[NO demo for KOTOR 2]

Was there really a demo for KOTOR 1? A real, playable demo, not just a movie demo?

 

Well, to me it's no concern if we get to see a playable demo or not, but I hope we'll at least get to see one more movie demo at some point...

[Strong hints that more than T3-M4....]

VERY small possibility. Using an escape pod, he crash-lands on the Unknown Planet; as in, right next to the greatest concentration of Sith in the Galaxy. His chances of escaping are pretty bleak, even if he didn't have the cojones to go down with the ship along with the Admiral.

 

Well, he could always have gotten aboard on a flighter, then ;p. Still, I dunno if he'd be a good joinable character (VERY doubtous..), even if that would be a very good Yoda-ripoff . Heh, I can even imagine us only meeting him briefly at some point in the game, hiding on one of the darker planets of the game (as Yoda did; a planet strong in the Dark side is a good hiding spot if you want to hide from the dark side, apparently..) :D.

[Strong hints that more than T3-M4....]

I actually wonder if Master Vandar really died on the Dark Path. The name of the ending movie tells us that the female admiral certainly meet her end, but it doesn't say anything about Master Vandar, meaning that a very small possibility exist that he escaped by the use of an escape pod or something else.

[KOTOR II Characters]

I find that unlikely, remember his pledge? Wherever Revan is, Canderous is probably with him/her.

 

Unless Revan sent him out on some mission before he disappeared. Perhaps, assuming that he's in hiding at the current situation, he ordered Canderous out on some mission or told him to lie low somewhere until he was again contacted by Revan. That could be a potiental reason for Canderous to join the new main chara; it's waaaay past the date of when Revan was supposed to contact him, so Canderous joins the main chara in order to find out what has happened to Revan.

[Should Characters Return At All?]

Speak for yourself, I for one have a very good and enjoyable life.

 

How very fortunate for you, then ;p

 

Nah, irony aside, what's wrong with people saying that an animated/computer-made/etc character looks hot? That doens't make all of us a Kagami

[You "forgot" to use the force? oh, come on....]

When the PC is starting at 0 XP yet a veteren of the Mandoloiran wars, which the two does not make any sense to me. 0 XP is fresh out of the academy/high school, not a veteren of a 4 to 6 year intergalactic war. Yet Obsidian says he is a veteren but with 0 XP BECAUSE THEY SAY SO without giving any game mechanic justification.

At least on this one I can partly agree with Hades_One. In KOTOR1, the main chara was, at least if you choose the warrior class, supposedly just out of the academy and hadn't seen any (or much) real action yet (don't remember about the other classes, through..). Thus your main chara had a good reason for starting out at 0 XP. But why start a character at 0 XP when you can say almsot for sure that he saw some action (otherwise how could he be a veteran)?.

[You "forgot" to use the force? oh, come on....]

Hey, what can I say? I am a role player first and foremost and if those who design Star Wars games want to do funky crap like this they best make sure that it is plausible in the story line AND works with the game mechanics involved.

:sigh:. Hades_One, not everything in the Star Wars universite can be explained in terms of game mechanics! Must everything be "translated" into game mechanics for you to "tie it all together"? Is it simply not good enough to trust how the story only explains it? .

[You "forgot" to use the force? oh, come on....]

Sorry, Jedi Knight 2 is not a role playing game therefore has nothing to do with KotOR2.  Jedi Knight 2 is a action game and nothing more and leave the story aspects and game mechanics of an action game out of a CRPG.

 

Well, JK2 and KotOR2 do have one thing in common - both exist in the Star Wars universite, so if something that happened in one of them is possible, why wouldn't it be possible for the other one too? Heck, KotOR2 even uses some Force Powers from Jedi Academy, so...

[Is Mira Ugly?]

She cannot nor will she ever be a real boy... er.. girl.

 

Let's simply settle for tomboy, then

[First impressions]

The lack of good CRPGs are going to force me to buy this game. :D

..... :speechless:

[Corruption]

The limit on force persuade can be through numerous instances. There were will-improving neural enhancers in the first game, some actions you propose will not work on some people if the action in question is entirely against their nature (a miser wont give you free credits), strong willed characters like force adept, shrewd characters and so on. I think more general use would be preferable to specific instances of its use. Being able to gleam a little more information from people than you would otherwise (without being overly charismatic) at the cost of reputation and relations with that person. Someone who uses Persuade and force persuade is a more sedate character who wants to experience more dialogue than someone who just wants to swing a lightsaber. I'd like to see this character path explored and rewarded more fully with both the option to complete quests using wit and charm and gain more of an insight or depth into the story than an action gamer.

 

Well, if it was pissible to use Force Persaude in (almost) every dialouge in the game and it was balanced by the factors you mentioned, then I suppose that a major use of FP could be accpeted by the great majority out there :D.

 

Diplomatically, Jedi have been known to use force suggestion to project feeling into their speech for example when calming a situation, or emphasising a plight or point of view.

 

Well, it goes a little further than only that. Remember that Qui-Gon used Force Persuadion (or at lest some mid-trick) on Watto to try and get him to agree to take republic credits? It didn't work, but it's a living proof of what a Jedi can do when he feels that "The end justify the means".

[Spaceballs Easter Eggs]

If you trust someone, you will only end up being backstabbed from the front.

Spoken like a true Dark Sider, I see

[Corruption]

(Dead Skin Mask) So TSL will be like an episode of Jerry Springer? 

 

Cheers!

 

 

Can't really comment ont hat since I don't "know" Jerry Soringer

 

(Naso) Why doesit have to be force persuade? Just as interesting would what I think I remember in some sort of interview, that you could influence people by your actions like in real life, if your mentor or best buddy started doing something it would complicate the moral issue and if he also got success and glory maybe it just might be enough to disillusion or maybe even *eventually* turn someone.

 

Yes, I remember that too: our actions will infludence the people in our part, but dialouge will (or rather: should!) play an important part here too, since you may need to convince other party members that your conviction is the correct one: For example, if you make an evil deed/choice, a party member might silently go along with it, but later he/she may confront you about your choice and that's when you may need to convince him/her that your choice was the right one and then he/she may come to agree and this he/she is a little corrupted. But I doubt merely actions will affect the members of the party in any case (or at least in the long run; you actions may indeed corrupt, but for the final step to be made, some dialouge should be in order).

 

(FireWolf) It has to be force persuade because this is a very under-used power that opens a lot of possibilities for achieving goals without resorting to violence. Probably not the most evil way to accomplish your goals, but certainly very manipulative. Power, in all forms, is attractive.

 

True enough that Force Peruade would have a great deal of potiental if being useable that often, After all, both Jedi and Sith alike often use this power to suit their purpose, so... but I think some might argue that if you could Force Persuade in all kinds of situations, the game'd be too easy...

[Corruption]

Well, if you already have somebody else in your party that you are manipulating, hopefully more than one, then they can take care of that...that's why you still have to be careful...I didn't mean that you can do anything you want, but that's just crazy!

 

Heh.. Well, easy to say, harder to do. Even if you manipulate more than one, it might still go wrong somewhere. Remember that KOTOR 2 isn't like KOTOR 1. If you manipulate one or more people in your crew, the lightsiders of the crew, like Krea, might object to it all and a fight may break out . Not an entirely unlikely scenario considering that it has been said that there will be more confrontations and such when the people in the crew have different options on what should be done, like the confrontation just before the Star Forge.

[Strong hints that more than T3-M4....]

There's a few characters I'd like to see returning, but of all of them, Canderous sounds like the most likely one, particulary becuase that he doesn't die in any of the branches of the game. It'd be interesting how he has changed since the first game... As for the others, I'm not expecting too much and it'll all really depend on what path you choose the game to take in the beginning...

[Corruption]

I'd like to play a Dooku-like character. Both deft with charisma and a lightsaber and a few force powers. Basically if they allow more character exploration through dialogue I'll be happy. More persuade options (force or otherwise). I'd like to see Force Persuade far more a frequent an option. I mean, Obi-wan used it on storm troopers and drug pushers. I want general force persuade use.

 

Meaning that you want us to be able to know things about the other characters of the game through Force Persuadion? Like, you have a conversation with Mira about her past and then you have the option of either ask her the normal way about it, persuade her into telling it (which she might do kinda unwillingy) or Force Persuade her to do it, meaning that she won't mind because that the Force Persuade makes her think it's her own idea to tell it, instead of as in the case of the mere persuade option think of it as as a "Ok, ok if you insist!" thing...?

 

I think force persuade on Jedi characters should be ineffective and you have to rely on your wiles to convince them to do things out of character, or convince them of a different point of view.

 

Why? We all know that a Jedi isn't immune to others using the Force on him/her just because that he/she is a Jedi. This may be especially true to a character that is your apparentice (thus trusting a lot on you) or is simply a Jedi or someone far from as experienced in the ways of the Force as you are. A Jedi knows ways of resisting or defend him/herself against such use of the Force in such ways on him/her, so I do think it should be more difficult to convince a Jedi this way and nothing you'd want to rely too much on.

 

Dialogue is important, and if it can be used to solve quests rather than smashing stuff (and still gaining approx. same xp) the game becomes a whole lot more open-ended.

 

Quite right; it's important that the game will provide other solutions than plain combat and for that and other purposes, I'd gladly see more general use of the force persuade option.

[Corruption]

(OLD SKOOL WHEELMAN)Well, we also have to take in consideration that he was working in utter secrecy...we don't really have that problem, do we?

 

Oh, I wouldn't know... Your other party members might notice that something's amiss somewhere and should you somehow overstep your limits (in terms of your powers of persuadion) or do something in front of your other party members who notices that soemthing's DEFINTIVELY amiss, then all hell may break lose and in a best case scenario you'll jsut have to start all over or wait until yours kills are better ;p

 

(SilverSun)Guess part of that will be up to the player and how they spend their skill points and what force powers they choose.

 

Indeed. After all, can't expect all people to possess a silver tounge :D

[Corruption]

Palpatine pulled it off quite well...didn't he?

 

Hmm, point taken but... Palpatine was a master manipulator and it seems like he had to work very carefully for years for his mind control to bear fruit . and also, we're not going to play the game as Palpatine, so we may lack his talent <_<.

[Corruption]

I think the first time through, I'm going to mess with their heads...telling him which side is the best and then changing my mind...that would be fun...

[Corruption]

(OLD SKOOL WHEELMAN) More persuade options, bonuses, and the like, maybe enough to corrupt with... 

 

Not quite . Ok, it'd do but it's be more fun if the Sith Lord class meant some extra dialouge options that couldn't be accesed by other chacter classes or a high persuade skill .

 

(OLD SKOOL WHEELMAN) All jedi aren't necessarily strong minded...like your apprentice...  

 

Heh! One would assume so, but I'd also assume that there's limits for what mind control could do in the long run

 

(ampulator00) For Mission, you could have persuaded her that she didn't need to care about her brother anymore, and force persuade Zaalbar to kill MIssion if you were dark side. From what I heard, it seems they are going to expand on that. Makes me wonder, though; are some characters DEFINITELY going to be good/bad no matter what? And, are we going to be able to force persuade on our own party members?

 

Hmm, never discovered that you could Force Persaude Mission to not care abotu her brother anymore... The Zaalbar one is a well-known one, through, but Zaalbar doesn't become much corrupted by that, nor does he become corrupted by taking his brother's side in the feud on his home planet... Hopefully we'll be able to see soem real changes in your party member's alignament depending on your choices or what you talk them into choosing on their own quests.

 

And, yes, I also think some characters will be good/bad no matter what. Take Krea or whatever her anme was. She sounds like the "Jedi Master" type of this game and she is also old, meaning that she knows better than most how to protect herself from the Dark Side - and she also knows what horros the Dark Side brings on others and the one who wields it, so she's probably going to be one of those who will stay good until the end. I just hope not too many characters in the game will be like that :/.

[Corruption]

Of the new stuff that will be in KOTOR 2, this about being able to corrupt your fellow party members is probably what has gotten me most interested so far! . Especially since this is something that so seldom appears... Sure, Baldur's Gate and a few others I know of have had alignament changes within your party, but it wasn't something you could at will or through careful manipulation. Rather it was mostly story-driven alignament-changes... But I wonder exactly how it'll be done? Only through normal dialouge and such based on what choices you make and/or how much admiration that character in particular you're trying to corrupt has for you at the point where you try to corrupt him/her? Besides.. I also heard that you'll only be able to corrupt or, in case that you're a lightsider, change the alignament of a character for the better, in the case of the neutral members of the party? If so, that's kind of a pity :/. Not that I can't understand why Obsidan would, for now, choose to limit it to neutral characters only... but in my opinion, it's going to be a little less fun if we can't convince any of the "goodys" that being evil can be fun too ;D. And the same goes for the reverse; why leave out the classic "come back to the light side" stuff as well?

 

Also, I wonder about one of the new character classes, the Sith Lord... It's said about this class, as quoted from the GameBanshee unoffical KOTOR 2, "Sith Lord: Mastery of corrupting the wills of others.". I wonder if this is somewhow connected to the corrupting of other party members or other people you'll meet in your journeys, like givng more dialouge options and such availabe to the Sith Lord only? Or will it simply be "just another class", just giving bonuses so some skill and such and that'll be the only function of the class in the game? :/

[Is Mira Ugly?]

Mira doesn't look bad in the pic, but how are we to know if that pic is any real improvement? It might as well be an "old" pic... That pic if from the new Gamespot article regarding E3, right? If so, that might as well mean that the pic was taken out of the E3-demo and thus there haven't been any improvement since we last saw it. I could be wrong, through since the E3 movie that have been put out as a preview for us doesn't show Mira in dialouge-mode...

[Love in KOTOR 2]

Final Fantasy?  I know it was console, but....

 

I don't think so... The idea of creating romances in games came first from Japan, I'm certain, but not from Final Fantasy.

[Main villian]

Okay, how about if in TSL there are 3 Sith factions (Darth Sion's Assassins plus 2 others). There is also the Jedi (who are in hiding). In order to complete the game you have to join any one group and destroy the other three.

Doesn't sound too bad, but then each fraction would IMHO need strong characers and believeable purposes for what they're doing ;p

[Love in KOTOR 2]

I like romances in games, but I prefer them to be as well-done as possible. BG is one of the best examples while most other romances I've encountered in games so far have been a little... bleak. But I think that for the most part, the romance thing isn't treated too seriously by the devs and thus they seldom come out too well, which is truly a pity :/.