Any good 2nd line Tall Grass Paladin or Fighter builds?

[Lampros]

I am booting the ranged Rogue from my PotD team, and I do not want a Ranger due to the extra micro. So I am adding another 2nd line pikeman in addition to my Tall Grass Chanter (I might duplicate Tall Grass). I am choosing between a Paladin and a Fighter. What do you guys would serve better? I already have one of each. And what abilities and talents for this build?

[Boeroer]

Why not a melee wizard with Concelhaut's Staff and later Citzal's Spirit Lance? Not much micro to summon a weapon. Use your spells for self buffs.

 

I once had a fighter with maximum regeneration and high MIG, CON and high INT, Tall Grass and a focus on "Take the Hit". It's pretty awesome if you mainly get damage from Take the Hit and cut your your party members' damage in half. Also good with Triggered Immunity later on I guess... It obviously works best if you combine it with defection and DR buffs for your front line so that only MIN damage gets through.

 

The only thing is that it's totally bugged when mind controlled enemies are near. So if you want to use any form of mind control then don't do it. If not then I'd recommend it. It's an improvement in sturdiness for the whole party with zero additional micro. If you feel health is a problem then you can take Wound Binding (only build where I took it).

 

Due to the higher ACC of fighters I would give the fighter Tall Grass and the chanter Durance's Staff and Llawran's Stick.

 

Another alternative is a barb.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Boeroer

[Lampros]

 

I once had a fighter with maximum regeneration and high MIG, CON and high INT, Tall Grass and a focus on "Take the Hit". It's pretty awesome if you mainly get damage from Take the Hit and half your party members' damage. The only thing is that it's totally bugged when mind controlled enemies are near. So if you want to use any form of mind control then don't do it. If not then I'd recommend it. It's an improvement in sturdiness for the whole party with zero additional micro. If you feel health is a problem then you can take Wound Binding (only build where I took it).

 

Due to the higher ACC of fighters I would give the fighter Tall Grass and the chanter Durance's Staff and Llawran's Stick.

 

I do want to use my Wizard for Confuse, and I generally have Munacra equipped on a front-liner as well.

 

But a Fighter without the Take Hit would still be formidable with Tall Grass, right? If he averages the 70 percent he did with Shatterstar, then I should see a lot of Prones. And yes, I plan on taking the Tall Grass away from the Chanter (I will use a Moon Godlike Gandalf this time anyways, so a quarterstaff is more fitting) - or duplicating Tall Grass. The only question is: Is a Fighter more optimal on the front-line with a Godansthnyr or second-line with a Tall Grass?

[Lampros]

Edit: I saw your edit on the Barbarian as an alternative. And yes, I considered him, but I think I really want two Paladins for the synergies - as well as the possibility of making one Paladin a full-blown DPS build (since he can then pass off some important defensive or support abilities/talents to the 2nd Paladin). So if I put Fighter on the Tall Grass duty, I'd put 2 Paladins on the first line. And if Fighter remains on the first line, then one of the the Paladins goes with the Tall Grass.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Lampros

[Boeroer]

Fighter with Take the Hit on the front line is not optimal because he will get damaged by Take the Hit AND the enemy which will lead to massive health loss.

In the second one row however he can heal the damage from Take the Hit and dish out nice reach weapon damage and single target CC with Knockdown and Overbearing. The synergies between healing, Take the Hit and things like Zealous Endurance and thick armor on the front line is great. Chanter's first level phrase that lowers slash and pierce damage is also good with this. Later the 30pt damage shield is even better. Party will get very little damage. But the fighter should not get pummeled too often. And also mind controlling enemies breaks this idea so hard: Take the Hit will apply to charmed enemies and won't go away after charm runs out. So you will kill your fighter when you kill that once-charmed enemy. Or you have to move the fighter out of range or turn off Take the Hit all he time. Very annoying.

 

Without Take the Hit a fighter with a pike is pretty straightforward I think. And in the front line I would give him dual weapons.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Boeroer

[Lampros]

Fighter with Take the Hit on the front line is not optimal because he will get damaged by Take the Hit AND the enemy which will lead to massive health loss.

In the second one row however he can heal the damage from Take the Hit and dish out nice reach weapon damage and single target CC with Knockdown and Overbearing. The synergies between healing, Take the Hit and things like Zealous Endurance and thick armor on the front line is great. Chanter's first level phrase that lowers slash and pierce damage is also good with this. Later the 30pt damage shield is even better. Party will get very little damage. But the fighter should not get pummeled too often. And also mind controlling enemies breaks this idea so hard: Take the Hit will apply to charmed enemies and won't go away after charm runs out. So you will kill your fighter when you kill that once-charmed enemy. Or you have to move the fighter out of range or turn off Take the Hit all he time. Very annoying.

 

Without Take the Hit a fighter with a pike is pretty straightforward I think. And in the front line I would give him dual weapons.

 

Got it. But since I use Charm, Confuse, Dominate a lot, I am afraid it will activate when CC-ed enemies get hit.

 

If I were to use only 1 Fighter though, where would you place him? Front-line with dual wield Godansthunyr and Shatterstar/Strike Hard or mid-line with Tall Grass? Assume you will also have 2 Paladins (1 will be front-line and the other's placement will depend on where the Fighter goes).

 

I guess to put it easier: I want 2 front-line melees and 2 mid-line melees. 4 characters, 2 Paladins, a Chanter, and a Fighter. Chanter definitely goes mid-line. Where are the other 3 going?

[Boeroer]

Yeah, forget it then. It's really good - but so is mind control. Don't bother with Take the Hit then.

 

But wait... didn't you install MaxQuests mod? I believe he fixed that bug with Take the Hit + Mind Control (controlled enemies don't profit from Take the Hit at all). You might want to ask him that.

 

Pew... where to out the fighter? Don't know to be honest. Doesn't matter that much if the fighter has the reach weapon or the paladin. Maybe the paladin is ok in the second row because his zealous aura can reach everyone better? On the other hand the fighter can land more crits with Tall Grass. But then Charge with two weapons is cooler. Also dual wielding Shatterstar + another hammer leads to +1 engagement slot so maybe Overbeasring Guard is nice if you also take Defender. I honestly don't know. I'd say put the paladin in the second row. He will do some crits with Sworn Enemy + Zealous Focus + FoD and Tall Grass.

[Lampros]

Yeah, forget it then. It's really good - but so is mind control. Don't bother with Take the Hit then.

 

But wait... didn't you install MaxQuests mod? I believe he fixed that bug with Take the Hit + Mind Control (controlled enemies don't profit from Take the Hit at all). You might want to ask him that.

 

Pew... where to out the fighter? Don't know to be honest. Doesn't matter that much if the fighter has the reach weapon or the paladin. Maybe the paladin is ok in the second row because his zealous aura can reach everyone better? On the other hand the fighter can land more crits with Tall Grass. But then Charge with two weapons is cooler. Also dual wielding Shatterstar + another hammer leads to +1 engagement slot so maybe Overbeasring Guard is nice if you also take Defender. I honestly don't know. I'd say put the paladin in the second row. He will do some crits with Sworn Enemy + Zealous Focus + FoD and Tall Grass.

 

Yup. I do have MaxQuest's mod. But my games seem to have some bugs, so I am not sure how things will interact.

 

I tried Overbearing Guard with Shatterstar (but not Defender), and it was surprisingly effective. So I may get Defender as well, if I put the Fighter on the front row. At what level does Charge become available? I did not see it up to level 10, and I'd like to try, since a lot of people sing its praises. So I guess Paladin goes the second row. I will give him a bit more Perception than usual to get more crits. And I have the freedom to take offensive abilities/talents earlier, since I will have 2 Paladins (so I can get forgo Lay on Hands on one of them, for instance).

 

P.S. The AI mode does not activate Sworn Enemy at "Aggressive" - even though it claims it does (but it does activate FoD - which sort of makes it even worse). I wish MaxQuest fixes this!

[Boeroer]

Unfortunately Charge is a lvl 13 ability.

 

Defender gives you +2 engagement slots and -5 deflection and prevents you from using Savage Attack(!). So think twice. An alternative would be Hold the Line. With Shatterstar + Hold the Line + the normal engagement slot you would have 3 slots which maybe enough. If you like 4 with Defender that's also ok - you just have to skip Savage Attack. Maybe that's ok if you want to have a max crit build.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Boeroer

[Lampros]

Unfortunately Charge is a lvl 13 ability.

 

Defender gives you +2 engagement slots and -5 deflection and prevents you from using Savage Attack(!). So think twice. An alternative would be Hold the Line. With Shatterstar + Hold the Line + the normal engagement slot you would have 3 slots which maybe enough. If you like 4 with Defender that's also ok - you just have to skip Savage Attack. Maybe that's ok if you want to have a max crit build.

 

Ah, ok. I will take Hold the Line instead. 3 engagements should be sufficient on a Fighter when I have 2 other Paladins. Damn, I am so excited to try this team now...