A Camera Plea

[Aranek]

I have played the game for a while now because i've got it yesterday from my pre-order.

 

At first i was not enthusiastic about the camera in single player mode, but still i managed (somehow) to get used to it.. (wasn't easy).

 

But when i started playing the multiplayer mode.. i was shocked.. Share screen mode?.. Between 4 players?... With such little maximum zoom out available?

 

I like the game. The combat system, dialouge system, char dev, deeds.. The game is not for everyone (since so many flamers around) but there are people who will like it definately.

 

But.. it is really sad to see that a CAMERA system.. Which is make it nice to see the things the game has to offer was treated with negligence?

 

Therefore i would like to (in my name, and probably the silent majority) request to do something with this camera..

 

I have two basic suggestions, which i realize might not be easy as pie to implement, but they are definately not a huge trouble either.

 

1) Allow the camera in multiplayer to be set into a "singleplayer" mode, meaning that players can actually see what they see, and not what does the "centre" of them see.. This is very hard tot manage in especially 3+ player games and when playing a "ranged" character.. You simply do not see what you shoot at. So when playing as Katarina, i could not use the rifle at all... not effectively.. Even though it it supposed to have "big range", you dont see anything beside your own nose.

 

2) Allow the camera to be moved further from the character.. This would alow further use of ranged abilities and actually seeing whats behind the character without moving the camera like a roundabout all the time. Its quite messy later on, with many mobs around especially as a melee character (for a change) who is in the middle of the combat and needs to see all 4 sides of it, not just ahead (like a ranged one)..

 

I believe that those 2 would make it significantly easier to enjoy the game fully and appreciate the potential it has to offer.

 

If anyone agrees, please post. Because i do not want this issue to be neglected just because it was not visible. Let us show that we care, and that we would appreciate it.

[C2B]

2) Allow the camera to be moved further from the character.. This would alow further use of ranged abilities and actually seeing whats behind the character without moving the camera like a roundabout all the time. Its quite messy later on, with many mobs around especially as a melee character (for a change) who is in the middle of the combat and needs to see all 4 sides of it, not just ahead (like a ranged one)..

 

THIS

 

There are multiple ways that I wish you could zoom the camera out further into a true top down perspective.

[crimsonking19]

After playing the PC demo I was both quite impressed and very frustrated. I finished the exceptionally long demo but I must admit, the entire time playing, I really wanted to come here and post my ONLY complaint. Seeing this topic already being addressed made me feel a little bit better, so I just have to get this out of my system...

 

Please, please at LEAST lower the camera angle so that we can see into the distance. While playing the demo, I was constantly trying to see what was in the next room or down the ominous dark corridor before I walked into certain death. I would even catch myself moving my head as if it would help look beyond the screen lol

 

This game is very aesthetically pleasing and I just thought it was a shame not being able to look around, especially UP

 

The WASD movement works fine except it is very linear and I feel like a robot walking around, only compounded by the lack of camera movement. It's just very claustrophobic.

 

 

So, in hopes that the retail version will be a little more "user friendly", I beg of you, let us SEE your game, and not just one screen at a time.

 

My thanks!

[m4G1c]

every player should have it

[AnjyBelle]

2) Allow the camera to be moved further from the character.. This would alow further use of ranged abilities and actually seeing whats behind the character without moving the camera like a roundabout all the time. Its quite messy later on, with many mobs around especially as a melee character (for a change) who is in the middle of the combat and needs to see all 4 sides of it, not just ahead (like a ranged one)..

 

I believe that those 2 would make it significantly easier to enjoy the game fully and appreciate the potential it has to offer.

 

This!

[Ydrian]

TLDR:

You realy need to change the multiplayer camera options (at least for pc) because it absolutly annihilates the fun!

 

I'm afraid i will need a rather lenghtly wall of text to do this, because i realy want you to understand what im talking about.

So lets begin:

 

I just got to know DS3 is comming out like a month before release. I was kind of hyped immediately. I loved DS1 and 2 back in the day and played these games for hundreds of hours with my friends. But that was like 5 years ago and i was still a gaming newbe. I enjoyed the simple gameplay, but thats nothing i want to play ever again :D.

 

To see the game change to an action rpg even got me even more hyped because it looked like you'll finaly need some skill to play the game.

 

I began waiting for the demo to arrive and immediatly downloaded it and played it for 8(!) hours. I even grinded my way (by running in and out of town to get respawn) to lvl 10 because gameplay was just awesome. I didnt realy mind the fact that the controls were designed for a console. I cannot understand all the hate you got because i got used to it in like 30minutes and it was fun afterwards.

 

Same thing for graphics. I'm not much of a graphics-person. I like the graphics, i like the style and i definately love the spell animations (clockwork trap anyone? :D)

 

So i decided to get the game as soon as possible.

 

I didnt pre order since i had holidays anyway. i got up at 9 am to get it in a store, because i like having physical copies of games.

 

First disillusionment followed. I wasnt able to install it in the next 9 hours, because the game wasnt unlocked by steam. But i dont think thats to blame on someone at Obsidian and either way i didnt feel to frustrated yet.

 

Finishing the install i tested katrina and reinhart - both awesome too. But i like to play melee in just about every game so i decided to go with lucas.

 

As soon as my buddys got home from work we started to play co op. (Another issue here but it was easily solved by starting a single player game and invite our buddys by using steam.)

 

From the first second on the camera freaked me out, but i thought it would get better once you get used to it ... it didnt. I saw people over at steam forums write they will try to get the game refunded because they cant play the multiplayer with this camera, or they didnt buy it in the first place, if they knew about the multiplayer camera. I would have bought it anyway, dont get me wrong. But i would have bought it in order to just play the singleplayer since i think its pretty awesome.

 

So the OP states he cant play a ranged class, because he doesnt even see the enemys he's shooting at. Well my three buddys play ranged and i can promise you its even worse that way around. Playing Lucas i need to close in to deal any damage. I got my tools to do that. Since i dont know how the skills are called in english i will refer to them as "charge". I hope everyone should be knowing what i mean.

So we engange a group of enemys and immediately my buddys stop running and start shooting. Charge try 1: Works, deals damage, teleports me back to group, because i am not allowed to get away. Charge try 2: Doesnt work because i hit an obstalce i didnt see because the camera is so weird. Out of energy now. Want to run to the half-dead enemys now. i reach the meleeing enemys and get nuked by like 3 or 4 ranged enemys i didnt even see!!! (On normal and hardcore)

 

Thats like standard. It happend on every greater pull. Sometimes its even worse. I can see the enemy, but the camera doesnt even let me get there. Im stuck like one yard out of range for my sword.

 

So you just cant fight things playing Lucas in a ranged group. You might think its ok because you can at least "play" a little bit. But its just the tip of the iceberg.

 

Since you get no melee hits in, you dont get new energy. Without energy you cannot charge. without charge you can get even less melee hits in - and so on.

 

This still isnt all:

 

Either im the most unlucky person in the world, or the loot system is kinda "participation" based which plays out like: The more damage you deal, the more and the better equip you get. We played for like two hours yesterday and after exactly (i watched the watch!) 72 minutes i got a new two handed sword. We were like level 4 or 5 and i still had the first two handed sword in hands (yes, the one with no stats and 2 damage). And the sword i got at 72 minutes was bought from a shop. Not one loot drop. Our Katrina at this point had like her third blue(!) weapon with 3 slots blue armor and rest greens. I had 1 green item and it was bought. So when we stopped playing for this evening (we were like lvl 6 or 7). I had 300 hp with my ranged buddys having like 500. The had more armor, they did more damage. But i was the only one needing to close in on enemys. So i died even more often, dealt even less damage, got even worse equip.

 

Its the perfect doom loop. Because of the camera, i cannot play lucas to his full potential. because i cannot do that i deal less damage and die more often, because of this i get worse loot, because of this i dont have as much armor and hp as my ranged buddys - and deal even less damage, because of this my loot gets even worse and so on.

 

If i were to rate this game i would say:

Singleplayer 9/10

Multiplayer 0/10

 

And i realy dont want to give a 0, but i just cant do anything. Best thing i could do was push "c" and let the ai handle it. And i have no problem at all playing hardcore in singleplayer! And as time progresses it gets even worse. Few hours later in the game i will be a oneshot for each and every enemy. There is no redeeming factor whatsoever.

 

And all this started out by not having separate camera screens in multiplayer.

 

But i need you to know im not writing this because i want to offend you. Im writing this because i like the single player so much and i want to have this fun in multiplayer too. This could be the best multiplayergame i played in a long time, if the only thing you change is camera.

 

I like the controls

i like the graphics

i like the story

i like the characters

i like the singleplayer

i like the stat system.

 

But the one little beast named "camera" annihilates the multiplayer. It started off kind of annoying and ended in the doom loop i tried to describe above.

 

I like the thought of having purchased the game so you can take my money, and just put seperate cameras in multiplayer and i be a happy panda!

 

With my final words i would like to beg you, please. PLEASE. From the bottom of my heart:

Just seperate the cameras!

 

I promise to even send you a goddie bag all the way from germany. (You know we got good cake and beer, right?)

 

I'd like to thank everyone for fighting through this wall of text. Since english is not my first language maybe my translations are not correct some times so please feel free to tell me if something isnt understandable.

 

Sincerely

Steffen Eisenacher

[AnjyBelle]

Provided that a a game allows mods, the first mods are mostly camera-tweaks - and this since modding started.

 

Interesting enough: One of the patches of NWN 1 included a camera tweak, too, after the community-made camera-mod has become very popular.

 

I really don't know anything about programming and stuff, but in my amateur's view it's like this:

If a modder can make a *good* camera, then it can't be too hard for a professional game developer to do it as well.

 

Question: Why do they bother us with unacceptable cameras again and again?

[Dean0815]

Either im the most unlucky person in the world, or the loot system is kinda "participation" based which plays out like: The more damage you deal, the more and the better equip you get. We played for like two hours yesterday and after exactly (i watched the watch!) 72 minutes i got a new two handed sword. We were like level 4 or 5 and i still had the first two handed sword in hands (yes, the one with no stats and 2 damage). And the sword i got at 72 minutes was bought from a shop. Not one loot drop. Our Katrina at this point had like her third blue(!) weapon with 3 slots blue armor and rest greens. I had 1 green item and it was bought. So when we stopped playing for this evening (we were like lvl 6 or 7). I had 300 hp with my ranged buddys having like 500. The had more armor, they did more damage. But i was the only one needing to close in on enemys. So i died even more often, dealt even less damage, got even worse equip.

 

I speculate what might help. This are just ideas, or things that worked in other games, where I had the same unfair drops for certain characters. Maybe you can just test it:

- Maybe there is more good loot for the character who opend the server? (Did the guy that played Katrina hosted the game?)

- Maybe the drop chances are randomly generated at server startup, so reopening the server creates an other item "seed"?

 

PS: I also hate the multiplayer camera, but I alredy said that in 2 other posts

 

best regards,

Dean0815