U.S. Universal Healthcare

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

1.how many freeloaders are there?

2.so what if there is a minority of freeloaders; does that mean one shouldn't help the ones who are just too stupid, mentally or physically challenged, weak, poor, sick etc etc.

 

let me put it this way:

do you acknowledge the fact that people are different due to both nature and nurture? if so, you also acknowledge the fact that some people will never be successful. because people are different, it isn't their fault. they were just born that way. the left takes this into consideration and provides help through tax income from everyone else. it's not like everyone is supposed to be equal(socialism), but to balance out the differences somewhat through government funded programs such as public schools and universal health care.

 

the right wing has one of two problems. either they accept the fact that people are different, but just don't care or their entire political view is based on flawed logic(i.e. everyone have the same opportunities to 'make it').

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Lots of them. Of course I'm speaking in general about the UK here rather than the US. Since it's where I live.

 

Should we help people who are too stupid for what reason ? If they spend their childhood and teens bunking off school can't say I have much sympathy for them I'm afraid.

 

I think the fact that we even have a welfare system allows people to see it as a soft option. Now I'm not saying we shouldnt have one. But it should not be "free" in all cases (certainly there are some people who are totally dependent on the system for survival) many of those people could contribute to the society rather than just collecting an unemployment cheque every week.

 

If you don't actually use public services, then your basically being used by the government to subsidise their spending. It's kind of like how I still have to pay a TV lisence even though I only watch cable (It annoys me greatly).

 

Yep I agree with the nature nurture thing. But it still shouldnt stop people trying. Like I said the fact you have an easy out removes a lot of motivation.

 

Oh I'd say it's likely the former. Although there is nothing inherent that stops people succeeding either. It's not like being born into royalty for example.

[random evil guy]

first of all, define freeloaders and then provide some source that proves there are many of them.

 

second; do you accept the fact that people are different? if so, you also accept the fact that some people will never make it. it doesn't matter if it's nature or nurture; it's still not their own fault. people don't decide when and where they're born. most people do try, but some will never make it. no matter what.

 

it all boils down to this, do you care about others? if so, the best way to help the 'less fortunate' is through taxes and government help. private charity have never worked. just look at contries like japan and taiwan. sure, they have had some economic growth, but the entire society is filled with hatred for the poor.

 

in countries with private chairity, the poor live only on the 'kindness' of the wealthy. they aren't considered members of society, only a burden. to me, as a humanitarian, that is an unacceptable attitude.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

first of all, define freeloaders and then provide some source that proves there are many of them.

 

second;  do you accept the fact that people are different? if so, you also accept the fact that some people will never make it. it doesn't matter if it's nature or nurture; it's still not their own fault. people don't decide when and where they're born. most people do try, but some will never make it. no matter what.

 

it all boils down to this, do you care about others? if so, the best way to help the 'less fortunate' is through taxes and government help. private charity have never worked. just look at contries like japan and taiwan. sure, they have had some economic growth, but the entire society is filled with hatred for the poor.

 

in countries with private chairity, the poor live only on the 'kindness' of the wealthy. they aren't considered members of society, only a burden. to me, as a humanitarian, that is an unacceptable attitude.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Freeloaders people who abuse the system simply because they can. As for sources, not really bothered enough to look them up. The government spend a lot of money looking into these sorts of things.

 

As I said some people fail simply because they don't try. No sympathy for them don't see why I should subsidise their laziness.

 

Do I care for others ? Family , friends of course. People in general, to a point. Although not to a point where I would happily surrender 50% of my income.

Most countries "hate" the poor as long as they are being honest. Although hate is a strong word, resentment of the poor and the fact that your paying to support them with high taxes isnt something that most people actually like. They may pay the taxes grudingly (not like they have a choice). I could tell you a really good story about tax evasion.

 

I wouldnt claim to be a humanitarian. I dont really value human life anymore than I do any other life. In fact I get constantly bothered by certain charities for donating large ammounts of money to the RSPCA rather to their what they perceive as more "worthy" causes. If I wasnt being polite my reply would end in off.

 

The very fact that I pay my taxes pretty much means I've done my bit. If the government are too incopetant to spend the money wisely thats not really my fault.

[Walsingham]

I'm glad to see an attempt to return to debating points. Keep it up, gentlemen.