Baraz

The discussion began as trying to understand the upgrade system in relation to the massive debuff players are hit with if they do not have an item of the proper tier. I maintain this is about a basic game system that will hit all players alike. Yes, though, the secondary topic of trying to get a Unique of a higher tier is meta-gaming (not in a pejorative sense) ; which is your true argument for placing this under character builds. The notion of spoilers is not an argument relevant to this thread, unless we discuss which Unique weapons are the best and where to find them (not the case).

It is not my experience, but if you say so. The moderator will decide.

I really do not think this is at all about builds. This is really just players trying to understand the base gameplay system, where the player is hit by massive debuffs if below tier, the player gets lower tier Uniques (that cost A LOT to upgrade) if they do not have a higher tier item equipped before looting a Unique, etc. It is core information that should have been in the game. I would even dare say it is a design issue. It is not about builds at all. No one here mentioned anything about skills, nor about using any specific type of weapon, not even combat style, etc.

On the question of do you need to upgrade only one weapon or only one armor to uplock a new Tier, I just wanted to add that your highest weapon tier also applies afterwards to looted Unique shields and grimoires. It is not obvious, so thought it might be useful to mention. While your highest armor tier only affects looted Unique armors. nb: I believe the highest tier item must be equipped, but I did not test without them equipped.

It is under the Crafting tab on the camp's Workbench.

n1ck_knack wrote (in the update you mention) : "the game calculates your character's tier is by simply picking the highest tier out of your first loadout, second loadout, and armor. Whatever item has the highest tier is what the game chooses when comparing you against the enemies." Example: you can have in hand a Common grimoire, but have a Fine weapon in your second loadout (not in hand), and you are therefore Fine tier. For players reading here : That said, upgrading your grimoire gives casting bonuses (reduced cost & cooldown). Upgrading weapons still boost their damage/stun. BUT you will not be hit by the tier buff/debuff if at least one item equipped is high enough tier (even if not in hand).

I believe it. Just reporting that in my test, removing my Fine armor did not reduce my spell damage in the above set-up. Possible explanation: does the game just check the highest tier among the equipped gear? Or maybe there are nuances we do not know about.

So I did a little test : Casting Blizzard with Common +1 Wand and Common +2 grimoire in hand, and then again but with Fine weapon/grimoire instead. BUT my second weapon set had Fine +0 mace/shield, which probably screwed my test. That second Fine set screwed my test. My armor is also FIne +0. RESULT: The damage was the same versus spiders Tier 2 with 2 pips (so 2.2 you could say). Damage was 15 all the time, even against inanimate objects. UPDATE - NEW RESULT : but by removing my second set of Fine gear, the Common +1 wand and Common +2 grimoire were doing only 5 damage with the same Blizzard spell. This is quite a difference ! Note that I also tried with Common armor, but one set Fine weapon/shield, and my spell damage remained 15, so Fine tier nonetheless. CONCLUSION : evidently, as Patronkus said here, the game looks at your equipped gear (best of both weapon sets) to determine your comparative tier for offence. So even if your grimoire is Common, if you have your best tier equipped in the other weapon set, you are good to go. Armor did not affect my spell damage in this test, but maybe the game does consider it (?).

I see your logic, though I had to think it through. There is a similar logic as you had to upgrade your weapons in PoE2 to avoid doing little damage versus certain enemies. Some players who really ignored all the cues would get annoyed, but the game tried hard to explain it to the player. PoE2 though had the merit that those rules were extremely clear in the game's info and even tried to warn you if you were using a weapon that lacked the "power" (Penetration) to overcome the target's resistances. In Avowed, the tutorial on upgrading gear is about 5 generic sentences, maybe less. I am not exaggerating. Unlike PoE2, they are not explicit values we can see and compare. We here have to guess how the player's tier is calculated (I still have to do some tests in-game to verify our theories) and we can see if the enemy is Tier 2 for example (though each tier has 4 ranks) and a skull if we are a good amount below. I prefer explicit stats and of course a better tutorial for something so impactful. When I upgrade a grimoire, for example, it only tells me that I improving cost and cooldown, but it probably also affects the whole tier buff/debuff system. Mind you, what I just said can easily be fixed in the current game. The said values exist and a better guide/tutorial page for that can be crafted between one patch. The gear found being of our tier is still weird, and I hate the meta-gaming it allows, but I guess it is needed currently (? It could be pre-determined per region and special for some uniques).

Oh, average equipped gear : ok, that is important to know.

I would add that, as someone focusing on magic, I have many grimoires... upgrading all of them does not seem possible. BUT, on the other hand, is my spell damage gimped if I use a lower tier grimoire or no grimoire at all? Do I just need to have one single high-tier weapon equipped? (or armor?) Go figure: it is rather occult.

I feel very uneasy with this system. The extra buff/debuff in addition to your gear not being up to par.* The meta-gaming being too rewarding to the normal immersive playthrough. * "Tier difference rules now only apply when there is a +/- 4 level gap." * "Reduced damage reduction when player weapons are closer in tier to an enemy." (Eh, this line implies you do less damage even if you are less than 4 in tier difference!) Some aspects of this system does not feel intuitive or immersive or logical. There are notably Tier 2.1 or 2.2 enemies in Dawnshore, where materials only allow upgrading to Tier 2.0 (Fine baseline). So not only do those enemies do massive damage (I play PotD), our own damage is very much reduced. For my fun, I adapt to it, somewhat, without meta-gaming ; that is making sure this odd system does not break my fun/immersion.

Now that I have played more, there are memories about the history of The Living Lands ...

Well, well, well : it turns out that the larger diamond around the compass indicates the North. I never noticed or realized : someone had to tell me. My brain ignored that aspect as just UI decorations around the compass (the Human brain filters a lot of info). On one hand it is embarrassing, on the other hand I give feedback on purpose, because I know it is precious to improve stuff that we may not notice as devs. I am presuming many others like me did not catch it.

In the temple of Eothas, I found a book that only says the existence of The Living Lands is a mystery and that it seems to be missing a true name. As a player, I took this as meaning that we might discover more about its true nature and history later in the game. But maybe Grimo88 is far in the game or finished it and still has no satisfactory answer about its history.