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Captain Shrek

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Posts posted by Captain Shrek

    Stop Right Now Thankyou Very Much

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

     

    Daily reminder: There is nothing wrong with kiting whatsoever. 

     

    I strongly disagree, because kiting is silly tactic that works only because AI programming is poor. Which of course don't mean that players should not use it in their tactics repertory if it works in the game, but if it works it is mostly because developers didn't do perfect job. 

     

     

    Well, you are wrong then. Kiting does not work because AI is bad. Kiting works because it is a good tactic. What AI fails at is to respond to it. In fact, I would ENCOURAGE kiting by adding special talents and skills (tumble). By default, Kiting should have penalties i.e. moving and hitting gives you a penalty to attack roll etc. ,

    Why the current loot system doesn't work

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

    I have always had a problem with looting in RPGs. But I must admit what follows is an opinion and not an objective fact.

     

    Looting has always been a mainstay of RPGs. Who doesn't like the drop of the Nameless light? But I have several problems:

     

    1) Drop of mundane objects of little value.

    2) +X weapons/armors

    3) Enemies with gold coins

     

     

    1) Mundane objects

     

    RPGs are simulations of heroic adventures and quests. Most battles are supposed to happen in hostile confines where there is constant threat and danger. In that scenario, it is not hard to explain why the PCs would not stoop to rob every corpse. Maybe time is a factor? Or there is a danger of letting down guard? etc. This makes much more game sense, as robbing everything that an enemy carries, can easily break or desensitize game economy. It would be actually much more sensible if weapons of practical use and armour were relatively rare like they are in the real world.  As  most RPGs ignore this (Except the Gothic games), they suffer from ridiculous design issues. 

     

    What is the solution? 

     

    Take the Gothic route. Make good weapons and armour something that can only be obtained with great effort. Enemies hardly ever drop anything other than monsters dropping crafting resources and that too if you have the relevant skills. This will NOT make the game uninteresting as some might imagine. If the combat is bad enough so that I have to be bribed every step of the way with loot, then the loot is not going to rescue the fun anyway. Especially terrible loot at that. 

     

    2)  +x weapons

     

    The laziest route of a designer in creating loot is the +x weapon. Seriously? I mean it takes effort to write the story and a contextual story for loot to be interesting. When you get a +1 sword it kills that the fundamental thrill of a magic item, making it a mundane object as this particular object has nothing tying it to the lore of the game other than shallow description "magical". Magic should always sound enchanting and resonate with the lore. PoE has 'soul' magic, so all the magical items should explain why they have a certain kind of power. Bonus points if no two magical items are the same. There should always be a story reason to avail these things and their placement should reflect that reason. 

     

    3) Gold drops

     

    In most RPGs I play, the gold drop is level scaled. As in, tougher enemies carry more gold. This ****ty idea needs to die for several reasons. Gold is NOT a good currency and hardly would a character with common sense carry that much stuff in his pockets (1000 GP, yeah, right). Now, it *would* make sense that the gold you pick up is the abstraction of things you robbed off corpses. but that can be dealt way better for example terminating every combat encounter with a small pop up telling you how much gold you earned from it. It would also make sense that the gold you earn is miniscule (for reasons mentioned earlier) thus preserving some sensible economy in the game. 

     

    Thus, to summarize:

     

    No trivial loot.

    Magical objects rare and meaningful.

    Less gold more story. 

    • Like 1

    Melee mage - viable?

    in Pillars of Eternity: Stories (Spoiler Warning!)

    Posted · Edited by Captain Shrek

    With the Wiz, the focus on aoe is crippling since its hard to use effectively and not obliterate your own party. Some aoe is ok but you cant have a class thats built around friendly fire skills. Its a bit unfair that the chanter/cipher get infinite spell casting AND many of their aoe spells ignore friendly targets. Seems to me that the wizards, who work with expendable resources and have limited utility, should be the ones with more aoes that ignore friendlies.

    The bigger problem is not  the friendly fire as much it is creating tactical situations where friendly fire can be avoided. The way the game works right now, we have a problem of not creating scenarios where the enemy can be huddled up in a group. The only time this happens is RIGHT at the start of the combat.

     

    Which sucks.

    Saving the Wizard Class

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

     

    I think people are:

     

    E.  Forgetting how much hard counters suck.  Wait, there are basiliks outside of Durlag's tower?  Looks like its a reload.  Hard counters make the fights either more luck based (you roll past the hard counter), or they take tactics out of the fight (what you do in the fight doesn't matter, only how you prepared for it and how you roll).

     

    F.  Forgetting how much hard saves suck.  Some people complain about being oneshotted by enemies in the Beta, but Abu-dhalzim's Horrid Wilting could one-shot parties who found themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time.  Congratulations, it's reload and run away or hope for a save.

     

    This. So much. I always HATED that mechanic in D&D, and I hated it more in BG. Instant-death-if-I'm-no-prescient, unless I'm lucky. How is that fun?! How is that "awesome"? It sucked. I made me nerd rage every time.

     

     

     

    I have a simpler solution. Give the player a hint in the story. For even better stroytelling, link it to a skill. Thus he does not have to metagame to know it. This is thus not a problem of hard counters, but rather bad design. 

    • Like 2

    Stop Right Now Thankyou Very Much

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted · Edited by Captain Shrek

     

    1. I have played the beta for many many dozens of hours. I gone far enough to not only play and discuss but to record and reflect. Seriously, I have looked at how I played PoE and reflected as I played through IWD:EE (one right after the other). If you want to ask me to explain where my judgements come from, fine. But please do not hazard a guess why you think I believe something and then state it as fact.

     

     

     

    I din't doubt that your feels come from actual gameplay. Unfortunately, they are from the BB which is a very short snippet of the game and it (hopefully) is not representative of the final build in terms of encounter design. I think you will agree with me that that this aspect is probably one of the most important parts of the game. So really, none of us can say what the final game will be like.

     

     

    2. Objectivity on subjective judgements? What? Everyone of us have played the IE games in their own way and has played this in their own way. There is no objective measure on anything here. Sawyer set out to do the early/mid levels in a way that improves on IE titles. MY experience suggests he has nailed it.

     

     

     

     
    So we agree.
     
    3. Did the IE games have a better skills implementation? Are you saying that stats in the IE games were implemented better than the current implementation? Really? These are all non-issues in the context of my statements. Also, attempting to hazard a guess regarding the current design goals of devs is pure conjecture.

     

     

     
     

    IE games had horrible stat implementation. 

     

    BUT. 

     

    One should bear in mind that the last IE game was 12 years back. Much has happened since then and many games that can be held as improvements over IE design have been made. 

     

    I mean OE themselves made a game called NWN2. Maybe you heard about it. This game is a step BACK from that. And please! No **** about how that was not an IE game. By that standard even this one is not. If we are talking about how to improve UPON IE games, then that discussion has to be holistic and meaningful. Restricting to one category is hardly a viable course of discussion.

     

    Not to mention, games like Darklands were also thrown around as sources of inspiration. As of now all of I have seen in that regard is the horrible endurance mechanic and starting screens. I wonder if the developers actually played Darklands or watched youtube videos of it. What made it so special, was the setting and the skill system. No one remembers it for the combat or the stamina. 

    Stop Right Now Thankyou Very Much

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

    And he did a darned good job too.

     

    Err what?

     

    Not that I think you are wrong or anything. It's just that this qualification is pretty much insubstantial. As in, there is no real way to compare D&D sets with the PoE sets. Right now, you are just basing your judgement on "feels". 

     

    If at all there be an objective criterion, then it would be not only NOT obvious at this stage (with a demo, not even a real beta) but also subject to fluctuations as the core mechanics of PoE has changed a lot since its inception. And I mean A LOT.

     

    There was regeneration. Now there is none.

    There were cooldowns, now it is per rest. 

    Spells were to become per encounter from per rest. At will from per encounter. Now, NOT. etc.

    Stats were constantly altered to the point even now it is not certain they are to perform as they do.

    Skills are completely in the limbo. 

     

     

    These are very crucial design differences. I would hazard that the game does not really have a fixed and clear design goal in terms of mechanics. 

    • Like 3

    Saving the Wizard Class

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

    Well, by unique if you mean different in ability names and usage then yeah. They don't feel very special. A lot of them are just ONE class from D&D split into many classes. I guess the only different one is the Cipher which is a psionic-like class. But he also feels more like a Wilder, really. 

    Stop Right Now Thankyou Very Much

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

    I also want to point out that the time for broad strokes is now gone. Effort should be spent on fixing what is sub-optimal in the game. I appreciate Sensuki's efforts and probably even agree with some of his arguments. But right now removing this mechanic will not really:

     

    1) Help the game, as it would mean fixing a lot of other things linked with it.

    2) Improve anything, because this is not an RTS! I have no clue why some people keep conflating these things. 

    • Like 1

    Stop Right Now Thankyou Very Much

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted · Edited by Captain Shrek

     

    I can't afford to be an optimist at this point in development with a few more months until shipping.  And as someone already said, I would rather hope they put their resources in making pencil drawn items 2D art instead of trying to salvage a flawed mechanic.

     

    Making combat feel static and not being able to adapt to new situations or making a tactical retreat without major penalties is not my idea of good design.

    Do you really expect programator drop his work and start doing 2D art? lmao

     

     

     

    No.

     

    He is asking for resources to be allocated so that things that *can* be honestly salvaged at this point, be salvaged.  

     

    Of course, if the developers find free time for the combat improvement then it should be spent there. But not otherwise. 

    • Like 2

    Why Don't Wizards Have Summoning Spells?

    in Pillars of Eternity: Stories (Spoiler Warning!)

    Posted

    ^Yes, variety is good.

     

    I still don't think weak->strong for one class while another does the opposite is good design.

    Giving each class something good and being variably useful in different situtions (and having a good balance of those situations) while still being able to offer something even when they're not at their most useful, is the ideal for me.  (Just don't ask me to design it :lol: )

     

     

    It's not that hard really. But it does reduce the combat to an appreciable degree. Which is NOT a bad thing at all if you think about it. We need better-designed challenging encounters and not trash mobs. 

    Raz's Perspective: A Dissertation on Engagement mechanics

    in Backer Beta Discussion

    Posted

    I am really surprised that people don't get tired of this.

     

    I mean really, think about it. In the IE games the toughest battles *were* set pieces where enemies had specific tactical advantages. Unfortunately these were limited to spellcasting. So the most interesting battles were against mages who would hide behind summons or guards and cast devastating spells from their vantage points. Would you not rather have more of these set pieces?

     

    I am also highly disturbed by the assertion that the 'tier 1'  as you call it is somehow essential in the critical path. Can you elaborate on that? or am I getting you wrong? 

     

    I have also objected in the past to the idea, that ALL builds need to succeed. Why? If you really screw up a particular class concept, i.e. give the fighters in PoE ranged weapons and send the chanter in melee, should that not be discouraged? Or is it necessary to still make it succeed?

     

    If you really want an unfettered class, why have a class at all? Class-less systems are so much fun! Just go for them! But this insistence that all skill levels should be able to finish the critical path is sure to be the biggest spanner in the works for getting a good encounter design. Such a criterion will practically ensure that the critical path encounters are basically NOT set pieces but rather just a bunch of enemies thrown together so that they can be defeated by anybody.  

     

    There are alternatives to this: During character creation itself the game can emphasize that certain classes need certain skills. And then still provide a variety by allowing alternative skills, all of which are good. 

    • Like 2
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