mutonizer
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Posts posted by mutonizer
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Not to mention even in fullplate and with Arcane Veil up the Wizard still dies extremely quickly to a single enemy due to low health pool.
Mainly it's because of very, very low DEF, which mean they get hit/critted all the frikkin time.
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I can only say that the early access forums for Might and Magic X were much harsher and more negative than anything I've seen here. And yet when that
game was released it got very good reviews (considering its very low budget) and the tone on the forums completely turned around. In my opinion it turned out very well. Many of the negative Early Access players were still vocal critics, but their voices were suddenly drown out by the vast number of players playing the finished product and enjoying it. The number of people who Beta test the game will be very small in comparison to those who play the finished game, and the finished game will determine its success or failure.
Not on topic but what exactly are you smoking, because I want some
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PART 3: Why the hell is it even in the game?
Below is a video showing most "routes" you can take in the current v278 backers beta on Normal difficulty, and trying to use Scouting/Stealth as best as possible. It's a big long but should demonstrate the issues at hand.
An editor was used to give the main actor 10 stealth, and all other actors 0 stealth. This is the best ratio you can get for 1 character, meaning this will make his own scouting detection radius the smallest possible (see above). What this also means is that in a normal game, it'll be way, way worse than this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RVjWWBiEzo
The only conclusions I can give right now, knowing this is beta, is this:
- Why the hell is there even a scouting mechanic in the game? What is the purpose of it if any?
- What is the point of the Stealth skill? Is there any point whatsoever apart from specific cut-scenes requiring you to have a certain value in it?
- Who comes up with this stuff? What's the logic behind it all? (Alright this isn't a conclusion but really..I mean..come on!)
All solutions I could offer would require massive game design alterations so all I can really do is report what's obviously a totally flawed and irrational game mechanic, and hope someone over there will find a way to make the whole thing function with the time you got left. Left as it is, you'll get nailed to the wall for this I think...
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I like how evil characters in D&D know that they're evil.
"Be it known to all those of evil intent, that a bounty has been placed upon the head of CHARNAME, the foster child of Gorion."
It's pretty funny.
Because it's a fact of life in such fantasy settings, not a matter of perception. Cosmic forces actually make written rules about what is evil, what is good, it's a fact, material, not a a culture based opinion, etc. That's why you can detect it via spells.
Again, don't get me wrong, I don't really like this kind of manichean view and like settings where it's more gritty and things are not as clear cut as this and I also really like the concept of reputations. But not when it's just slapping a cheap "reputation" meter and calling it job done. Fallout karma system was just as silly and aggravating really.
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As a note to PART 1
Just tested editing Stealth skills to 10 for all party members...
This is the result:
Now compare with all at 0 stealth, except one guy at 10:
Means with the current mechanic, you...I don't even know wtf that means with the current mechanic!
Can't make a maxed out Stealth team though, that's for sure
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PART II: Secret Reveal mechanics
Video as usual to demonstrate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ip8sY2750n4
From this, we can see that:
1) Perception doesn't matter
2) Stealth skill doesn't matter (not shown but I tested with 0 stealth and 10 mechanic)
3) Mechanic below a threshold fails all the time (similar to dialog/cutscenes I'm guessing)
4) Mechanic above a threshold determines your detection range which is, again, automatic and instant.
Obvious conclusion are:
1) Why the hell is scouting mode required to detect secrets if the mechanic skill is the one used?
2) You will NEVER find secrets if not in scouting mode. You will ALWAYS find secrets you should find in scouting mode. This mechanic punishes you if you don't always use scouting (you'll never ever find secrets) AND punishes you if you're always in scouting mode (you move at a crawl pace).
3) If you spend even one point in Mechanic, you will want to go full spec into it or risk making it totally worthless and missing out.
Once again, I'll let everyone make up their own mind on this, it's just to crazy a mechanic for me to even try to rationalize.
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You gotta grow a thick skin and perspective if you beta anything you care about, or if as a game company, allow outside parties to beta your product.
If you can't, you need to stay well away from all that
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"AppData" is meant to used to store data that are not pertinent for the user to ever see or access manually. for example, Google Chrome uses it to store all it's cache and whatnot and that's perfectly fine, Users never really need to access this. He can, sure, but it's not meant to be accessed manually.
"My Documents", especially "My Games" or even "My Saves", is meant to store data relevant to games, which can be pertinent for the user to access. This usually includes Mods, Saves, Option files, Custom content and the like.
As an example, PoE uses a "Current Game" data storage located in AppData. This seems to only store temporary information during a given session. That's fine, users have no need to access this at any point.
It however also stores Saves in the same location. That's not fine. Users often copy, backup, trade, upload, download, modify saves. They should NOT be asked to go into a hidden folder that should under regular circumstances never be accessed anyway.
And finally it also stores options in the registry, which is also not fine since, again, users should NEVER have to go in the registry manually and options are among the many things that many users edit out of game menus, mainly to try and solve graphical issues (ie: picking a resolution that crashes the game so you cannot even access said menu and need to change it manually).
Finally, storing all dynamically generated information (saves, options, etc) in the same, easy to access folders of My Documents, means it's very easy for users to keep track of what is where and manage it. That's how windows folder system is structured.
Look, as I said, it's not a big deal but it IS bad practice and is totally uncalled for (and when you try to keep your computer clean for years is really annoying). Everything should be stored properly in a My Document folder, as Windows intended. If they can spare the time: great. If they can't, well, too bad.
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...er..I mean, the mechanics are very simple, and they don't need any analysis at all, do they... What's interesting is what the writers do with it throughout the game.
Even if it seems pretty obvious, even from the little we see in the beta, that they're not treating this as a Bioware "reputation" stat. That you walk up to a character and they say: "Hi, mr [reputation alignment] guy!". Or that you get a "Only you can save the world" prompt every now and again.
Instead, the "reputation" is an internal tally that shows the tendency of the character you're roleplaying as. And when you gain enough points, the character feels confident enough to attempt more audacious lies, or string together more complex reasoning, use threats more effectively, etc. Without that really guaranteeing success, more than just giving you an option to choose a different path, or to figure out more about the characters in the quest, and so on.
And the dialogue really does read completely different depending on what sort of character you are. The flow between a might-build and a perception/intelligence build is well written as well. ..I'm liking the entire approach. Set your character abilities and the direction of it early. Then find your alignment and focus later. Makes a lot of sense.
Errr...what? No, it has nothing to do with your PC, but with NPCs you face. Otherwise they'd call if Behavior or something and actually use it that way in game.
at 23m27s
edit:
Though Mr Sawyer does seem to think that personality = reputation and how others perceive you...
..That's...that's...I don't what to say to that
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This will most likely be in multiple parts so I'll reply here as I add more.
PART I: Stealth mechanics
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZpbNUPS0KM
From this, it seems that Stealth effectiveness is not based on an actual value, but a ratio involving factors based on other characters in a given party.
I'm out of words to even start describing how screwed up this mechanic is. It's so irrational that I cannot force my mind to try and find any logic to it. Look at the video, make up your own mind, find your own excuses and reasons....
Edit: better quality video.
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[DESCRIPTION]
Giving attack commands using Reach weapons forces the Actors to go in base to base contact and ignore Reach potential of weapon.[DETAILED]
- Equip a Reach weapon
- Stand away from target (outside Reach) and give Attack command
- Actor will move to Base to Base contact with target, ignoring Reach
[NOTES]
n/a
[FILES]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KScyecwb8J8-
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Sorry but you're thinking about this as if there was a complex and well fleshed out system behind it....
There is not, at least the way I understand it.
You press "clever" in any dialog, you get +1 "clever" point. That's it.
You could be at the bottom of the deepest cave talking to an Ogre, or at a royal castle talking to a king, that's all you get: +1.
The downside?
You no longer choose answers based on what you want your character to answer, but based on the reputation gain/loss because you don't want to **** things up and make "clever" get ahead of "aggressive" or something. Dialog stop being about words and meaning, they are now about + and -. Then it becomes frustrating because that's not exactly what you want to say, and you realize that all context is removed, but if you don't balance out your reputation points, that'll affect things later down the line...
As I said, it's a good concept, logical one. Just flawed mechanic, completely artificial, cheaply implemented.
people will take notice and you will develop a certain kind of reputation.
People? What people? Who? where? Can I murder them all to kill witnesses? Can I disguise myself or use a fake name? Who are these people? Where are they when I talk to a damn ogre at the bottom of a spider infested cave?
No one but yourself is forcing you to meta-game. You can also disable the tags that show reputation modifiers.
Burying your head in the sand to not see something, doesn't make it go away
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How has reputation no link to the respective character? It is built based on the character's actions, and if the character's actions aren't linked to whoever that character is supposed to be, then I don't know what would be.
Because it's not something that defines him by himself, but how others perceive him, while providing no explanation whatsoever as to how they actually know about it. I don't mind the concept as a whole as it can indeed lead to some really interesting stuff RP/story wise, but when you start structuring it with neat little boxes, points, meters and probably steam achievements, all of them available for the player to see, then I think it's flawed, cheap and out of the players hand.
Will there be ways for us to prevent reputation from spreading? No.
Will it track all the subtleties of our various actions? No.
Will I find myself in situations where I ignore what I want my char to say but instead focus on the fact that he has equal reputation values, pushing me to choose one answer over the other, not for the story, but for fear of that reputation taking the lead? Most likely.
Therefore, to me, it has no link with my character or myself whatsoever and it's just a cheap way for the designer to have HIS way. It's the same bull**** as Karma, same cheap mechanic.
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Just to chime quickly here.
Alignment is indeed what the character is, at his core. This is usually a result of education, life experience, beliefs, etc. It also reflects, especially in a world where you got actual gods writing down laws about good, evil, law and chaos, and spells to detect them, how you are aligned on that front. Rigidly or loosely, when you create a character (not just the stats, but the entire character concept), you automatically (even if unknowingly, even if you HATE the concept of the alignment system) shift toward one of the axes. YOU choose this, this is the role YOU want your character to play, then you suck it up whatever the consequences.
Reputation has no link whatsoever with your character and instead, shift the focus on everyone else. As was explained in some interview or something, some people will react to say a "Kind" reputation differently than others, even though you didn't do anything kind to them, nor wanted to be kind with them. How does the guy you've been ultra brutal toward since you met him knows you chose to be kind so far? No idea. Why should your attitude toward 30 other people completely unrelated to that one dude affect how he'll react to you? No idea.
Overall, reputation the way it seems to be heading so far is (another) flawed concept to me that tries to fix something that didn't need fixing in the first place. That said, since we don't really have a chance to see it at work yet, we'll see how that goes in practice I suppose.
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+1
Even now during beta, I have to keep a text file with timestamps for each save and what they mean so that I can properly test stuff, load, test again, come back to it later on.
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According to you, a stat that has been a core stat for almost all cRPGs in the last decade and a half (since I remember), doesn't have a representation in this game, meaning it doesn't exist.
Welcome to 2014 game design 101: "There is indeed no spoon anymore. Spoons sucked and were totally unbalanced vs meat so some people could really mess up if they didn't know about it! But here, use a Knspork instead, no bad build with that baby!!"
As a note, I think I failed to make some of my sarcasm transpire previously, so hopefully this reply will correct the matter.
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Yeah in AD&D melee fighters always hit. Its one of those weird decisions where you ask yourself why? But well it was one of the first systems ever made.
Because most people HATE missing and feel "empowered" (or more involved/active/etc) when they hit something, even if they need to hit it 10000000 times to kill it.
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so strength showing how strong someone is AND how good he is at hitting things was better?
It's more logical, and remember, AC in D&D is not always hitting something, but penetrating the armor as well, which fits strength to some degree.
Plus you could go DEX and instead really on precision/finesse striking (which actually is hitting with precision, not penetrating the armor).
Once you accept that there are no actual physical Strength factor whatsoever in PoE and it's about Souls, it's all good.
Of course, all good means you're ready to accept that a spiderling soul is potentially more powerful than you, the "watcher" and main character. And then you're really ****ed because you start to realize that the bigger mobs are, the bigger their Might attribute is, which turns the entire logic around, making it totally meaningless.
But hey, who cares right
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While I agree with you "overall", I've actually turned to see things differently now, let me explain.
- The game considers that all individuals of all races are of about the same physical strength, with very little variants. Therefore, actual physical strength is ignored in all matter of things, but the Athletic skills
- Might is a misnomer and it should instead be called "Soul Strength". According to lore (afaik), each soul can vary in strength and with it, bring almost supernatural powers not only physically, but also magically (since souls are the source of all magic, afaik).
If you view it this way, with Might (Soul Strength) being only the "supernatural" part of any given potency, either physical or magical, then it makes more sense. All in all, even a 18 Might wizard is NOT a buffy muscle wizard, his soul is just very strong, allowing him to perform supernatural feats of strength (even if he's a weakling in appearance) and magic.
Likewise, a 3 Might barbarian is not a small weakling but instead could be a massive 2m tall guy, but his soul is very weak, therefore he cannot perform much supernatural feats, just the average norm.
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Never mind double-clicking, if I'm selecting a party member I want to use them. Centre the camera with single-click.
I disagree.
1) Many times you might just want to select an off-screen character to move him into view from afar
2) One tap to select, Double tap to zoom too is a more commonly used method
While I mentioned "double tapping HOTKEY", I agree that double clicking should have the same effect. However, single clicking (or hotkey press) should, I believe, only select, not zoom to.
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Lion (lvl 5) with no HP whatsoever. Same issue as wolves
Note: Elder Lions and Elder Wolves have no Cyclopedia entries for some reason.
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Archangel: Durability? Let me tell you about durability.
Think my brain just exploded reading that post from Mr. Sawyer. Excuse me while I go try collect the pieces...geeebus!
edit: That said, that explains a LOT about the entire game design. So many things I just couldn't understand, crazy sillyness both big and small everywhere that didn't make any sense....well, I got my explanation now. Wow, that post really blew my mind...
[..]Because certain fundamental skills (like Stealth) can clearly benefit from multiple party members taking them and can contribute to party effectiveness in combat.
Where did that go? Are skills used somewhere in combat? Must have missed something...
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Will keep updating this one thread as I go along.
Most of this is on Hard difficulty and based on lore based collected Cyclopedia information.
NOTE: There are no DT information anywhere that I could see in there. I have no idea why since it's kind of THE one stat that you'd want to check before a fight...
Widowmaker (lvl 6) with less than 1/2 HP compared to Widowmaker Spiderling (lvl4)
Wolf (lvl 5) with no HP whatsoever
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Probably been reported somewhere but searching didn't show any relevant result so I'll post just in case.
Playing on Hard with the same party for a while, I now find myself with no Camping Supplies and a tavern merchant not offering any anymore.
- I tried resting at the inn for about a week, see if his inventory would refresh: no dice
- Tried zoning out, going to other area, come back: no dice
Now I have no supplies left and none anywhere to be found. Means every time I need a rest, I need to hike all the way back to the inn....
I'm guessing it's just a matter of always allowing merchants to refresh their camping supplies inventory..or something. If not, well, I don't really find 3-5 loading screens and zooming through empty areas just to click on the "rent room" button at the local tavern that interesting, game-play wise
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Was the backer beta a good idea?
in Backer Beta Discussion
Posted · Edited by mutonizer
Well I agree that any team considering beta testers as anything but free disposable QA testers is going at it the wrong way, but just like with QA testers, if some of them come back to you with constructive, detailed feedback on some issues, ignoring them because they are are not your "release target demographic" is a mistake.
+10000.