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Have isometric rpgs lost its way? Is there hope PoE3 will have remedy for that?

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Guest 4ward

i believe enemy design is more important; in battle 1 character A will use remove fear, in battle 2 against enemy Y same character will use fireshield; your characters need to be doing different things from combat to combat. If it were up to me, i'd remove attacks of opportunity which would make enemies more interesting/smarter imo; i'd also go back to per-rest as those abilities have more impact than per-encounter.

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On 5/19/2020 at 8:14 AM, Boeroer said:

For example the Dark Eye v. 4 and 5 are quasi-classless. You have professions like Fighter, Gladiator, Wizard of Academy X or Y and whatnot - but it's more of a background thing mostly. The Pillars TTRPG is classless, too. GURPS, Traveller... They are designed so that you can build the idea you have in your head while providing a balanced ruleset. 



I think this hones in on the trade-off between class and classless systems. One is about freeing your imagination and the other is about sparking it. Which is better? Well it depends on if you are the sort of person whose head is full of character concepts or not. Personally, I prefer class systems, because classes tell me something about the world. Take the PoE Monk for example, its more than just a collection of mechanics, its gathered into a narrative type. It tells me something about how a monk character exists in the world. I think some of the complaints about classes feeling samey are not actually about mechanics, but about the narrative of the calls, like when people complain about muscle wizards, or genius barbs. 

Sorry, ignore the repeat. This is my first time posting and I messed up the quote, then didn't know how to delete. 

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On 5/19/2020 at 3:27 PM, xzar_monty said:

My understanding is that the PoE system was designed as a deliberate step away from the DD model, which it clearly is. I think it works, although your criticism is justified and to an extent I agree with it. However, I also think that criticism of similar severity can be aimed at the DD system, which has its own flaws. In the end I'm happy with both.

I agree.

Both systems can be fun and both can also produce lots of problems.

I think PoE 1+2 has the advantage that it is relatively easy to get into the game and understand the basics for new players. It gets complicated if you look deeper, but if you play it with a full party on normal it is enough to select stuff that seems to make sense.

On the other end are the pathfinder games PM and WotR. Some forum members say they are the new god and everything less is dumbed down, no matter if it is DnD 5E, PoE or something else. Sure, PK was a great game and I believe WotR will be great too, but the system is so very complicated that its very hard for new players to understand it. I play computer RPGs since the mid 90s and even I have problems there. For every buff you have to remember what type it is because only different types stack. There are some combination of feats and abilities that make you god while other stuff does not work even if your commen sense says it should. There are many powerful builds, but it is also very easy to make a completely useless character. The game knows endless ways to show the player the middle finger. You got a good armor and shield, well the next enemy surely uses touch attacks. Later in the game come tons of enemies that can paralyze your whole party every round just by looking at you. I hope you have learned freedom of movement. Sure, the game gives you the tools to deal with such situations, but some things are very hard to find out if you are not a complete nerd.

BTW: In DnD you can make a wizard that swings a greatsword well, just like you can do other things that are possible in PoE or classless systems. Its a bit more complicated than just giving him a weapon, an armor and some spells, but almost everything is more complicated there anyway.


regarding factions: I do not like that in PoE2 many companions are related to a faction and they will leave you if you side with another one. Its bad when you have your usual party through most of the game and suddenly half of them leave you.

But the idea of having several opposing factions to join, support or fight is not bad.

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