The lack of class complexity in avowed

[Darab Masood]

I have been a massive fan of the pillar series. You could say its my special interest. I have played both games hundreds of time. In each case what made them so playable was that the game was a canvas and the brush were the classes. Druid, rogue, fighter, paladin, monk, ranger, barbarian, priest, cipher, chanter, wizard. There were unlimited ways to customise your experience. And deadfire took that and doubled it through multiclasses, but limited the world. I accepted that. But now this avowed has taken away all that for flashy graphics. I don't want to see the graphics, I want real skill complexity. I dont want to mindlessly button mash for the next 75 hours. 

[Wormerine]

That Avowed doesn't play like PoEs is not an issue in itself, at least not in my opinion. I see little value in a class system in a game where we play and control a single character. Going classless was a good approach IMO, though I must say I am dissatisfied with Avowed skilltrees.

Couple things that stood out to me:

Progression is gear based. I found that your skill tree choices are mostly irrelevant. You can unlock some spells, unlock extra features but while those makes combat from player side a bit more interesting it doesn't really shape the character build. The only thing that really matters is what weapon player uses and if the weapon is upgraded enough. Late in my playthrough I switched to a bow and I had no perks invested into that skill tree - and I was doing just fine. Sure, I could get perks that would allow me to do even more damage, or make aiming easier - but personally, I felt no need for either. Well timed powershots would barely drain stamina - they would stagger enemies meaning no one could get close. And as weapon was upgraded well enough, enemy HP melted in couple of shots, buff or no buff. Investing in bow perk tree wouldn't alter playstyle, or make it unique. It would just make already available and viable fighting style even more effective.

Now, I don't think it is entirely unintentional. It reminds me somewhat of Skyrim - there my impression was that I start being able to do everything, and as I level up my character gets less competent in doing things I don't specialize in. I personally hated it, as it felt like regressions, rather than progression. Now that is not how I felt in Avowed (with progression being mostly driven by gear, you are the most effective if you use the most upgraded weapon), but I also felt little progression in A. It felt like I was upgrading to keep the status quo, not to develop my character in a unique direction, which is what I am looking for in an RPG.

Still, with how Avowed is designed, I find it odd that skill points are limited. Cheap and easy to do skill reset already makes any build choices temporary at best, but with how mostly irrelevant skill trees are, I am not sure what's the point of limited skill points are. With how little we can define out character, it seems a more action approach would make more sense - have skill trees be just thing we fill over the playthrough, so switching between weapons is more seamless

But coming back to class concept - when I was playing I was thinking that different resource system, could work well with the combat system in Avowed. Monk getting Wounds to spend when he gets hit - or cipher that builds up mana through damage physical damage (there is late game armor that somewhat replicates it. and by somewhat I mean it is so broken, that spells cast return more mana than you spend on them). There is potential there, but I am not sure how well suited the system is for a single player "RPG".

My memory if fuzzy as it's been ages since I played it, but I have far fonder memories of Arcane's Messiah of Might & Magic. There skill trees were similarly divided into three trees (Melee, archery, magic), and from what I remember those skill trees had far more transformative effect on a playthrough.

For my taste, Avowed makes player character far too competent from a get go, leaving little space to meaningfully grow throughout the playthrough.

Edited March 18 by Wormerine