TwinkieGorilla

um, no. you're the one missing the point. YOU roll YOUR eyes and YOU reload, because you don't like the outcome of a stupid decision. those of us who haven't been spoiled by RPG's that have strayed too far from PnP games (would you get that chance to make a stupid decision and "re-roll" in a PnP? no. you'd be out, better luck next time, etc) would have accepted our fate and dealt with it. cRPG's started out as a natural extension of PnP's. the type of fodder you DON'T roll your eyes at (sure, i'm assuming here) is about as close to a real RPG as blood is to water. sure...it shares similarities, but c'mon. give us a break, kiddo.

i hope all you devs have beards...AND I HOPE YOU'RE STROKING THEM!!!

@whipetc: speak for yourself. ever read this article? Fallout 180 or i could give personal anecdotes to the 20 year old at work who was more impressed with 1 & 2 than 3. or how about this post elsewhere just moments ago: "im a newbie to fallout. I beat Fallout3 and although the graphics are poor and isotopic view is annoying, i am currently enjoying Fallout 1 much more than I did 3"

I'M TRYING TO ILLUMINATE THE MOMENT GODDAMMITALL!!! *bows head, moves to corner, obsesses all alone*

ha! well, sure. but people are stupid.

ok, first off those Rolling Stone lists are made to sell product. they're also only advertising "best rock records" not "greatest music". secondly, there is a time and place for this kind of pissing contest...and this isn't it, friend. i've dedicated my entire life to touring, recording and performing...i "get" this debate, right? i do. it's just getting a bit esoteric for something like Fallout. Fallout is a great feckin' game, it innovated and it captivated people...and it STILL does this, even to n00bs. it's not just a matter of remembering something which "seemed" brilliant for it's time, at that time. right? this isn't really arguable.

what exactly are you disagreeing with? that's sort of a cynical view though. are you saying "Citizen Kane" doesn't belong on that list? that all those directors and writers who it influenced aren't why it consistently makes that list? or are you saying Fallout suffers from this? generally speaking...sometimes what you've stated is what occurs. but much of the time institutionalized standards of credibility and worth, like well...the Beatles, The Stones, The V.U. are there because of their influence and impact on culture or their form of media in general.

ok, you're skipping. pick the needle up and ponder for a second and forget what Chris said in an interview some time or another. think about why certain things hold high places on totem poles of "goodness". Citizen Kane doesn't consistently make the "best films of all time" because people harken back to the first time they saw that movie when it came out, ffs. most of those people are no longer on this earth. it still remains on that list because of the type of film it is. Fallout is the same. only difference is the medium.

dude. yes, i get what you're saying and i'm saying THAT AIN'T IT, MAN. there's much more to it than that. and the "much more" is bigger than what you described (which, btw, i'm fully aware of and do acknowledge).

crashgirl, i totally agree. also, a +1(billion) on the "their tech is crap" argument. yes, it is WELL known and observed that Bethie's got the hold on the whole world/environment design (even though their low-res fetish boggles minds) but their character design and animation is stuck somewhere in the mid-aughts. compare any of the animations from the CryEngine all the way back to Bioshocks' Havok/UnReal combo...i mean, it's sorta embarrassing watching Bethesda still working with what made Morrowind tick. i mean...really. ka-dunk, ka-dunk go the characters of Bethie's world.

and it was. my point is that the games are not held up in many fans' memories as great merely because of nostalgia. sure, a love for bits of the past is natural but people don't play them at the present moment and say "oh, well...i certainly remembered it being better than this." at least not the majority of fans i'm aware of. it has nothing to do with when they came out, or what else was out when they came out. they are still superior in many different ways to games which have come before and after. this negates any sort of view through nostalgia lenses. it has nothing to do with sentimentality or memory. those games were great where it counted and because of that, are still great in that regard. i have no misgivings about the fact that there was much to be improved on regarding the originals, but there has been too slim of an amount of games whose dialog, atmosphere, story, and character-building live up to them.

wait. none of what, exactly.

re: nostalgia or the ol' rose colored glasses strawman i play FO1 & 2 both about once a year and have done so since they were released. and never have i thought "man, these games are so dated" but rather "damn, they just don't make 'em like they used to!" and that's because for an RPG, i value dialogue and story above all else. i don't care if Obsidian have to use the hokey, herky-jerky animations of Bethie and their ridiculous rag-doll engine. I don't care about any of that. FFS, man...i just want to laugh like i did that first summer i played these games. that was a decade ago. i've not quite smiled like that for a game in a decade.

yeah but what it has in comparison to 3 is a story, dialogue, and consequences to your choices. i started off pretty impressed with FO3 until i realized that at level 10 i had a superman so there went the usefulness of the SPECIAL system and every single area was the same vapid, pointless albeit beautifully designed little dungeon crawl. the game is pretty "boobs" when it comes to wandering around and looking at stuff. but how long can a non-Bethesda fan stay entertained with that? not long.

yeah. Fallout 3 in a nutshell: get quest. wander around. dungeon crawl. walk into place #17. find same crap as places #1-#16. find safe full of similar useless crap and/or bobblehead. repeat ad-nauseum.

or how about Inon Zur and some tacky, sentimental, fantasy-sounding pap? oh wait.

i love how we're all struggling to get to the bottom of something we'll soon be clued in on. this really is the most exciting news since VB died, idn't it? gotta love it.

QFT. and story, dialogue and atmosphere were what Bethesda failed miserably with.

can you blame us? jeezus. first Tactics. then B.O.S. then VB dies. then Beth puts out the mess that is FO3. what i'm feeling right now is a confused mess of guardedly excited and pessimistically optimistic. or sth.

good to see you here in a positive setting!

yer. Wiki FAQ

heh. seconded. especially since i've had countless accounts banned from the Bethie site.

"Shack: So you asked them for a pitch, as opposed to pitching them a project. Pete Hines: Correct, correct. And honestly, generally speaking, that's how it works best, which is: you've gotta have people who are really vested in the idea that it's their creation. "This is what makes us excited. If we could do this, this is what we would want to do." huh. usually reading Hines' words gives me diarrhea, but this...this...i'm impressed with.

*bows, politely*

i hope not. i'm completely incapable of said act.