RHelg224

And that's wrong again. There is no backlash about that. There is a backlash about Obsidian not letting the backers play the game (earlier) as well. It's kind of befuddling to see so much backlash over the very common many-decade-old practice of giving out early review copies only to reviewers.

I'd say that "entitled" is pretty close to being a dirty word. A quote I really like is "expectations are just premeditated resentments." And it's true. You expect people/businesses/kittens/whatever to behave in the exact, specific manner you want them to and resent them when they don't. But it's unrealistic to expect people/businesses/kittens/whatever to behave exactly as you expect them to. So in effect, you are creating your own resentments. That's not to say you can never or should never expect anyone from anyone. But you need to be a bit pragmatic. And choose your battles. And try and look at things from different angles. Obsidian is clearly not trying to screw anyone over; they are clearly trying to make money. Obsidian has been kicked around for a decade. Do you think they are going to take the money, close up shop, and run for the hills? No! If they make this work it'll just be more Obsidian-made games for us fans in the future. Ultimately, they are doing what they are doing so they can continue to sustain a development cycle for future projects. It's kind of befuddling to see so much backlash over the very common many-decade-old practice of giving out early review copies.

Well Bloodborne is a videogame and not a pc game and therefor not interesting to me. Sorry but i have been pc gaming since like 1990. For me it does not qualify as a RPG. For that matter the Witcher 3 does not too, Controller recommended in a rpg? A set main character i cannot create myself ? Sorry don't see any appeal in that. But yeah its much more rpg than an action game as Bloodborne, so it should not affect pillars as its released on a very limited and inferior platform only. I feel really sorry for you that you feel that way But that is the mentality that PC gamers are known for - it's not on PC, therefore it's not worth my time. We've gotta change that, or people will think we're all a bunch of elitist douches. So you're a douche now if you don't like controller gameplay? Wow... There is nothing wrong with only playing games on PC you know. That doesn't make you a douche and it doesn't make you elitist. And for what it's worth, most console gamers are even much worse than that. They'd never play an indie game or an exclusive PC game. Just go out on the PS4 forums and ask Bloodborne fans what they think about PoE. Either they don't even know it or they think it's "old crap", at least the vast majority. So who's the douche here? "KBAM > controller" is definitely a view espoused by PC Elitism, yes. And I personally think it is an indefensible position. However, holding that opinion isn't douchey, not in and of itself. It's the way PC Elitsts argue their case as if anyone who doesn't think controllers are destroying gaming is an imbecile - THAT is douchey. Not the argument itself but the shape and tone it always, invariably takes. Yes, generally speaking, that kind of attitude is douchey. I'm not saying that describes any particular individual here but if you haven't seen that happen you haven't been around many forums or any media devoted to gaming. Speaking for myself, I prefer to play games on a PC despite owning every console. My Xbox One has a thick layer of dust on it, and I only use my PS3 and PS4 rarely. But I use an Xbox 360 controller on PC for just about any game that isn't a twitch shooter or strategic game.

The reality is, the audience for this game is not "Kickstarter backers," it's "gamers." To increase profitability, they need to get positive reviews from reviewers that Metacritic aggregates close to release to attract other purchasers outside of the backer community. I mean, my overall pledge was $330 (at the $250 level with $80 in add-ons). I did that because I wanted to support Oblivion. That was how I approached this Kickstarter. It's how I approach all Kickstarters. I mean, the allure of some of the backer rewards certainly factors in, but when I back a project it's because I want it to financially succeed. Now, I'm not saying that Obsidian would fail to be a financial success if they released the game to backers a day or two early, but I'm not upset that they haven't because I personally want them to succeed with this game and in general. Obsidian makes good games. I want them to make more. I want them to become profitable and, hopefully, self-sustaining. So I support playing the usual game that developers and publishers do leading up to release. And that means sending out early review copies. Keep in mind, doing a proper review takes a lot of time, especially for an RPG which is a huge time investment. They want reviews to either coincide or be as close to the release as possible. And they likely want to control the audience producing said reviews to those that normally review such games. Because, like it or not, Metacritic actually matters and can make or break the profitability of a game. I understand that some people feel slighted and maybe they approached this Kickstarter differently than I did, and that's fine. I'm just sharing my opinion of it: I back Obsidians actions because I want them to succeed. They aren't doing this to annoy backers, they are doing this to claw their way into a position where they can keep making games.

Well Bloodborne is a videogame and not a pc game and therefor not interesting to me. Sorry but i have been pc gaming since like 1990. For me it does not qualify as a RPG. For that matter the Witcher 3 does not too, Controller recommended in a rpg? A set main character i cannot create myself ? Sorry don't see any appeal in that. But yeah its much more rpg than an action game as Bloodborne, so it should not affect pillars as its released on a very limited and inferior platform only. I feel really sorry for you that you feel that way But that is the mentality that PC gamers are known for - it's not on PC, therefore it's not worth my time. We've gotta change that, or people will think we're all a bunch of elitist douches. I tried many console games, i had a ps2, ps3 and xbox, xbox 360 too. I just never really used them other than for some exclusives i was hyped about. The problem is that the games are not as fun as they used to be. They seem dumbed down both in content and controls and not only for consoles but for cross platform releases too. Even more so now on almost all games cause it seems to have set a standard. You know that is exactly why i backed Pillars and i did that with 290$, because there is a promise to bring back the deeper games. While i see many great stories in games now, like dragon age inquisition, it hurts me to play that game. It does not feel like a rpg or even a full game to me with out stats to assign and real skills and when i am limited to 8 skill buttons suddenly (when i had basically unlimited in the first part) i feel cheated. Yes its more easy to get into that game, but then it is shallow. Also we have been very limited in all aspects cause of the consoles, be it gameplay or graphics. Since the playstation any console hardware was at least a year behind pc hardware on release, sometimes even more and yes that also counts for the ps4 and ps3. I backed PoE with the equivalent of $370. I loved Dragon Age: Inquisition and put 160 hours into it. I think Witcher 3 and Bloodborne are RPGs, and look forward to playing them all, just as I will enjoy Pillars. We are in a time where there is a greater breadth and depth of games than there has ever been, even if some genres have fallen by the wayside - but those genres are now coming back via indie and crowdfunding initiatives. By all indications, we are in a golden age or renaissance of gaming. We have literally never had it better, and it seems to only be getting better. Perspective, it's what's for dinner. I do have over a hundred hours in inquisition too as it is not a bad game, i just can see that it could have been so much more. I love being a gamer at this time, but i so often see the chance for greatness wasted in games. And yeah i am very glad for these Kickstarter campaigns, so happy i backed Divinity Original Sin, Torment, Star Citizen and Pillars to name a few. Still in my experience all we get from cross platform and console games is worse games, not to start on mobiles games ... I am currently playing through Assassin's Creed: Rogue on the PC. It's one of the most fun experiences I've ever had with a game (I admit I'm a bit of an Assassin's Creed fanboy, but it exceeded even my expectations for the series). It is an an Xbox 360/PS3 port to the PC. It's very clearly dated. But I don't see what could have been gained by it being a PC exclusive game designed for the PC from the ground up. It's pretty much a perfect experience as-is.

What? Amazon can't delay a game release. And they didn't delay it to April 27th. They certainly did screw up preorders, though. I'm not the only one that didn't get their "guaranteed release date delivery" today. Though when I called and complained, I did get a free month of Prime. They absolutely can delay a game release. If you order it, and they don't ship it for 1 extra month, they delayed the game's release. After I contacted customer support and they said it would be shipped to me on the 27th (of April, not March), I said fsck it all to hell and cancelled the order. I'm just going to skip that game, I'd really not wait an extra month. The alternative would be to pay a scalper $140+ for a collector's edition and not wait the extra month, but I don't care about the game enough for that. I'm not saying that it isn't crappy. And I understand you are angry. I spent the last 9 hours being angry. I called Amazon three times today, and UPS once. But them screwing you over has nothing to do with the game's release. The game's release is today, even though Amazon screwed up for you. I don't know your financial situation or whatever but the game is available via other vendors starting today. Hence, it's totally, well, weird to categorize Amazon's flub as "Amazon delaying a game release." It's totally mischaracterizing what they did. And in fact, you'd be better served just calling it what it is - Amazon royally screwing up - rather than what it isn't. No, this is an endemic problem not limited to Amazon. The collector's edition has been delayed for virtually every vendor. It's not Amazon's fault at all, but if you ordered it from Amazon you definitely fall into the category of people affected by the delay. I just read up on the issue. Looks like I lucked out despite the one day's delay. I guess I shouldn't be too upset after all. Sorry you had to go through that. I still disagree on the semantics of saying Amazon "delayed the release" but I can empathize with your situation.

Well Bloodborne is a videogame and not a pc game and therefor not interesting to me. Sorry but i have been pc gaming since like 1990. For me it does not qualify as a RPG. For that matter the Witcher 3 does not too, Controller recommended in a rpg? A set main character i cannot create myself ? Sorry don't see any appeal in that. But yeah its much more rpg than an action game as Bloodborne, so it should not affect pillars as its released on a very limited and inferior platform only. I feel really sorry for you that you feel that way But that is the mentality that PC gamers are known for - it's not on PC, therefore it's not worth my time. We've gotta change that, or people will think we're all a bunch of elitist douches. I tried many console games, i had a ps2, ps3 and xbox, xbox 360 too. I just never really used them other than for some exclusives i was hyped about. The problem is that the games are not as fun as they used to be. They seem dumbed down both in content and controls and not only for consoles but for cross platform releases too. Even more so now on almost all games cause it seems to have set a standard. You know that is exactly why i backed Pillars and i did that with 290$, because there is a promise to bring back the deeper games. While i see many great stories in games now, like dragon age inquisition, it hurts me to play that game. It does not feel like a rpg or even a full game to me with out stats to assign and real skills and when i am limited to 8 skill buttons suddenly (when i had basically unlimited in the first part) i feel cheated. Yes its more easy to get into that game, but then it is shallow. Also we have been very limited in all aspects cause of the consoles, be it gameplay or graphics. Since the playstation any console hardware was at least a year behind pc hardware on release, sometimes even more and yes that also counts for the ps4 and ps3. Why is complexity inherently better? I don't really want to debate this with you or anyone (sorry, I just don't) but honestly, really sit and think about that one. I'm not saying complex games are inherently worse, either. But having played games for over 3 decades now, I don't necessarily think more options = better game. I think that's an extremely limited way of looking at games, RPGs or otherwise. A game is an experience. Everything - the UI, the gameplay, the graphics, the sound, etc. - all of those things help build that experience, nothing more. The complexity of the UI, the number of skills you can use at any given time - all of these elements are pretty much aribitrary in an objective sense. They are experience-building tools. You may be used to certain aspects and facets of these genres, sure, and it's certainly understandable for someone to lament the diminishment of a feature they are used to and they enjoy, but please recognize that's all it is. There is nothing inherently better about complexity, there is nothing inherently better about a KBAM setup, and there certainly is nothing inherently better about a PC over a console.

This. Also, do you post on PA? Your name is familiar.

What? Amazon can't delay a game release. And they didn't delay it to April 27th. They certainly did screw up preorders, though. I'm not the only one that didn't get their "guaranteed release date delivery" today. Though when I called and complained, I did get a free month of Prime. They absolutely can delay a game release. If you order it, and they don't ship it for 1 extra month, they delayed the game's release. After I contacted customer support and they said it would be shipped to me on the 27th (of April, not March), I said fsck it all to hell and cancelled the order. I'm just going to skip that game, I'd really not wait an extra month. The alternative would be to pay a scalper $140+ for a collector's edition and not wait the extra month, but I don't care about the game enough for that. I'm not saying that it isn't crappy. And I understand you are angry. I spent the last 9 hours being angry. I called Amazon three times today, and UPS once. But them screwing you over has nothing to do with the game's release. The game's release is today, even though Amazon screwed up for you. I don't know your financial situation or whatever but the game is available via other vendors starting today. Hence, it's totally, well, weird to categorize Amazon's flub as "Amazon delaying a game release." It's totally mischaracterizing what they did. And in fact, you'd be better served just calling it what it is - Amazon royally screwing up - rather than what it isn't. No, this is an endemic problem not limited to Amazon. The collector's edition has been delayed for virtually every vendor. It's not Amazon's fault at all, but if you ordered it from Amazon you definitely fall into the category of people affected by the delay. Well, no. My Collector's Edition shipped yesterday, was supposed to arrive today, and will actually arrive tomorrow. It's actually in a box that's actually sitting in a UPS warehouse about 22 miles from where I am now typing this. Maybe there were shortages? But the CE has been released as of today. edit: And the situation you describe still does not equate to "Amazon delayed the release of Bloodborne." A vendor does not control a release date. What you said here doesn't change that at all. IF the release pushed back, or there were shortages, that certainly isn't Amazon's fault, or any other vendor's fault.

Well Bloodborne is a videogame and not a pc game and therefor not interesting to me. Sorry but i have been pc gaming since like 1990. For me it does not qualify as a RPG. For that matter the Witcher 3 does not too, Controller recommended in a rpg? A set main character i cannot create myself ? Sorry don't see any appeal in that. But yeah its much more rpg than an action game as Bloodborne, so it should not affect pillars as its released on a very limited and inferior platform only. I've been gaming since 1983. My first game was Ultima III on a Atari 800XL. Both Bloodborne and Witcher 3 are RPGs. Since you like to throw years around, I've been playing RPGs (and games in general) on a PC for 7 more years than you so that gives me Supreme Authority Over RPG Terms (at least until someone that has been playing games since 1982 comes in the thread).

What? Amazon can't delay a game release. And they didn't delay it to April 27th. They certainly did screw up preorders, though. I'm not the only one that didn't get their "guaranteed release date delivery" today. Though when I called and complained, I did get a free month of Prime. They absolutely can delay a game release. If you order it, and they don't ship it for 1 extra month, they delayed the game's release. After I contacted customer support and they said it would be shipped to me on the 27th (of April, not March), I said fsck it all to hell and cancelled the order. I'm just going to skip that game, I'd really not wait an extra month. The alternative would be to pay a scalper $140+ for a collector's edition and not wait the extra month, but I don't care about the game enough for that. I'm not saying that it isn't crappy. And I understand you are angry. I spent the last 9 hours being angry. I called Amazon three times today, and UPS once. But them screwing you over has nothing to do with the game's release. The game's release is today, even though Amazon screwed up for you. I don't know your financial situation or whatever but the game is available via other vendors starting today. Hence, it's totally, well, weird to categorize Amazon's flub as "Amazon delaying a game release." It's totally mischaracterizing what they did. And in fact, you'd be better served just calling it what it is - Amazon royally screwing up - rather than what it isn't.

Obsidian never responded to all three of my Kickstarter messages but then I found the backer portal support whatever and they responded immediately. Long story short: Extra keys will get the preorder items.

What? Amazon can't delay a game release. And they didn't delay it to April 27th. They certainly did screw up preorders, though. I'm not the only one that didn't get their "guaranteed release date delivery" today. Though when I called and complained, I did get a free month of Prime.

The random animosity disguised as apathy toward Bloodborne is puzzling and hilarious.

Yeah well Amazon managed to screw up release date delivery of Bloodborne so now it's even worse. My copy didn't come today. I'm so sad.

Does anyone know if the Pillars of Eternity - Royal Edition Upgradewill still exist after the preorder period? My extra backer key is going to my father. I'm assuming they will be at the Hero level even though mine will be at the Royal level. Just want to make sure my father will be able to upgrade later if he wants.

I don't believe so, no. Also, Obsidian still has not responded to my question. I'd really like to know for sure if extra backer keys are entitled to the preorder items.

I just sent Obsidian a message via Kickstarter on what I'm trying to confirm. I'll post it here in case anyone has any insight or if anyone can link to an official answer on any of these (assuming there has been an answer on any of these):

This is a bit of a necropost I suppose but I'm still unclear on if the second key I purchased will also include the preorder items. Do you have a link to where Obsidian confirmed thise about KS backers getting the pre-order items?

Hey so quick question: I'm a $250 level backer (with a bunch of addons). One of the addons is an extra key. I see the preorder on Steam has a few different versions. Has Obsidian confirmed which version backers will get? And whether or not we will get the preorder items? Also, will the extra keys be the same "level" as the main key? Thanks.