Cyrus_Blackfeather

Alright! So, there are actually two things I need from you guys before I put the finishing touches on this build and roll it out. 1. Streetfighter or No-Subclass Rogue? Basically, is Streetfighter mandatory to do max weapon damage on a Rogue or could I get away with going no-Subclass (Or maybe Assassin) and not having to deal with setting up Powder Burns to get the -50% Recovery and +20% extra Sneak Attack damage? (I'm PRETTY sure it's just 50% Sneak Attack damage and not 50% tacked onto the 30% because 80% damage at level 1 would be insane). The Cipher offers 20% damage on its own while Ascended anyway, though I'd only really be able to get four shots in on each Ascension window. 2. The abilities need a lot of love. What are some of the staple powers I should shoot for with this build, especially from the Rogue perspective, and what levels should I try to get them?

Alright guys, So, I thought about it... And the perks of being a Mindstalker do rather outweigh the drawbacks. Having a way to shirk enemy attention in combat is a huge lifesaver for a low Resolve character, and the emphasis on gunplay with debilitating spells is something that I really appreciate. I've been working on polishing up my build, and the most complete version can be found here https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/103907-characterroleplay-build-the-agent-mindstalker-streetfighterascendant/ Please have a look.

Hey guys, So, after putting the finishing touches on my Transcendent build, I decided to polish up the Mindstalker build I posted on these forums a while back, per the advice I'd received from all of you. This also includes a little bit of strategy for dealing with early game issues as a Streetfighter. Admittedly, while it can be extremely frustrating, it's also not as hard to deal with as I let on with proper gear. The Strategy: Simply put, before you get actually decent gear, keep the Blunderbuss and the Pistol as separate weapon slots, and cycle between them as needed. Powder Burns will give you Flanked for about 15 seconds or so (Since I think it keys off of your low Resolve for affliction duration) which will allow you to fire off SLIGHTLY reduced (As opposed to majorly reduced) accuracy shots with your dual pistols. The issue of spell-based accuracy still exists, and until you get Borrowed Instinct there's really not a lot you can do about that, but a lot of your powers will be targeting Will, and Tenuous Grasp is a good "Gateway Drug" to lower enemy Will. The Build: Race: Aumaua (Coastal, for built-in Might Resistance) - It fits with the idea of a Rauatai character. Class: Mindstalker (Streetfighter/Ascendant) Culture/Background: Rauatai Aristocrat (For talky skills/dialogue checks) Stats: Might: 20 (14 Base +2 Aumaua +1 GotM +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Permanent Stat Boost) Con: 10 (6 +1 Rauatai +1 Effigy's Resentment (Durance) +2 Berath's Blessing) Dexterity: 18 (15 Base +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Chameleon's Touch) Perception: 21 (18 Base +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Chameleon's Touch) Intellect: 20 (18 Base +2 Berath's Blessing) Resolve: 6 (4 Base +2 Berath's Blessing) Abilities... Level 1 - Crippling Strike/Tenuous Grasp Level 2 - Whispers of Treason (Retrain to Escape after clearing the Digsite) Level 3 - ??? Level 4 - Blinding Strike/Draining Whip Level 5 - Mind Blades OR Recall Agony Level 6 - Dirty Fighting Level 7 - Secret Horrors/Confounding Blind Level 8 - Finishing Blow Level 9 - Puppet Master or Hammering Thoughts Level 10 - Mental Binding/Shadowing Beyond Level 11 - Bear's Fortitude Level 12 - Withering Strike Level 13 - Devastating Blow/Borrowed Instinct Level 14 - Rapid Casting Level 15 - Ringleader Level 16 - Disintegration/Toxic Strike Level 17 - The Empty Soul Level 18 - Amplified Wave Level 19 - Ancestor's Honor/Deathblows Level 20 - Echoing Horror The abilities require a bit of polish. I'm trying to find a way I can keep key abilities, but possibly get them at lower levels. Waiting two power levels for a weapon style passive seems like an enormous waste of time. More or less though, I tried to pick up on powers that I felt would be most useful, but I know there are some that might be contested. If you want to provide recommendations for other abilities, please let me know which level I ought to consider picking them up. I might consider getting rid of either Tough, Bear's Fortitude, or both. Gear: Weapons: The Kitchen Stove(MH)/Scordeo's Trophy (OH) - The Kitchen Stove, upgraded, gives you a per encounter AoE attack that can generate enough Focus for you to immediately Ascend. Scordeo's Trophy has some amazing enchants that help with Action Speed and Critical Hit damage. Also consider Thundercrack Pistol in another weapon slot for Storm Rune Shot and another quick bit of Focus gain. There's also something to be said for a Blunderbuss/Blunderbuss and Pistol/Pistol weapon set, perhaps with Serafen's dual Hand Mortars. The Blunderbusses can be used with Confounding Blind to strip Deflection before swapping over to the pistols for eliminating key targets. Pet: Cutthroat Cosmo for the recovery reduction and party-wide effect of 5% bonus damage with guns. Every little bit helps. Armor: Miscreant's Leathers is my personal pick for the 5% chance to just ignore an attack. Furthermore, when used with Cutthroat Cosmo, it just... doesn't have a Recovery penalty. Plus it looks stylish, and Blow the Man Down is easily my favorite quest for all of the ways you can solve it. I'm definitely open to other suggestions though. Maia's armor seems like it'd be good for the 20% hit to crit on dodging a ranged attack, but that requires... dodging a ranged attack. Plus it's a % chance to happen, not a guarantee. Helm: Acina's Tricorn is why this build doesn't work with Godlikes unfortunately, as well as why Miscreant's Leathers is my favorite piece of gear to go with it for style points. Get it, love it. Rings: Chameleon's Touch and Ring of the Marksman. Chameleon's Touch can be acquired on Neketaka (Though the bounty to get it can be pretty rough) as can Ring of the Marksman (Though this is VERY important, and I'm putting this here so I won't forget. You must pickpocket it off of the Rauatai Sailors as part of the Valera portion of the Family Feud quest. As a pro-Rauatai character, obviously I can't kill them. As for... why I decided to steal their ring? Well, they weren't using it, I guess). Cloak: Cloak of Greater Protection - It's like Giftbearer's Cloth for people who A: Don't need the extra weapon/quick item slot and B: Don't overindulge in History. Neck: Token of Faith (+2 Resolve) or Amulet of Greater Health (25 max Health) - Lots of not unique items here, but I can't really think of many good neck slot items I've come across. The amulet brings us to 273 HP. Cipher's Shackle could also work for the +Con and Dexterity Affliction resistance. Gloves: Bracers of Greater Deflection - They're bracers that deflect things. Both this and the Cloak are taken in the event that you might be hit eventually and that if you are, you probably want to make sure you're at least not crit and killed before you can teleport away. Belt: Belt of Eoten Constitution - Mostly so that your 10 Con becomes 12 Con. That adds an extra 21 HP. I'm not entirely sold on this one, so other Belt options would certainly be welcome. Maybe Gwyn's Bridal Garter for the added resistance to Dexterity Afflictions? Boots: Boots of the Stone for Dexterity and Resolve, though the overlapping Resistance to Might afflictions makes them a less desirable choice. Right now... The only thing preventing me from loving this build as much as my Transcendent is the ability selection. If there was some way to streamline it a bit so that I got some of those super important things like Two-Weapon Fighting earlier, I'd definitely give this one a lot more consideration. As it is, I don't like how congested it is, and how it seems like each choice, even if it's a good one, eliminates a bunch of other good choices. Thoughts? This is mostly a repost for posterity, but I've cleaned it up a bit and tightened the focus as far as race and culture go, I feel.

Hmm... Too bad there's not a way to really handle the Resolve problem and still remain efficient at doing damage. I could drop Might a bit for it, since I don't think it's really needed for ANY subclass of Rogue with Sneak Attack damage), just so I'm not at negative Deflection. Or is that not worth the damage I'd lose, even if it's additive? Alright, I think I might work on my Mindstalker build a little bit more. Having that escape, and then later that Escape + Invisibility, really does make a world of difference.

Figured I'd update this. Updated some of the abilities (Decided to take Lightning Strikes. Good idea or nah?) and took Stunning Blow instead of Hammering Thoughts or Ectopsychic Echo. I'm considering whether or not to just not upgrade Hammering Thoughts if it doesn't stack with the lash from Thundercrack Pistol - though it does apply a lash to my other pistol regardless, so that's good.

Hey guys, So, I've been wanting to make a character that follows the Magic Gunman/Magic Marksman archetype - basically, someone who mixes firearms with magic in some way, either through using spells to enhance their innate abilities as a marksman or through enchanting bullets or even 'shooting' spells. I've been experimenting with different multiclass options to try to come up with something that fits, and I'd like to share what I have so far with you guys, to get your opinion on things. Keep in mind, this isn't an exhaustive list. If you have an option that I haven't listed, feel free to leave it below. 1. Transcendent (Helwalker/Ascendant): Ciphers, of all of the casting classes, fit this concept really well. They have an innate symbiotic relationship between casting and weapon attacks through Soul Whip, which can be seen as enchanting their gear to leech essence from their foes. Their spells focus on manipulating the souls and essence of their allies and enemies. Monk, meanwhile, focuses on strengthening the soul through causing pain - either to themselves or to their enemies. The power they gain from their Wounds can then be used to strengthen their attacks, imbue their weapons with flame or lightning, project their fists or melee weapons at range, or spawn elemental copies of themselves. Build: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/103822-roleplay-build-special-agent-ranged-transcendent-helwalkerascendant/ Pros (IC): Cipher unique dialogue options, Monks occupy a variety of different walks of life in Eora including spies and assassins, synergistic class interaction with an emphasis on soul manipulation both inwardly and outwardly, a return of sorts to my PoE1 Cipher character. Pros (OOC): Really good class synergy - though Monk synergizes well with everything, good mix of damage and CC based Cipher powers, +10 Might/Int from Helwalker with Duality of Mortal Presence, a small bit more HP. Can use damage dealing Cipher powers in addition to CC-focused Cipher powers for different encounters. Cons (IC): Can't really think of any. Cons (OOC): Power choices might be a little scattered. No real get out of jail free card if I do get into a nasty situation (Escape/Shadowing Beyond) and I take 50% extra damage at max Wounds. Probably less weapon damage overall than a Rogue multi, considering how Might is calculated compared to Sneak Attack. 2. Mindstalker (No Subclass/Ascendant): Compared to Monks, Rogues don't really have the same array of powers that come from a strengthened soul, but it is stated throughout skill descriptions and dialogue that at least some of their talents come from a manipulation of essence. Escape and Shadowing Beyond/Shadow Step are described as a practical use of one's essence to quickly enter a point in the Beyond and emerge at another point, cloaking oneself with shadow to avoid attacks/become invisible. With that in mind, it makes sense that a particularly adept Rogue would know how to draw upon those powers in other ways - lining up ideal shots for things like Blinding Strike or Pierce the Bell for instance, or knowing just where to strike an enemy to make a Sneak Attack. Build: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/103781-roleplay-build-the-company-man-mindstalker-ranged-streetfighterascendant-for-potd-not-a-solo-build-warning-lots-of-reading/ Pros (IC): Cipher specific dialogue options, more of an emphasis on shady dealings and dirty deeds. Pros (OOC): Lots of really devastating afflictions/DoT effects available, high weapon damage from Sneak Attack > Deathblows and Soul Whip (When Ascended, 50% Sneak Attack damage and 100% Deathblows damage), Secret Horrors sets up Deathblows on its own and targets Will. Good escape option in the form of Shadowing Beyond. Cons (IC): Silly name. Cons (OOC): To take all of the really good Rogue stuff, you can't take a lot of Cipher powers and pretty much have to limit yourself to CC. Even then, you have to make some really tough choices whereas Monk allows you to be a little more free with what you pick. Take a look at the build - Two Weapon Fighting at 10th level. Arterial Strike at level 13. Also, aside from gear, there's no real action speed increase available unless Streetfighter is picked, and the conditions for setting up Streetfighter on a pure ranged character are tedious and awkward. 3. Shadowdancer (No-Subclass/Helwalker): This one focuses entirely on the first type of magic gunner I discussed in the first few paragraphs, a character that almost entirely uses his magic to strengthen his otherwise honed marksmanship skills. Gone are the spells centered around invading the minds of his enemies, now we just have a character that uses his control over his own essence to make sure that each shot counts and that each shot hurts. Pros (IC): I can't really think of any that put it above Transcendent or Mindstalker Pros (OOC): Access to really good Monk passive/active abilities and Sneak Attack for super strong weapon damage with an Action Speed increase from Swift Strikes/Lightning Strikes. Access to an escape option through Shadowing Beyond as well as the devastating Affliction ability of the Rogue. Cons (IC): No Cipher dialogue options. In fact, Monk and Rogue together have less than 10. Cons (OOC): AoE requires using area of effect weapons like Blunderbusses (Poor range and accuracy with no in-build way to buff Accuracy unlike the Cipher), loses out on Soul Whip damage, as well as Charm/Dominate. Most skills target Fortitude (Generally highest enemy defense) or Reflex. Heavy focus on single target damage makes combat against multiple enemies a chore. So I'm curious to hear your thoughts. Right now I'm heavily leaning toward Transcendent as my first choice, simply because I feel like it has the best synergy both in character and out of character, and allows for a lot more freedom in the abilities I take and when I take them. Losing out on Sneak Attack damage is a shame, but ultimately I feel like the extra Might and Intellect from Helwalker make up for it. Now, if only I had an escape option for boarding parties outside of Bounding Boots.

Any other comments or concerns? I think this is ready to play, bar a few other potential bits of tuning. 1. I'm thinking of switching the race to either Coastal or Island Aumaua to more fit the aesthetic of a Rauatai intelligence/black ops officer. Obviously the race is flexible depending on where your character is from, culture-wise. This is subject to change per more feedback into the intricacies of the VTC versus RDC, but bear in mind I like to try to stick with lore-appropriate races to the culture I pick. 2. The finalized stats now that I stopped accounting for two extra points that didn't exist. That is, unfortunately, a failure in the math of most of my builds, due to my poor balancing. 3. The finalized abilities. I might drop Mental Binding in favor of something else from the Cipher or Monk trees. And can anyone tell me if the +1 flat Penetration from Hammering Thoughts stacks with the +2 Penetration from Thunderous Blows? Further, is +3 Penetration to spells and weapon damage all that's really needed?

So, I'm having a lot of trouble deciding between Factions/cultural backgrounds for my Cipher/Monk. I have a good idea of what both of their goals are overall through my Principi playthrough (I did some of their sidequests), so I have impressions of both groups going in, but some additional context/small details would be nice. A little about the character... I wanted a spy/assassin that didn't just default to X/Rogue. I played around with a Mindstalker at first, but it didn't really synergize all that well, so I settled on Helwalker Monk because both Monk and Rogue heavily focus on manipulating souls, just with different end goals. A Cipher learns how to harness and control the souls of his allies and enemies, while a Monk focuses on strengthening his own soul through pain - either experiencing it or causing it. Monks also take on a variety of different jobs, assassination included. I also wanted a character who fit the Arcane Gunner archetype, because that's a type of character I rarely see, but it's always a treat when I do. This character either channels spells through his guns, or enchants bullets with his particular type of magic. Cipher was a really good fit here because of how their chosen weapons are tied directly into their magic via Soul Whip. I see this character as being very efficient, and loyal to his faction's particular cause. He's disciplined, but not aloof or emotionless, he takes things very seriously while "on the job" but isn't above a drink with his mates in the tavern afterwards. He'd be the kind of person who would brutally put down a mutiny, but who wouldn't hesitate before risking his life to save his crew. Already kind of seems like the choice has been made... Still, I've highlighted what I think are the pros and cons of both, and I'd like you to corroborate or challenge these in the comments, if possible. RDC: Pros - Highly efficient, by the book (Except when they decide to play dirty). The Fleetmaster sums it up as "The others will know to expect a war when we don't turn in our paperwork." - Out of the two "foreign invaders," their reasons at least seem somewhat positive. Rauatai is a harsh and unforgiving place to live, so I don't exactly blame them for wanting to expand. - They seem pretty okay with animancy in moderation. Atsura has two Ciphers standing right behind him. They're just against overmining luminous adra. - Atsura is a really well-written character, even if he is QUITE manipulative. That kind of bleeds into the first 'con,' though. Cons: - They're probably definitely all lying to you at least to one degree or another. I'm not sure if they trust you more if you're actually of Rauatai culture or not, though. My character was Deadfire, so it made at least some sense why they wouldn't. - I lose out on Pallegina, so I have to make another Herald. Probably, I'm not sure if she can be convinced to stay. This ostensibly happens even with a Kind Wayfarer Pallegina, because she's THAT loyal to the Republics. - For it to make sense, I'd want to play Aumaua. I know there are members of other races in Rauatai, but I haven't seen any of them in military or high end civic positions. VTC: Pros: - Castol is a really neat character, and is considered so well-liked that people actively attempt to avoid screwing him over, even in pro-Huana playthroughs. - Even if they are more focused on economic advancement for their investors, there's still plenty of areas where an intelligence agent from the Republics could get involved. - A bit more open in terms of race choices - Humans, Dwarves, Orlans, and Elves are all more freely available - Bit more open to the idea of animancy and experimenting with it, though... Cons: - Most of those experiments end in failure. - They're much more of a mercantile enterprise than a military/statecraft one. - They're not exactly interested in conserving resources. It's heavily implied that they will overmine and grow dependent on luminous adra. So... am I misinterpreting something? Can you guys give me any additional pros and cons to either option that aren't related to the main story for each (Because I more or less know those already).

Aww, thanks! Once I finish with this one, I'm going to be considering a few options for a pro-Principi character or a pro-Vallian character. Don't worry, they won't be X/Monk.

So, I've had the idea floating around in my head for a while of a character that's an assassin for one of the major factions focusing on gunplay and spellcasting. I like the idea of, at least in my headcanon, a proper hybridization of the two - say, a Wizard who loads his gun with special Fireball or Shadowflame bullets or, in my case, a Cipher that uses guns as a conduit for Soul Whip as well as for "firing" spells like Disintegrate and Ringleader. Obviously this in no way reflects how the game actually works, but it's how I like to see things. I'm hoping the next few expansions will give us weapons like some of the Soulbound gear in PoE1 that has "Spellchance" associated with it - a chance to cast a particular spell on hit or crit. Until then, I have to just settle for a hybrid of ranged weapon damage and spellcasting. I wanted to share what I've come up with as a good class combination for this type of character, and then hear your ideas. 1. Transcendent (Ascendant/Helwalker): My main pick for roleplay reasons because I really like how Monk and Cipher synergize in terms of class lore. They both center around manipulating souls, with the Monk undergoing mortification of the body to strengthen his soul against entropy and the Cipher harnessing the essences of their allies and enemies to potent effect. Cipher also has the most direct link to the weapon damage of the martial class through Soul Whip, which feeds off of the damage done by the Cipher to their target. 2. Mindstalker (Ascendant/No-Subclass Rogue): My second pick. From a roleplay perspective, it suits the kind of assassin character I'm going for quite well, but so does Monk. Rogue might be a better option from a DPS perspective, but I feel like the necessity for pumping out weapon damage to take advantage of Sneak Attack takes away some from the Cipher's toolkit. When I look at a multiclass, I look for synergies between the two from both a gameplay and storytelling perspective. I'm curious to hear some other thoughts on this.

Alright! And single-handing a Blunderbuss pretty much negates the Accuracy penalty. I went ahead and added that into the gear list.

It does! Dangit. Hmm. So, that frees up a slot to either take Lightning Strikes (Which doubles up with the shock lash from the Thundercrack pistol, I think) or get Stunning Blow early and pick up Mental Binding at Level 8. I'd probably go for Mental Binding just to round out my fast-cast CC a little bit more, though Lightning Strikes is a tough second just for that little bit of extra damage. Plus, I like the idea of shock with this build - it's just a shame the Thundercrack pistol isn't pierce/shock like Lord Darryn's Voulge is Shock/Slash.

Scout is fun, sure, I could do Ghost Heart and not have to worry about managing the pet. I just wonder if I'll be able to stand up to Maia with her unique subclass.

Made some more small tweaks - changed out The Complete Self for Echoing Horror (Extra little bit of CC on kill). Also, once I get Puppet Master, I've considered respeccing out of Whispers of Treason for Tenuous Grasp, provided the issue with respeccing removing your character creation picks if you upgrade them is fixed. I'm considering getting rid of Tough for Fast Casting, especially for my big AoE spells like Amplified Wave, and for Disintegrate. That does hit my HP pretty hard, though... ranged character. After I get Ringleader, I might spec out of Puppet Master for Mind Lance. It targets Reflex and has good base Penetration. I also want to get Mental Binding in there for another quick CC against groups, but I have no idea where I'd put that.

Maybe swap out Ectopsychic Echo with Secret Horrors. Mostly because its kinda clunky to set up and in the time it takes set up you'd probably get more mileage out of the other offensive powers. Personally I prefer it with a Chanter or Ranger (Ghost Heart only) multiclass, since you can summon behind the enemies and then lash the tether on them. As for Secret Horrors, it inflicts Frightened which makes enemies stop using their abilities, very useful against enemy casters. Between Puppet Master, Ringleader and Secret Horrors you're well set for crowd control. Alright! Thanks. What do you think of this compared to the Mindstalker I'd been fussing over? Personally, I think this seems like a lot more fun.

Well, that's the main reason I decided to go Helwalker - +10 Might allows for a lot more versatility in terms of the type of damage you're able to do. I was going Streetfighter/Ascendant, but the stuff you have to do to make Streetfighter work when you're at range just isn't enjoyable for me. I've considered other options as well, pairing off No-Subclass Rogue with Monk or Ranger, or Cipher with Ranger, but none of those really seemed all that fun to me. At the end of the day, here's what I'm looking for for THIS particular character. - A ranged damage dealer. That's obvious, and easy enough to make in a number of different ways. I prefer dual pistols for the 'cool' factor and because pistols, of the ranged family, seem to have the better enchants. I also really want a mixed martial/magic class because I love exploring that concept. The best fit for the kind of character I wanted to play that followed that theme was a Cipher gunner. - A Cipher multiclass. Ciphers were BIG in the first game, and I feel like they have the potential to be big here, for the kind of character I'm wanting to make. It's not JUST his weapon skills that make him an asset to his faction, it's the information he's able to extract, through a variety of subtle and/or painful ways. - A Cipher multiclass that's able to use their spells. I get that that's not 100% optimal, but people on these very forums seem to be having a lot of fun with things like Mind Blades, or Disintegrate, or Amplified Wave. Heck, if Amplified Wave's AoE is as big as it was in the first game, with 30 Int it should make boarding actions ridiculous. Same thing with Mind Blades and its tons of bounces at max level. I LIKE Mindstalker as a concept (Even if I hate the name), don't get me wrong, but I could never really get something that 'stuck' with it. The Streetfighter bonus is great, but is more suited for a melee character. With range, while it does come in really handy, the conditionals for setting it up are a lot more specific. You either need to play recklessly and get bloodied... or you can use Powder Burns, neither of which appeal to me. Plus, you're never really encouraged to use your Cipher spells outside of reapplying CC while Ascended, since your Rogue damage is always going to be superior. Edit: Basically, as long as what I've presented here isn't suboptimal (Like, say, a Priest/Wizard or a Priest/Cipher), without having to be "Meta" (Paladin/Chanter solo PotD or Streetfighter/Berserker Lightning Cheese from before 1.2), I'm content with it just being considered "Good fun." That being said, I am considering going Aumaua for the race, and probably Island for the immunity to slog (Since I'm not really planning on getting or staying Bloodied). Kind of stepping on Maia's toes a bit there, though. But, hey, more lore-friendly.

Ah, shoot you're right. I think I'll just peel off a little bit of Dexterity, it probably won't hurt me too much in the long-term.

Mostly for customization options/portrait variety. Aumaua would definitely fit Rauatai a lot better, but I'm not as much of a fan of their look. I dunno, I'd have to play around with it. The Streetfighter Recovery time penalty is incredibly clunky, at least for me. -5 Accuracy, -1 AR, and (I think?) -10 Deflection from Distracted are all pretty huge drawbacks. I could use one of the others, I suppose, but I also like the bonuses you get from Helwalker.

Hey guys, So after getting really discouraged by the honestly immersion breaking way I had to play Mindstalker, and getting some input from Haplok here on these forums, I decided to attempt a Monk/Cipher multiclass for my assassin Watcher. Now, this might sound like a weird option until one considers the following, from a roleplay perspective... A: Monks cover a wide range of disciplines, from mercenaries to retainers to assassins. B: Monk abilities and Cipher abilities both heavily involve the soul. While the Cipher focuses on manipulating the souls of their allies and enemies, Monks focus on strengthening their own soul through mortification to become stronger. Some things that, mechanically, Monk/Cipher misses out on that Rogue/Cipher gets - Escape > Shadowing Beyond (Good 'get out of jail free' card for sticky situations. Not really any equivalent skill in the Monk arsenal, so... Just play better?) - Sneak Attack damage (Up to 80% on no-Subclass Rogues/Assassins, 100% on Streetfighter. Only applies to weapon damage though) - A few more attacks that target Reflex What Monk gives that Rogue doesn't - 10 extra Might with Helwalker for spell damage, and a patently insane 10 Intellect for another 100% AoE size and 50% duration of afflictions AND the Ascended state. - Less hoops to jump through in order to set up your bonus, and less of a penalty to yourself (50% extra damage on a Ranged character isn't too bad, though the lack of escape options definitely hurts). - A really good Full Attack in Stunning Blow (Can be used at range, can refund the cost on Crit) Now for the build! Race: Human (Meadowfolk) or Aumaua (Coastal) Class: Helwalker/Ascendant Culture/Background: Rauatai/Aristocrat or Scholar Stats: Might: 20 (15 Base +1 Human +1 GotM +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Permanent Stat Boost) Con: 10 (6 +1 Rauatai +1 Effigy's Resentment (Durance) +2 Berath's Blessing) Dexterity: 18 (15 Base +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Chameleon's Touch) Perception: 21 (18 Base +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Chameleon's Touch) Intellect: 20 (18 Base +2 Berath's Blessing) Resolve: 6 (3 Base +2 Berath's Blessing +1 Human) 20 Might becomes 30 with max Wounds from Helwalker, and from there it's not hard at all to reach 35. 20 Intellect becomes 30 with Helwalker + Duality of Mortal Presence. 10 Constitution effectively becomes 12 in regards to max HP with the bonuses from GotM and Effigy's Resentment. With Tough, that's 291 HP, enough to take a hit and get out of dodge. Abilities per level Level 1 - Swift Strikes/Eyestrike Level 2 - Whispers of Treason (Respec to Tenuous Grasp at level 10/When done with the Digsite) Level 3 - Penetrating Visions Level 4 - Two-Weapon Fighting/Draining Whip Level 5 - Mind Blades Level 6 - Dance of Death Level 7 - Secret Horrors/Lightning Strikes Level 8 - Mental Binding Level 9 - Stunning Blow Level 10 - Puppet Master/Duality of Mortal Presence (Maybe respec Puppet Master to Mind Lance at level 15) Level 11 - Enduring Dance Level 12 - Thunderous Blows Level 13 - Borrowed Instinct/Stunning Surge Level 14 - Tough OR Rapid Casting Level 15 - Ringleader Level 16 - Amplified Wave/Turning Wheel Level 17 - Disintegrate Level 18 - The Empty Soul Level 19 - The Dichotomous Soul/Ancestor's Honor Level 20 - Echoing Horror The abilities aren't set in stone. I went for predominantly damage dealing powers, but overlooked some very good crowd control powers. I'm interested in hearing other ideas for ability layouts from you guys. Gear Weapons: Thundercrack Pistol/Scordeo's Prize. Not only does dual-wielding pistols make you look inherently badass, Storm Rune Shot is a really good skill to use for quickly racking up Focus - though it is per-rest, so bear this in mind. Scordeo's Prize has some very good enchantment options that further help with crit damage and action speed. In another slot, get Kitchen Stove with Thunderous Report for insta-Ascension on one attack. Pet: Cutthroat Cosmo for the recovery reduction and party-wide effect of 5% bonus damage with guns. Every little bit helps. Armor: Miscreant's Leathers is my personal pick for the 5% chance to just ignore an attack. Furthermore, when used with Cutthroat Cosmo, it just... doesn't have a Recovery penalty. Plus it looks stylish, and Blow the Man Down is easily my favorite quest for all of the ways you can solve it. I'm definitely open to other suggestions though. Maia's armor seems like it'd be good for the 20% hit to crit on dodging a ranged attack, but that requires... dodging a ranged attack. Plus it's a % chance to happen, not a guarantee. Helm: Acina's Tricorn is why this build doesn't work with Godlikes unfortunately, as well as why Miscreant's Leathers is my favorite piece of gear to go with it for style points. Get it, love it. Rings: Chameleon's Touch and Ring of the Marksman. Chameleon's Touch can be acquired on Neketaka (Though the bounty to get it can be pretty rough) as can Ring of the Marksman (Though this is VERY important, and I'm putting this here so I won't forget. You must pickpocket it off of the Rauatai Sailors as part of the Valera portion of the Family Feud quest. As a pro-Rauatai character, obviously I can't kill them. As for... why I decided to steal their ring? Well, they weren't using it, I guess). Cloak: Cloak of Greater Protection - It's like Giftbearer's Cloth for people who A: Don't need the extra weapon/quick item slot and B: Don't overindulge in History. Neck: Token of Faith (+2 Resolve) or Amulet of Greater Health (25 max Health) - Lots of not unique items here, but I can't really think of many good neck slot items I've come across. The amulet brings us over 300 HP. Cipher's Shackle could also work for the +Con and Dexterity Affliction resistance. Gloves: Bracers of Greater Deflection - They're bracers that deflect things. Both this and the Cloak are taken in the event that you might be hit eventually and that if you are, you probably want to make sure you're at least not crit and killed before you can teleport away. Belt: Belt of Eoten Constitution - Mostly so that your 10 Con becomes 12 Con. That adds an extra 21 HP. I'm not entirely sold on this one, so other Belt options would certainly be welcome. Maybe Gwyn's Bridal Garter for the added resistance to Dexterity Afflictions? Boots: Boots of the Stone or Bounding Boots (Grant Leap for a quick escape option). So, all in all, what do you guys think? The abilities might need a little tweaking, but while I think this is in for an equally rough (If not more rough) early game start compared to my Mindstalker, it has the potential to really come into its own and be a lot more fun to play. I really wasn't enjoying the constant penalty I was having to accrue to play the Streetfighter variant of this build, and I think this option allows for a more even blend of Cipher and Monk abilities that synergizes together a bit more naturally. Please feel free to be candid with your comments. If there's two skills here that don't synergize, let me know. Otherwise, I'm feeling pretty confident about this one, and the initial testing has been positive. Edit: Swapped out Lesser Wounds for Whispers of Treason and Mind Lance for Puppet Master, for early-mid game Charm/Dominate. I might respec when I get Ringleader, though having multiple options to apply those afflictions sound good. Thinking about swapping out Ectopsychic Echo for Secret Horrors, but I'm not sure. Edit: Realized I had counted two extra points, so I took them off of Dexterity, dropping it down to 18 after all bonuses. That makes my total attack speed 6.2 seconds compared to 5.1 seconds with the Streetfighter buff. More if I use the Chant with a Herald. That's not taking into account every potential buff, though.

I've considered playing a Helwalker/Ascendant, actually. You lose out on a lot of good Rogue powers though, but instead you get access to things like Stunning Surge, which are very nice to have. Plus, a 20% Burn lash on Max Wounds with Turning Wheel, and easy access to max Might on longer fights. Other things you lose out on from the Rogue: - 80%/100% weapon damage boost with Deathblows (But that's not until max level, when you should have plenty of damage boosts anyway) - Escape -> Shadowing Beyond as a get out of melee free option. Plus, there's less of a "Rotation" with Monk abilities vs Rogue abilities - with the Rogue, I need to ensure every enemy is Sneak Attack vulnerable before I hit it, where the Monk can focus more on just smashing things with its mind. FURTHERMORE, I get access to The Long Pain/Instruments of Pain so I can have Ranged Melee as an option if I want. As far as damage vs CC goes, yeah - I was definitely planning to take Ectopsychic, Amp. Wave, and Disintegrate in either case simply because they are pretty good. Hmm. I actually kind of like the idea of that third option, now that you mention it. Sure, the first few levels are going to hurt quite a bit, but I can avoid most of the combat through dialogue so it shouldn't be too much of a problem. You hit the nail on the head, though. Jumping through hoops and breaking immersion are really the biggest downsides of either of the Rogue multiclass options at range. For the kind of character I'm wanting to play, he's much more of a cold, calculating killer than a brute who overloads his gun for the sake of an adrenaline high and extra "damage."

Hmm. I'm just really, really, torn up here. There seems to be several solid ways to build this multiclass, compared to others where it's pretty much just been "Pick these couple of skills and win." So far, I have... - Streetfighter with CC Cipher spells - Streetfighter with damaging Cipher spells - Dual Pistol/Arquebus Assassin with damaging Cipher spells - Dual Pistol/Arquebus Assassin with CC Cipher spells. Each one seems fun in a lot of different ways, but also has its own share of drawbacks. For the Streetfighter, while it's easy enough to get and keep the bonus on a ranged character, the most efficient way to do so comes at the cost of -5 Accuracy. Admittedly, early on this can be mitigated somewhat by just one-handing a Blunderbuss to set it up and then swapping to dual pistols for full attacks, but the point is - especially when dual-wielding a Blunderbuss with another weapon - you'll always be -5 Accuracy down from where you 'could' have been. +1 Accuracy from a Legendary weapon instead of +6. For the Assassin, the biggest issue is having to use Arquebus to open combat and then swap to dual pistols because dual wielding Full Attacks break Stealth on the first attack (Which I assume gets the bonus) and thus you're not getting the most efficient use out of the extra accuracy and penetration. There's also the 15% extra damage taken, but that's kind of irrelevant on a ranged character with a good party setup. Yes, you could use invisibility potions, but that still means you'd have to use one, swap to your Arquebus, take a shot, and then swap back to pistols. There's also, of course, the issue of how to take abilities as well... This remains the biggest point of contention about this whole build for me. Do I want to stock up on mostly Rogue powers for dealing damage and only take a few key Cipher abilities, or try to strike more of a balance? Is there anything a Cipher can do that a Rogue can't do better? Or, alternatively, should I bother with Cipher at all and just switch to my second choice - Harbinger? Would Chanter offer more synergy with Rogue than Cipher does?

Nice, okay. And plus it makes sense for a firearms specialist to use both, anyway.

So it might be good to open from Stealth with an Arquebus shot and then Pistol/Pistol? Would it still be worth using the invisibility from, say, Shadowing Beyond to get a quick Assassinate with even the first shot of a Pistol full attack? Thundercrack has some really nice enchants on it - I don't know if Scordeo's Prize does (It's not on the wiki, and I haven't the coin to buy it on my Marauder).

Hey guys, Was wondering whether Arquebus or dual pistol would be better for a ranged Assassin (Capital A)? Dual pistols obviously have tremendous style points over arquebuses, but someone told me I'd be limited to Arquebuses if I wanted to make use of the Assassin class. Is that because the first attack from stealth or invisibility breaks the invisibility and thus negates the Assassinate bonuses for the second shot?

Where do I get Brilliant? Hasn't that been... like, completely removed? Okay, so something like this...? Level 1 - Crippling Strike/Eyestrike Level 2 - Escape Level 3 - Penetrating Visions Level 4 - Two-Weapon Fighting/Draining Whip Level 5 - Mind Blades Level 6 - Dirty Fighting Level 7 - Secret Horrors/Strike the Bell Level 8 - Hammering Thoughts Level 9 - Arterial Strike Level 10 - Silent Scream/Shadowing Beyond Level 11 - Bear's Fortitude Level 12 - Finishing Blow Level 13 - Pierce the Bell/Borrowed Instinct Level 14 - Rapid Casting Level 15 - Tough Level 16 - Amplified Wave/Devastating Blow Level 17 - The Empty Soul Level 18 - Disintegration Level 19 - Ancestor's Honor/Deathblows Level 20 - Echoing Horror Also, I went with a more Rogue focused variant, removing a lot of the damage dealing Cipher spells in favor of more Rogue abilities. Level 1 - Crippling Strike/Eyestrike Level 2 - Escape Level 3 - Penetrating Visions Level 4 - Two-Weapon Fighting/Draining Whip Level 5 - Smoke Veil Level 6 - Dirty Fighting Level 7 - Hammering Thoughts/Strike the Bell Level 8 - Blinding Strike Level 9 - Arterial Strike Level 10 - Bear's Fortitude/Shadowing Beyond Level 11 - Confounding Blind Level 12 - Finishing Blow Level 13 - Pierce the Bell/Borrowed Instinct Level 14 - Rapid Casting Level 15 - Tough Level 16 - Ringleader/Devastating Blow Level 17 - The Empty Soul Level 18 - Disintegration Level 19 - Ancestor's Honor/Deathblows Level 20 - Echoing Horror Anything you'd recommend changing?