Revolver

Tank

That really wasn't my concern- I realize NWN has 2 feedback windows. But neither is very convenient for the purposes of having interesting combat feedback messages, which NWN does not have for that reason. All NWN has is combat rolls and announcements of special attacks. That is a far cry from the example I posted above. I did mention: "Unless you want to pause and scroll all the way up to see the messages, its not going to work to well- and even then, its not the same as the instant gratification of seeing the message right after the attack and having time to read it. "

I don't agree with Carsten's opinion about turn based games either, but in general he is fair and he listens to other people's arguments. It is hard to have a reasonable discussion when people are insulting you every other sentence like the people at DAC were. Carsten does not shy away from responding to criticism, and if you present enough reasonable points, he will take them into consideration. That's much better than if he just rolled over to everything the fans said?

Maybe it's a difference between what level we were playing at- the last module I played was HotU, so there were obviously more attacks at high levels- I mean, I'd queue up continuous called shots, and they would go by so fast I couldn't even see if it was the arm or the leg. I agree though that the floating text would work better than the scrolling window- but I prefer that in Fallout, the floating text was used for combat taunts and the window was used for feedback. Sure, it can be done in real-time, but not was well, and from past history, most developers don't spend the time to do it as a result.

For NWN and BG combat, I only have time to see the combat roll and damage. Unless you want to pause and scroll all the way up to see the messages, its not going to work to well- and even then, its not the same as the instant gratification of seeing the message right after the attack and having time to read it.

I just want to give an example of one more thing I miss about turn based combat :

The problem was, it *WAS* representative of the NWN OC. I'm repeating myself here, but I think it's a problem with real time RPGs that designers feel like they have to waste the player's time w/ meaningless combat. However If the NWN OC had an equal amount of combat as Fallout, the game would be over incredibly quickly and be just as unsatisfying. I agree that the style of combat makes little difference if the game is well designed- as shown by HotU and fan made mods. I just see more real time developers falling into that trap.

I thought Soule's work in NWN:HotU stood out from his earlier scores... And of course we *need* Obsidian to bring back the glory days of turn-based CRPGs

You would really try to simulate turn-based? I'd go crazy slogging through all those time wasting minor point A to point B combats ever-present in RT RPGs turn by turn. Thats the problem w/ turn-based concessions to a real-time game. It should be either pure RT or TB.

I agree the OC sucked- the expansions, particularly HotU were better, and the toolset is just great.

http://www.silver-style.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1459

Isn't that ShadowPaladin's avatar?

Here's how I see the reasoning of many of today's RPG designers (intentional or not) 1) Must make it real-time or it will not sell. 2) However real-time makes it really hard to control multiple characters, so we have to give the party members standalone AI or add a pause feature, or both. 3) Reflexes can't be a factor because this will make RPG fans angry and think it's a Diablo clone. Therefore, we have to also give the player an AI option to attack when attacked, and have the character finish killing the enemy on its own once a target has been selected. 4) Combat is now over too quickly so we have to fill the game with time-killing minor combats and encounters so that the player feels like he's actually doing something. 5) But we have to make this frequent combat somewhat tactically interesting, so we'll sacrifice some of the time spent on RP and story elements to focus on encounters. This results in A- combat where you have a limited role- click, wait, click wait, loot. B- combat that's frequently not satisfying nor meaningful. And finally C- A game that's limited in freedom and depth.

I wasn't referring to real-time w/ pause when I said hybrid. I actually like a couple of those kind of RPGs. But RT w/ pause is just the same as RT for me... I probably should have said that efforts to give concessions to TB fans by making a game where you could switch between real-time and turn based were horrible- for the TB fans- as I was thinking about FO:Tactics and X-Com Apocalypse. Not really RPGs, I know, but you get the idea. And I don't even have to bring up Lionheart.

After all these real-time and horrible hybrid RT TB RPGs, I think it's time we had a RP focused game that used a pure turn based combat system. Before someone starts spouting sales arguments, I'd just like to point out that the Fallouts were M rated games with an original world, while BG, KOTOR, NWN, all used extremely popular licenses (Forgotten Realms and Starwars). I realize that you may be working on KOTOR 2 w/ Bioware, and as a sequel, it would have to be real-time. That's fine, but I'm hoping that your first original effort will be the one that brings back the pure turn based CRPG.

Don't forget the "Thou shalt not argue with a mod" commandment. That rule alone would cut the post count in half of some of the forums we and a lot of these wannabe mods have been posting on.

Bring back Dark Sun! I know it will never happen b/c that whole franchise is dead, but it was always the only D&D setting I ever really liked... Back to the old west RPG concept- I always wanted to play a native american character... A French and Indian War setting would be nice too.

Name is from the Beatles album, and also my weapons of choice in Fallout 2. Avatar is The Overseer, and sig is from my low int character in F2 in NCR.

You only got 98.8% of your words spelled correctly- your opinion can't be trusted!

Since they are partnering with Bioware, is it safe to assume that they can use the D&D & Forgotten Realms licenses too? Like Greation said, I expect them to play it safe with their first release and use either the Star Wars or FR licenses. However, I'd much prefer that they work on a RPG in an "unconventional" setting, rather than Tolkein style fantasy or space scifi. It could be, like someone else said, a western, or based on the mythology of ancient cultures, or set in conflict areas of today, like Afghanistan.