Kid SixXx

I didn't realize the point of "VtM got a new lease on life because of the mod community" took rocket science in order to grasp. Interest in VtM: Bloodlines would've died a long time ago if the mod community hadn't worked hard to make the game playable. Also Wesp alone =/= the entire VtM mod community.

V:tM Bloodlines became legendary because it has an amazing mod community that helped make the game playable again. Without them, V:tM Bloodlines would've been one of those proverbial games that you heard a lot about, decided to play, and then immediatetly put down because the bugs dove you crazy. V:TM Bloodlines straight out of the box supported only with Troika patches was nigh-unplayable even with a good gaming rig. It wasn't just unpolished; it was unfinished. Deus Ex was graphically hindered by the limitations of the Unreal engine yet it still looked and played ten times better than the average game that came out in 2000 and it also benefitted from some amazing mods from its modding community.

They still bought the game and it still sold far better than this one. No offense, but the gripes of fans that dislike the shooter focus for a game whose main protagonist is a miltary guy and whose first game in the franchise was pretty much a glorified 3PS / Squad Combat based title anyway gives me some pause.

Not sure about anyone else but to me, AP had the allure of a Bourne film or the TV series, 24, going for it at the time. It had to feel like an action film and I think it struck all the right chords with dialogue, storyline and choice. I liked the idea of an RPG set in an espionage setting. I thought it had wider appeal than a space opera or some fantasy epic dungeon crawl. With some tinkering to the gameplay mechanics (Smarter AI, have weapon skills improve damage instead of accuracy and leave the shooting to the player, level designs to help players better exploit stealth or gadget use), AP would've been a perfectly fine game. I think SEGA knew what they were funding because it's not like they haven't funded RPG's before that are downright revered now like Skies of Arcadia. They were doing business with the company that made KOTOR2 and that sold like nobody's business despite the rushed deadline. Ultimately I blame SEGA as a producer. I think if they had better supported the ambition of the AP dev team, this game would've turned out much better.

700K units moved isn't the volume you'd expect from a game that was supposed to launch a brand new franchise. Respectable from a genre standpoint, but pretty lousy when compared with expectations of the new intellectual property. And ME2 still sold very well. I suppose this is where the ME2 IS DUMBED DOWN FOR GROGNARDS WHO ARE NOT HARDCORE RPG PLAYERZ! part of the thread starts. ME2 was billed as the sequel to an RPG, not a shooter.

ME2 sold about 500K units on its first day of release. 700K units may have sold, but there are still a lot of units sitting on shelves waiting to be put in the bargain bin. AP won't make a profit if the price has to be slashed dramatically just to move the first release shipment out of circulation. I'm not sure how that was wishful thinking. The pre-release buzz generated a lot of interest and it was a spy game that felt like an action movie which tends to be a lot less polarizing than pure fantasy or sci-fi game. If execution had lived up to even 80% of the hype, this would've been a monster hit.

Well, should AP resurface as a "spiritual sequel," here is what I'd like to see. 1. Skill points put into weapon skills should enhance damage instead of improving accuracy. Leave the aiming to the player. 2. More trade-offs. Not everyone likes playing mini-games so why not allow gadget specialists the perk of being able to "buy their way past" mini-games by letting them spend money on gadgets that will help them achieve mission objectives? (ex. let them bypass hacking with icebreakers or picking locks with skeleton guns.) Then you may have players that might actually be enticed into playing a gadget specialist. 3. Better level design to allow different playstyles to succeed. Put in air ducts or something in a level for stealth guys or doors locked with key-card readers for gadget guys. Please don't force me to have to shoot my way through nearly every obstacle. If there is going to be a firefight, please design levels where there is cover and where cover actually provides cover. 4. Make Intel more utiltarian. Give me a dossier and floor plans and make me as a player actually have to look at the damned thing before beginning a mission so that it is up to me to figure out the best way to achieve mission goals that suits the playstyle I've chosen. 5. Dialogue options for specialization. If I am a stealth guy talking to my handler before a mission, let me chose a "Stealth" dialogue option so that she can suggest the best stealth options for my class and so forth. The DSS seems to be the strongest feature of the game as far as reviews go. Let it serve a purpose other than providing fluff for the plotline.

Precisely. Different Threat / Same Spy.

No one expects an addition to the spy genre to die after the first installation thanks to Bond, Bourne, and perhaps even George Smiley, despite entries in espionage literature (Cold War and otherwise) that establish the contrary. Michael Thorton being a one and done spy is sort of a let down as far as the espionage genre in general goes and I find the "sequels are overrated!" line of logic used in defense of AP to be an exercise in "those grapes were sour anyway" apologism. No one would be saying "the AP story can stand on its own!" and reject a sequel if AP had survived to see a second title. As for the topic itself, I am sad that there won't be a sequel as I am always happy to see RPG and RPG-lite titles taking place in the real world as opposed to far flung galaxies far away or some fantasy realm with dragons and damsels.