IndiraLightfoot

I hear you, still I sometimes get carried away for RP purposes. Fun should really trump harsh restrictions and any zealous claims to realism.

You're missing the point here. It doesn't matter whether it's by big or small numbers, spellcasters should not be tankier than melee classes. Period. But with new system they will be. You are assuming wrongly that all spellcasters have 18 resolve. Give 18 resolve to your melee character if you want them to have higher deflection. For melee classes there is no point in pumping Resolve other than deflection, so not many builds will want to sacrifice their recommended attributes for Resolve. That's why with this new system most melee classes (except fighter) will have inferior deflection than your average spellacaster. Spellcasters, on the other hand, don't have to sacrifice anything for Resolve as it's already gonna be their recommended attribute. Combine that with the fact that if you wanna stay pure spellcaster you don't need Strength as well, so you can spend more points on Constitution and make your average spellcaster an above average tank. Just below fighter in fact. If there is something, though, that I can predict Josh will do in the near future, even in the upcoming patch, is his tweaking deflection class distribution, and also how it will work with Resolve or even other attributes. It's a really easy thing to adjust and then finely tune.

It was prolly just my yearning for the next patch that got the better of me. I'll try to curb my enthusiasm a day or two.

disagree. the builds you describe as being "boned" is the builds which is responding to the changes as intended. stat choices should be painful. the intention were/is to make all stats useful to a build, so lowering a stat should have an obvious cost. so, good on being boned. Yeah, this is the core of the matter. I really like it when distributing stats is all about hard choices, down to single points up or down.

Yeah, what the title says. I have a very fast broadband, and then exit my Steam, so I had no time to tell what size it was. But I have seen no announcement about it. Anybody here who knows the contents of it? Cheers! EDIT: I checked my current beta version, upper right corner: 000 000 4, 1.0820.

That would be hilarious! Perhaps if you cast a tough spell with sucky Resolve, then you have to go through the new puke animation cycle as a recovery punishment. EDIT: How about increased reloading speed if you are stronger? And faster spell recovery if you have higher resolve?

Absolutely agree. Intellect would be a better fit for increased AoE, well Perception too, as a matter of fact.

Yeah, maybe it would be too old school? Still, it could be a minor way to stop the deepest stat dumps for stuff like STR and RES. "Nope, no battle axe for you if you pick STR 3."

A 10-bore flintlock rifle is a beast. You need to be reasonably strong to take that kickback, and loading it, you need to be reasonably strong too. A vid of an 18th century rifle, loading it, and finally shooting it. Watch from 4.30 mark or so, and watch the recoil. It shoves the big man back alright. https://www.full30.com/video/9bb3a82231bcda8cee6cf5180d1e78f4

Have a toddler fire a Magnum, and see what happens... (No, just no! This was simply a joke.) Strength certainly matters in that case too.

With Josh's very recent upcoming change, we now get Strength and a new Resolve, as most of you know by now. Besides all the game and combat mechanics, these two attributes may actually be used to limit the very use of certain weapons (twohanded sword or arbalest, for instance) or spells (If your resolve is too measly, you don't get to cast some of them). How do you feel about that? Is it too much RPG for you? Are there other attributes which could be used in this way: Intelligence? Dexterity? Discuss!

I would be extremely happy if that happened, I agree - infinite fun!

Heh, in so many ways, PoE1 starts to look like a test balloon, and now we finally get to see the real Pillars of Eternity, with all of Obsidian's creative might behind it. See what I did there?

Possibly, but it just feels jarring to me. It also bugs me from an import point of view: if I import a high Might Wizard from Pillars into Deadfire I have redistribute their attributes to achieve the same sort of character, and that puts me off importing at all. With so many big changes I don't think anyone will be able to make the same type of character from POE1. Importing is gonna be good only for story decisions. Yep, starting at level 1 at that, which I'm really looking forward to.

The way the math works out for a cipher, you can max Int (necessary), Per (necessary due to hit/miss changes), and then past that whatever points you add in one place, you have to take away from somewhere else -- if you want more Resolve, you have to drop Con, etc. Ciphers have to do weapon damage to gain focus. You can effectively shave . . . four or so at most . . points off Con IF you're willing to play ranged instead of frontline. So you can put those four points into one of either Might, Dex, or Resolve. Currently, the general build is to also cut resolve by about six to seven points, and put what you gain from cutting Res and Con into Might and Dex, because that helps casting speed and weapon and spell damage. Next patch, you'll basically have to choose between doing either weapon damage or spell damage .. . . except that isn't a choice because without weapon damage you'll never get the focus to do spell anything. On the other hand, if you don't pump resolve, your powers won't be effective no matter how much weapon focus you gather. I don't know how to build a cipher under the new system. Maybe just dump Dex and do everything like you're moving through molasses? Alternatively the answer might be to just drop all damage-based Cipher powers and play the class as a pure buffer/debuffer. Interesting, you say cipher, but you mean a specific hybrid build, no? Given that you use almost all attributes.

In some cases, sure (dumping a stat in itself is not a problem, I reckon, we all can agree on that), but it won't have a target on its back saying "DUMPSTAT" in capital letters for most interesting builds. In Josh's Words on Twitter: "it's more important that you *can* make a good build with a stat than it is that you can't dump it."

I snipped this post from another thread. I'll let Gromnir speak for himself: actually, this change makes such a character more difficult to build, if only in a limited way. for a healer, put points in might at the expense o' resolve were the smart move. as a matter o' fact, we had a deadfire contemplative build which were an absolute monster healer. a helwalker monk combined with a priest could achieve, at low levels, a might score exceeding 40. HUGE heals. HUGE spell damage. HUGE melee combat damage. now we gotta make hard choices and our recognition o' how the helwalker were an ironic obvious and counter-intuitive second class for an offensive caster is in the thunder mug. from a practical pov, the change makes sense. it addresses the resolve-as-dump stat for any non-tank, which has been an issue for a long time. sure, the change is busting up any number o' potential builds we envisioned, but am gonna see how it plays. HA! Good Fun!

We won't really know until we see how much each boosts damage. But even if they each boost damage double what might does now hybrids will still have a significantly lower damage boost potential than non hybrids. Obviously, like everybody else, I would be a bit dismayed if in fact hybrid builds became completely non-viable, but I'm pretty sure it won't be that bad. It would be very counter-productive, given the new multiclass system and all.

This post will probably will come across as whimsical, but in NWN1 (3.0 D&D rules), for example, you had to spread almost all attributes somewhat thin to make some of the best multi-class builds in the game (often involving CHA). Personally, I loved to see those 13, 14 15, 8, etc, rather than 20, 19, 18, 3, 3.. Well, you get it. You can still number crunch - which is great - I love that aspect too.

I keep seeing this "hybrid builds nerfed". I haven't got a calculator ready, but just how bad is it, really? You can't max those two stats needed, but surely you could get them in the 14 range or so. Will it really be such a downer? No feels, just facts, please.

Yup! Might is now Strength, Resolve is suddenly important, and some duplicate boosts here and there. Folks, welcome to the Land of Confusion. You go to bed, sweat dripping, and wake up to...

Dumping constitution will always be risky, though. And Josh on Twitter again: "This change makes a resolve-based caster immediately much more viable and a strength-based caster *more* viable in melee than a resolve-based caster was previously." Yet another plus in my book.

Maybe i am misunderstanding your comment but yes this change make STR into a dump stat for casters. Don't know if i like this or not yet. I guess we will see how it plays out. I formulate myself in too complicated ways sometimes. I simply mean that it will be harder to min-max a number of the usual PoE go-to builds. I'd much rather see 15, 15, 14, 8, 9 (not accurate points), than 18, 19, 19, 3, 3. I still don't think these attributes are that generic - but sure, quite a bit - but I couldn't care less.

Not with healing and deflection on the table, especially not for tanks.

Most of you won't recall this. but I was early on a proponent for separating might into STR and something else, so I'm a very happy camper right now. This also makes Rolling up your attributes a welcome pain in the arse, since there is no real dump stat. I don't like true dumpstats. I've learnt to live with Might (one stat for all damage plus healing - pretty silly), but now I don't have to anymore.