circumstances ...hindsight is 20/20 but this cannot be used to create anxiety about the past choices...this saying should be seen as instructive going forward only