Should Revan have an "official" face/storyline?

[Darth Sirius]

I was reading the forum then signed up just so I could reply to this. (First post, hello everyone!)

"Tradition" doesn't always equal "right", and it would bother me greatly if Revan was made officially male because of "tradition". It wouldn't hurt the Star Wars universe to have a few more female leads, heck, it could only serve to help it. Sure most of the fans are male, but having a few more women as leads could only help to bring in more female fans and with more and more women kicking butt in movies and television we're seeing men get more comfortable with the whole idea (Ripley in Aliens and Sarah Conner in Terminator helped pave the way for Buffy, Xena, et al).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

*sigh* Female fans play female PC's, male fans play male PC's in most cases. That isn't going to change! I'd be upset if Revan was officially female, you'd be upset if Revan was officially male. So for gods sake we need to choose our own Revan again, I think a movie is unlikely so I agree with you we want NO official Revan, it would upset and alienate to many fans

 

p.s welcome to the boards

[Eddo36]

Good point. But the official story can be based on a specific path in the game, can't it? The one that most people like? Better than having no official story at all. It will have no affect whatsoever on the game, future games, or how people choose to play it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But how do you determine "...The one that most people like.."?

 

A poll on here? That's not an indication of everyone. That's an indication of those who frequent this forum. A poll on Lucasarts? Again, not a good indication because not everyone who plays the game goes there (myself included). Assume he's male? Then you alienate many female gamers, especially those who are "hardcore" and probably enjoy the fanfic side of KOTOR more than most. Assume she's female? Then many guys on here will be upset.

 

I just think there's too many different scenarios that it would be difficult to decide which one to use, while at the same time, not alienating a good percentage of fans.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Random sampling does work in sampling the majority. If you're saying a poll is too hard, then maybe the people incharge of the Star Wars storyline pick a storyline. They seem to be very creative. Not trying to alienate a few but regardless, if there wasn't an official story then everyone loses out. No one has anything to lose by picking an official storyline for the Star Wars universe, and almost every Star Wars fans has something to gain if it was possible for a Star Wars novel written on KOTOR.

 

I personally can go either way with either gender, but the question is: why would people be so upset on what happens in the official story when they are free to play their own way in the game? It wouldn't affect them one bit in their gameplay, and it would benefit those fans of the Star Wars universe by having an official storyline to follow outside of the game. As I said, the official storyline will be seperate from the game where players can choose their own storyline.

[Atomic Space Vixen]

Some parts of tradition should indeed be done away with, but this is one that I wouldn't mind too much.

 

Star Wars has male leads, true, but they also have very strong female roles, which at the time Ep. IV was made, was still rather something of a breakthrough.  If I felt that the franchise was suffering due to casting women as second class citizens, I would be among the first to demand that Revan be female, but as I don't think it does, I am content. 

 

Oh, and welcome to the boards, sorry I haven't said that before!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you and Darth Sirius for the welcomes.

 

The franchise is suffering due to George Lucas losing touch with what makes for an exciting and compelling story both as a writer and director, but that's for another forum.

 

I look at this like Star Trek: Voyager. Up to then, all the main character captains (i.e. not guest stars) had been male. Introducing a female captain was a pretty brave stand to take, and it worked. People didn't really have an issue with Captain Janeway as a woman. They had loads of other issues with the series, but the gender of the captain wasn't one of them (at least in anything I heard).

It's not like it would be changing an established character from male to female, it would be creating a whole new character. It also wouldn't hurt some people with attitudes to see a strong female lead instead of just a strong female supporting character.

It's all moot though, because there shouldn't be an official Revan.

[DesertHawk]

It has been said that Revan will be based off of what you say to, uhgh, what's-his-name, the "cutie boy" who is taking the place of Carth.

 

I doubt we'll ever see a KOTOR Movie (How far will Lucas go to be able to swim in 100$ bills?), but I can imagine a KOTOR book based off of the playable NPCs.

 

As for Revan's face. Well. That's what hoods are for. And telepathy...or voice distortion.

 

Considering that everyone is extremely protective of "their" Revan, I imagine they'll attempt to not take too much control of us in the "Build-Your-Own-Previous-Protagonist" scale of the game.

 

Personally, I adored my female Revan with her snazzy yellow lightsaber. . .Soldier/Consular. They're what dreams are made of.

[Nur Ab Sal]

I think that in case of a book Revan should be really killed on his flagship, simply becouse of lack of a real face of that character. Revan is just an avatar created for players to enable them diving into storyline. What annoyed me in KOTOR was lack of determination who should be most important. When the game begins Bastila is presented as nearly a anakinskywalker-like Choosen One who can save the galaxy. Later she falls in a very unconvincing way, and Revan (player) becomes the real power. They should make Bastila PC - like Kyle Katarn at start, or they shouldn't create her at all.

 

But in case of a novel Revan will be hard to define. That's why he should be eliminated and his story in game series treated as infinity. In the novel Bastila should be a main hero and there are several reasons:

 

- other NPCs are of second importance and any of them no matter how fun and well-developed cannot be presented as main hero -simply becouse they aren't powerful enough.

- Bastila is the most powerful force-user in the galaxy of that time, only Revan, Malak and Bandon are of comparable strength (and she's the youngest, most unexperienced of them all- Revan and Malak in their 30s can beat her only becouse of their matured experience) add her unique Battle Meditation and you will get the whole picture.

-Bastila is interesting for a writer becouse of her complicated nature and emotional problems. She isn't just another slashing-everything goon like Maul. This girl has a real psychological portrait. Talented writer could make a similar

novel to Stover's Shatterpoint where we can see Windu's twisted personality. Bastila fits perfectly for such a novel.

- these two reasons are enough to make Bastila a main hero of KOTOR novelization. Revan only collides with her and so he should be killed quickly.

 

Revan has too many faces - as many as there're players in the world. Choose one official face and everyone will feel offended...

 

Love her or hate her, objectively, Bastila fits perfectly for a main hero of a KOTOR novelization.

[Eddo36]

You really want that princess to be the main character?

• Don't forget that Revan lost all his memories, powers, and skills and had to relearn them in the course of weeks. Bastilla and Malak all had their skills learned for years.
  
• Even Malak said that Revan would be a better asset to him than even Bastilla and her famed Battle Meditation.
  
• Who needs Battle Meditation when you're a charismatic leader and a tactical genius?
  
• Bastilla was the one who got lured to the Dark Side by Malak. And you have end up saving her, killing her, or joining her.
  
• If you have Revan killed at the beginning on his flagship, they won't be able to find the Star Maps and Malak will end up decimating all of them.
  
• You have to whoop up Bastilla more than a few times to win that first game, kinda shows who the way stronger one is.
  
• Bastilla can't even beat Malak on the Leviathan, she just stupidly rushes at him while I was whooping up Malak and ends up being captured.
  

I can go on and on, but the bottom line is why would choosing one official face make everyone else feel bad? They can choose what they want in their game, after all.

[Nur Ab Sal]

Of course that Revan would be a better asset that Bastila. In the beginning of Mandalorian War he is a full fledged Jedi Knight. Bastila is a teenager and her

force control and experience is weak. Besides Revan has thousand faces to me and I don't want to have one official (70% agrees with me). And what with battle meditation? Malak and Revan are so powerful - but not they change the course of battles. The arc of the game is a run to eliminate Bastila - first Malak later Jedi (on a Star Forge).

 

Comparing Bastila to Revan is like comparing Jacen Solo to Luke Skywalker. Or Luke Skywalker to Vader. Different boxing class...

 

Star Forge would be find anyway. Star Forge was a military installation in a backwater system - like Death Star in Endor. Sooner or later Republic spies would have learn about it. The quest for star forge is as stupid as quest for power words in Neverwinter Nights by the way. When I bought this game I hoped for some

military missions not running for some star maps. This was too naive. We almost don't see war in this game. All we see is Starmaps heat.

 

I think that you indentify yourself with Revan too strong. It's just our avatar and nothing more.

[GhostofAnakin]

I think that in case of a book Revan should be really killed on his flagship, simply becouse of lack of a real face of that character. Revan is just an avatar created for players to enable them diving into storyline. What annoyed me in KOTOR was lack of determination who should be most important. When the game begins Bastila is presented as nearly a anakinskywalker-like Choosen One who can save the galaxy. Later she falls in a very unconvincing way, and Revan (player) becomes the real power.  They should make Bastila PC - like Kyle Katarn at start, or they shouldn't create her at all.

 

But in case of a novel Revan will be hard to define. That's why he should be eliminated and his story in game series treated as infinity. In the novel Bastila should be a main hero and there are several reasons:

 

- other NPCs are of second importance and any of them no matter how fun and well-developed cannot be presented as main hero -simply becouse they aren't powerful enough.

- Bastila is the most powerful force-user in the galaxy of that time, only Revan, Malak and Bandon are of comparable strength (and she's the youngest, most unexperienced of them all- Revan and Malak in their 30s can beat her only becouse of their matured experience) add her unique Battle Meditation and you will get the whole picture.

-Bastila is interesting for a writer becouse of her complicated nature and emotional problems. She isn't just another slashing-everything goon like Maul. This girl has a real psychological portrait. Talented writer could make a similar

novel to Stover's Shatterpoint where we can see Windu's twisted personality. Bastila fits perfectly for such a novel.

- these two reasons are enough to make Bastila a main hero of KOTOR novelization. Revan only collides with her and so he should be killed quickly.

 

Revan has too many faces - as many as there're players in the world. Choose one official face and everyone will feel offended...

 

Love her or hate her, objectively, Bastila fits perfectly for a main hero of a KOTOR novelization.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think someone is a tad too obsessed with the Bastila character and places her on a pedistol (sp?) she doesn't deserve to be on.

[Darth Sirius]

I think that in case of a book Revan should be really killed on his flagship, simply becouse of lack of a real face of that character. Revan is just an avatar created for players to enable them diving into storyline. What annoyed me in KOTOR was lack of determination who should be most important. When the game begins Bastila is presented as nearly a anakinskywalker-like Choosen One who can save the galaxy. Later she falls in a very unconvincing way, and Revan (player) becomes the real power.  They should make Bastila PC - like Kyle Katarn at start, or they shouldn't create her at all.

 

But in case of a novel Revan will be hard to define. That's why he should be eliminated and his story in game series treated as infinity. In the novel Bastila should be a main hero and there are several reasons:

 

- other NPCs are of second importance and any of them no matter how fun and well-developed cannot be presented as main hero -simply becouse they aren't powerful enough.

- Bastila is the most powerful force-user in the galaxy of that time, only Revan, Malak and Bandon are of comparable strength (and she's the youngest, most unexperienced of them all- Revan and Malak in their 30s can beat her only becouse of their matured experience) add her unique Battle Meditation and you will get the whole picture.

-Bastila is interesting for a writer becouse of her complicated nature and emotional problems. She isn't just another slashing-everything goon like Maul. This girl has a real psychological portrait. Talented writer could make a similar

novel to Stover's Shatterpoint where we can see Windu's twisted personality. Bastila fits perfectly for such a novel.

- these two reasons are enough to make Bastila a main hero of KOTOR novelization. Revan only collides with her and so he should be killed quickly.

 

Revan has too many faces - as many as there're players in the world. Choose one official face and everyone will feel offended...

 

Love her or hate her, objectively, Bastila fits perfectly for a main hero of a KOTOR novelization.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think someone is a tad too obsessed with the Bastila character and places her on a pedistol (sp?) she doesn't deserve to be on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

:D :D yeah like every post is praising bastilla! granted i thought she was ok, nice voice, nice face (for a game) but god you can take things to far

[LORD GRAVEN]

what if they did the movie of kotor as a 3 part series for kotor 1, kotor 2, and a kotor 3 hopefully?. that way you could possibly have the option of a male revan, a female hero for the 2nd, and in the third perhaps a conclusion.

 

"but what do i know i cant even see straight"

[starwarskid15_19]

bastilla was not that powerful sure she could use battle meditation but thats about it. and revan im sorry to say my revan was not in his thirties he was in his mid 20s. he was also much stronger in the force than bastilla. he was the greatest jedi/sith of that time period. well maybe except for the new pc who knows. but compared to revan bastilla is as powerful as a tach (im exagerating a little here) in the force. (i actually did like bastilla in the game she was one of my favorite characters)

 

edit: obviously jolee is the third most powerful jedi in this time period after revan, the new pc and then him then its bastilla then zhar then vandar then vrook etc. etc.

[Nur Ab Sal]

Words, words, words.... what evidence do you have that Revan is sooo powerful?

In mid 20s he was in the beginning of Mandalorian War- this is logical becouse usually padawan becomes a knight after 20. When KOTOR begins Revan is for sure about 30 (not to say that Republic would never gave all its forces to some 20 years old youngster - its obvious that Revan had to be much older when went to mandalorian war). I said earlier that comparing Bastila to Revan is like comparing Jacen to Luke. Everyone knows that Jedi grows stronger in the Force after 20 years old and how old is Bastila? Between 16 - 19 years. Even superpowerful Anakin Skywalker lost easily with Count Dooku and his true powers were revealed during Clone Wars when he matured beyond his 20. Bastila we see is similar to Anakin - great potential but still before her greatest period.

 

Besides how many times do I have to say that this "Revan" is just an avatar and a puppet of ours? Revan is no one to me. Devs said to you that Revan is "greatest single warrior" and you believed them? Anakin would kill him in split-second.

 

I wonder what idiot invented this whole Revan idea with boring mind flashbacks etc. Bastila should be a main playable character from the beginning, like Kyle Katarn in Jedi Knight Series, geez I should give a punch-prize to this guy!

[starwarskid15_19]

u see i said 20s to make it not so gross when comparing the bastilla revan love life. and bastilla is not 16 i always thought around 21-22 for her

[Nur Ab Sal]

But 14 year old Mission said: "You aren't much older fromme you prissy little..." or something in that style. Anyway Bastila isn't much older from Mission so I guess that she's 16-19.

[DesertHawk]

Mission is 13-14 (I've heard both.). "much older" suggests Bastila being at most 17 or 18. (I'd say she's 16, but. . .) Then again, Bastila's mature female voice puts us off. She can't be 14, or even 15. The perfect age setting for her would be 17, I'd say.

 

For a second, compare NOLF and KOTOR. A ton of male players (the main force behind gaming) won't buy NOLF because there's a female protagonist. Women are a bit put off by having to play men, but not nearly as much as men are of playing women. Why? Men view women as being weak. Period. So if it was really Bast's story instead of Revan's, not nearly as many people would have bought it and enjoyed it.

 

Revan's main skill is that s/he's a brilliant tactician. S/he's also strong in the force, coming close to (but not hitting) Anakin. In other words, s/he is smarter than him when it comes to troop movements. Oh, and Anakin may be more powerful, but you're only as strong as how much you use your power.

 

If, of course, you understood any of that, you win a cookie.

[Nur Ab Sal]

Hmm I must be a pervert, cause I don't view women as weak! And serious: I

want Bastila becouse she's interesting character just like Katarn is interesting.

Playing genderless, faceless and raceless Revan (who's just a substance to me)

is boring. I want a concrete figure - like Bastila is, with all her stubborness and

problems and whining, I want that all! Not some phantom who has story of "Former Darklord". Revan bores me. Katarn and Bastila don't.

 

Almost agree with everything you said except three things:

 

- Anakin was a Fleet Commander and thanks to his tactic skills many battles were won. I wouldn't underestimate his wits. Besides Revan is presented as genius but that doesn't sound convincing (as unconvincing as Bastila's defection to the dark side) and we have to believe devs' word. Well Thrawn is for certain genius but

not Revan. From what Canderous said his tricks were rather typical and nothing special compared to the tactics we have in x-wing series or NJO.

 

-Anakin, Luke, Obi-Wan, Mace Windu are special characters from best movies in history of a man, and don't dare to compare with them some pathetic third-rate game character! When I see some idiots who think that Revan would beat Luke I'm getting bloodthirsty.

 

- Only Exar Kun can be compared to Anakin's potential. Anakin was created by pure Force and really you won't convince me that Revan or anyone can be

equal to Anakin, The Choosen One. Anakin's power was so giant that he exterminated all jedi in galaxy.If you don't understand how powerful Anakin is than you don't undesrtand anything.Revan is a third-quality concept and I don't see anything in him. That looser get one shot from turbolaser in his bridge and

turned off (if Bastila didn borrow him her life-force he would be dead) while Anakin

fell into the molten lava and survived without any help- hah he was able to become the most feared sith lord after that and kill all jedi. Revan is a **** I say and Anakin would poop him on!

[Sarjahurmaaja.]

"Men view women as being weak."

 

We do? I must've missed the memo again...

 

edit: In any case, Revan was the main character. Yes, he is also your avatar. So what?

 

"Anakin, Luke, Obi-Wan, Mace Windu are special characters from best movies in history of a man, and don't dare to compare with them some pathetic third-rate game character! When I see some idiots who thinks that Revan would beat Luke I getting bloodthirsty"

 

You're a silly man.

[Zane0]

I think that a female lead (protagonist/antagonist) in a KOTOR game would be a pleasant change. However, I don't think it would be a very good idea for KOTOR 2 in particular, since female Revan's relationship with the supporting characters are a good deal weaker then those as a male. In my opinion, male Revan would have a more interesting continuation story then female Revan. This is biased of course by being male myself.

[Eddo36]

I think that a female lead (protagonist/antagonist) in a KOTOR game would be a pleasant change.  However, I don't think it would be a very good idea for KOTOR 2 in particular, since female Revan's relationship with the supporting characters are a good deal weaker then those as a male.  In my opinion, male Revan would have a more interesting continuation story then female Revan.  This is biased of course by being male myself.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Amen to that. I can't speak for a girl, but who the hell would wanna pick a romance with a whiny paranoid idiot like Carth?

[Darth Sirius]

Mission is 13-14 (I've heard both.). "much older" suggests Bastila being at most 17 or 18. (I'd say she's 16, but. . .) Then again, Bastila's mature female voice puts us off. She can't be 14, or even 15. The perfect age setting for her would be 17, I'd say.

 

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From what Ive heard Mission is 14 yo, and Bastilla is nearer 25 yo, and I have heard that a couple of times, dont ask me to link, because I cant remember, I just assumed anyway, of course I may be wrong, but it seems very likely

[GhostofAnakin]

Mission looked a lot older than 14, although I suppose I have no idea what a 14 year old Twi'lek should look like. I always thought of Mission as between 15 and 17 and Bastila in her late teens to very early 20's (18-22).

[Atomic Space Vixen]

Amen to that. I can't speak for a girl, but who the hell would wanna pick a romance with a whiny paranoid idiot like Carth?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh, how to explain the appeal of a strong man who's hurting...

[Nur Ab Sal]

Personally I like Carth and his image of tormented and sensitive, yet strong

male. At last something different that batman or terminator nightmare.

[Eddo36]

Kitch wrote:

What I want is for Revan to not be actually seen or heard from directly, but still have some kind of bearing on the story. I suppose it would be all right if my character meets him, and his head was the one I wanted, but then there's still the "what kind of voice will he have" or "what will he be wearing" issues. It wouldn't bother me a great deal, I would just prefer that my character not actually come across Revan.

 

Well, Revan does have a voice in KOTOR. Whenever you switch between party members to him, he says "Yeah?" and "What now?". And when you put him in cloak mode, he says "I'll do my best to avoid." He probably says other things as well, but I didn't explore a whole lot.

 

Also, for those who never played KOTOR, no big deal, they can close their eyes and pick the best-looking option? Or an option that have it all done random?

 

As for the what will he be wearing issue, it's pretty obvoius. Light side he gets Jedi robes or Star Forge robes. Dark side the Darth Revan robes and a red lightsaber.

[Soleyu]

Well to tell the truth I really wouldnt see too much harm in making an official Revan Story, I mean there have been a lot different characters that have been already established which got different personalities and stories depending on the author (Fanfics, some games and whatnot). Although I would think that it would end up beign LS, male Revan. First and foremost, how on all heavens would the Republic fight against Revan if they lost a good chunk of their fleet in the star forge battle? and besides revan beign the genious that he is wouldnt have killed Bastila in order to use her battle meditation. So it would have ended up beign a LS Revan, he would be male, because quite simply I got the feeling that the story was more directed for a male character and besides, most people I have seen describe Revan as a male, yes even women, of course not all, Atomic Space Vixen, can attest to that :D

 

Nur Ab Sal, my best guess is that you like to defined personalities in game, right? It seems to me that you see the whole avatar thing the wrong way. The reason for Revan not beign defined is that you can have freedom of choice to do with the character what you want, if Revan was defined your choices in how you play the game would have been limited. Besides not having a defined personality for your char, enables you to enter the game and play as yourself, immersing you in the gameworld(at least thats the idea), which would create an emotional attachment to the npcs as you see them through your eyes and how they react to your behaviour (which the game accomplished wih you quite well I see) and making the same attachment to your game persona, as it would be YOU who is revan. I would suggest you that you play KOTOR from that frame of mind, it will be more rewarding as you can give Revan any personality you like (from an ultra badass who has a kind heart towards slaves, or a kind man who thinks all people should be helped but snaps when is pressured) which you can certanly do in Kotor.

 

About the whole anakin/vader/sidious vs Revan vs Exar Kun vs whatever, you cant really compare them, they are all portrayed quite different and the same goes to the extent of their powers, I mean, just what the hell can vader do against Naga Sadow, who blew up TWO FRICKING STARS with just his force power. Anakin my have the highest midi chlorian count ever recorded he could have been born from the Force (which I dont buy, i think his mother just got too drunk to remeber who exactly made her pregnant, oh those Tatooine parties can be wild :D ) but can