BUG - You havent added the extra +1 pen to alot of the unique two handers after the patch

[Teclis23]

So alot of the unique two handed weapons dont have the extra +1 pen that you introduced after all two handers get buffed

 

Just to name a few

 

Oathbreakers End 

Effort

 

Im sure there are alot more that dont have it applied to yer aswell

 

Both have 7 base pen. For late game weapons this is not enough

 

This is a very big bug as alot of the two handed weapons in the game are useless

 

[Teclis23]

Bump

[pi2repsion]

@Teclis23, your title is wrong. I refer you to my post in the last thread you made on this issue, where I listed the base penetration values for the different weapon types.

 

1H melee goes from 6-9, 2H from 7-10. Your idea that there are a lot of 2H melee weapons out there that didn't get +1 penetration fails to acknowledge that the penetration boost was applied directly to the base weapon type, not to individual weapons, and thus apply to all weapons of 2H melee weapon type.

 

THUS,

 

Effort is a great sword. ALL great swords have 7 base penetration. They had 6 penetration prior to the 1.2 patch like normal swords. They got +1 and now have 7. So this is not a bug.

 

Oathbreaker's End is a one handed weapon type, a battle axe, and thus has 7 base penetration. It is a truly great weapon, that has only one downside: It has the special property that it requires two hands to use. While I understand you might like to see it have higher penetration, whether it should have it all depends on what the design intent was: if the intent was to use the two-hander property to avoid having to create a new weapon type (two handed axe) with only one weapon in it, it probably deserves 8 penetration, whereas if the intent was specifically to have a battle axe that as a downside requires two hands to use, it probably does not.  So it may either be an oversight to be fixed or working as intended depending on circumstances.

 

 

More generally, regarding having 7 penetration, endgame, and your ideas of usefulness. Penetration 7 is not only the most common base penetration amongst weapon types (dagger, battle axe, club, flail, hatchet, rapier, sabre, spear, great sword,  pistol, and wand all have it), a lot of builds in the class build subforum use weapons with base 7 penetration all through the endgame, showing that even obsessive min-maxers find them very useful - or at least, find the best of those weapons very useful. Including a few great sword builds (though some are obsolete builds from 1.0, where the great sword only had 6 base penetration and thus was worse).

 

What I'm trying to say here, is that if your party can't hack it in the endgame using weapons with 7 base penetration or you find that base 7 penetration great swords are useless in the endgame, then it is not because the great swords are defective, bugged, or useless: it is because you are using them in a group that - for whatever reason, be it composition, ability choices, or whatnot - doesn't use them effectively.  A superb great sword already puts you at 10 penetration, and there are penetration buffs and armour debuffs in the game. Consider using them.

Edited August 16, 2018 by pi2repsion

[Boeroer]

@Teclis23: your post is not correct.

 

All unique two handers have the same base PEN as the non-unique ones. And those got raised by 1 point in a prior patch.

 

The only thing we can discuss is Oathbreaker's End because it has the same PEN as one-handed Battle Axes. Two Handers got +1 PEN to balance out their disadvantages when compared to dual wieldig or one handed usage or shield setups - so we could say that a Two Handed Axe should have +1 PEN as well - but the rest (Effort and all) doesn't lack PEN.

 

And you should know because we explained that to you in another thread you started before this one.

Edited August 15, 2018 by Boeroer

[thundercleese]

@Teclis23: your post is not correct.

 

All unique two handers have the same base PEN as the non-unique ones. And those got raised by 1 point in a prior patch.

 

The only thing we can discuss is Oathbreaker's End because it has the same PEN as one-handed Battle Axes. Two Handers got +1 PEN to balance out their disadvantages when compared to dual wieldig or one handed usage or shield setups - so we could say that a Two Handed Axe should have +1 PEN as well - but the rest (Effort and all) doesn't lack PEN.

 

And you should know because we explained that to you in another thread you started before this one.

This has been pointed out in several threads of similar topics, all started by Teclis23.

 

@Teclis23 your insistence that two-handed weapons are useless is contrary to what many experienced players can attest to. There are multiple builds in the Build Thread that successfully utilise two-handed weapons through entire playthroughs on PotD. If you would like advice on how to make the most of two-handed weapons, all you have to do is ask.

[Teclis23]

@Teclis23: your post is not correct.

 

All unique two handers have the same base PEN as the non-unique ones. And those got raised by 1 point in a prior patch.

 

The only thing we can discuss is Oathbreaker's End because it has the same PEN as one-handed Battle Axes. Two Handers got +1 PEN to balance out their disadvantages when compared to dual wieldig or one handed usage or shield setups - so we could say that a Two Handed Axe should have +1 PEN as well - but the rest (Effort and all) doesn't lack PEN.

 

And you should know because we explained that to you in another thread you started before this one.

The 2 handed sword effort has the same problem

[thundercleese]

All geatswords are supposed to have a base penetration of 7 as of patch 1.2. If Effort still has 6 then yes, that is a bug.

[pi2repsion]

 

@Teclis23: your post is not correct.

 

All unique two handers have the same base PEN as the non-unique ones. And those got raised by 1 point in a prior patch.

 

The only thing we can discuss is Oathbreaker's End because it has the same PEN as one-handed Battle Axes. Two Handers got +1 PEN to balance out their disadvantages when compared to dual wieldig or one handed usage or shield setups - so we could say that a Two Handed Axe should have +1 PEN as well - but the rest (Effort and all) doesn't lack PEN.

 

And you should know because we explained that to you in another thread you started before this one.

The 2 handed sword effort has the same problem

 

I spawned Effort via console in 1.2 to test, just now; Exactly as expected, it has 7 base penetration from its weapon type and gains an extra +2 in its default state from being exceptional.

 

If you have a current save game where Effort does not have 7 base penetration, I think it is time for you to put up or shut up provide a save game illustrating the problem.

 

 

EDIT: Wait a moment, in your original post you already wrote that Effort had 7 base penetration. WHICH IS THE RIGHT AMOUNT FOR IT TO HAVE. As you've been told repeatedly. So now I just wasted time testing because you claimed Effort had the same problem as Oathbreaker's End when being told it was fine... when you already knew it had 7 base penetration. Thanks for nothing; My bad for taking you seriously, I guess.

 

Do you have any point at all for two-handed weapon types outside the special case of Oathbreaker's End that is a one-handed weapon type that requires two hands and might/might not need to be looked at? Any at all? You keep claiming bugs and problems for the other two handed weapon types, but all I'm reading is "I want penetration to be higher on two-handers and it isn't"?

Edited August 16, 2018 by pi2repsion

[Teclis23]

A normal 1 handed sword has 7 pen. They said in there last patch notes when they buffed 2 handed weapons that they all got an extra +1 pen. I thought that a 2 handed sword would have atleast an extra +1 PEN more then the 1 handed version. 

 

So if they havent stuffed this up did a greatsword use to have 6 PEN before the buff? 

 

Look at Boerers post above; he has said 2 handers are supposed to have +1 PEN compared to there 1 hand versions  (if i got it wrong, maybe Boerer can chime in )  is that i never in a million years even thought that the greatsword would have had 6 PEN before the buff. 

 

So as it stands at 7 PEN, that is just not enough to compensate for either Dual weilding or using a shield. IT needs to be higher.

 

If the two handed sword has the same PEN as a 1 handed sword WTF would you even bother using the 2 handed sword for? If an enemie has even 2 or 3 AR more then your PEN you are Fcked

Edited August 16, 2018 by Teclis23

[thundercleese]

Sabres have 7 base PER - swords have 6.

[Teclis23]

ah sh&t (you sure about that?)

 

Sorry 

 

But that is still not enough PEN if you play POTD and want to weigh up the difference between swords and other weapons. And again i make my case that greatswords have to low PEN. 7 PEN is way to low for a 2 handed weapon

Edited August 16, 2018 by Teclis23

[thundercleese]

If you don't believe me you could, you know, look at the in game stats yourself.

 

That's more an issue with how they decided to implement PotD than with the weapons themselves. Besides, plenty of people have had success with two handed weapons in PotD. Also keep in mind swords/greatswords have dual damage types, whereas most weapons with higher PEN are single. This more or less balances out over the course of the game.

[pi2repsion]

A normal 1 handed sword has 7 pen. They said in there last patch notes when they buffed 2 handed weapons that they all got an extra +1 pen. I thought that a 2 handed sword would have atleast an extra +1 PEN more then the 1 handed version. 

 

So if they havent stuffed this up did a greatsword use to have 6 PEN before the buff? 

 

Look at Boerers post above; he has said 2 handers are supposed to have +1 PEN compared to there 1 hand versions  (if i got it wrong, maybe Boerer can chime in )  is that i never in a million years even thought that the greatsword would have had 6 PEN before the buff. 

 

So as it stands at 7 PEN, that is just not enough to compensate for either Dual weilding or using a shield. IT needs to be higher.

 

If the two handed sword has the same PEN as a 1 handed sword WTF would you even bother using the 2 handed sword for? If an enemie has even 2 or 3 AR more then your PEN you are Fcked

A sword has 6 penetration, not 7. Prior to 1.2 a great sword had 6 penetration just like the normal sword had (and still has), now it has 7.

 

Just like all the other 1H/2H variants of the same weapon type went from having the same penetration for 1H and 2H prior to 1.2 to the 2H variant having +1 penetration.

 

You may "never in a million years" have thought that great swords would have had 6 penetration before the buff and that as a consequence they got 7 with the buff, but I explicitly told you so in the very first post I made in this thread answering you. My statement, "ALL great swords have 7 base penetration. They had 6 penetration prior to the 1.2 patch like normal swords. They got +1 and now have 7. So this is not a bug." in that post really doesn't leave much room for misunderstanding.

 

Moreover, I listed the base penetration values in 1.2 of all the different weapon types in one of the several prior threads you started on this topic, allowing you to clearly see the +1 penetration differences, allowing you to notice that swords had 6 base penetration, etc. (Of course, you could also just see that by looking at a sword in the game, but I was trying to be helpful.)

 

And Boerer explicitly showed the 1H/2H weapon type matching for the +1 penetration in the same thread.

 

So you may not have thought it in a million years, but you certainly were told. Repeatedly. I'd say that by now there's conclusive evidence that you haven't been listening, since you keep starting new threads on the subject, substituting your old assumptions for the data you are provided by people who attempt to answer your questions in previous threads.

 

-----

 

Again, if you for whatever reason can't hack if with base 7 penetration weapons on POTD and disdain great swords for that reason, only being able to succeed with base 8+ penetration weapons... That's fine. We don't all have the same playing styles. So simply don't use them and use weapons with higher base penetration instead that will work with whatever approach to group composition, equipment, and ability use that has put you in that position; the game allows you to approach problems in many different ways.

 

But don't for a minute believe that 7 base penetration is not enough for POTD with either 1H or 2H weapons. It is. As you've been repeatedly told by people using such weapons. And as you can also see in the POTD build lists in the build subforum.

 

But it may require another approach than whatever you are using.

 

EDIT: My apologies if this answer seems too harsh... I probably should have been more diplomatic in my presentation. It is just... this is the second thread of yours dealing with this subject I'm taking part in, and it gets tiresome writing helpful answers based on the state of the game showing you where you've made errors or wrong assumptions, when you mostly ignore the answers and repeat those errors and assumptions.

Edited August 16, 2018 by pi2repsion

[kilay]

Totally agree with @pi2repsion, last chance could be mod them by yourself so you can play as you like.

[Teclis23]

ok no probs thanks for explaining