Zone Jiujitsu

I disagree, but whatever. I’ve stopped responding because we are clearly at an impasse. Thank you for your thoughtful responses.

But Troub also benefits from Sasha's and Blightheart. So we are limited to one invocation, a high level invocation at that. Meanwhile, with troub you can swap and refresh skellies fast, clear debuffs, grants shields, etc. I feel like I am talking to a wall here, EVERYONE suggests troub. Why? Thank you for this, in some instances a troub can pick different summons to match the situation, or different chants at long lingers, etc. If he needs to cast two fingers he can swap to that, or he can swap to pumping out bodies, and it goes on. I mean there are some good points in here but the overall thing being said is that troub just offers way too much. Most things that are told the bellower can do - the troub can do as well with more versatility. Sure there is a time that chanting stops, but this is offset with switching chants to the chants that dont need linger, then swapping to the ones that do then letting an invocation off.

Even with a monk giving them +10 they don't "spam". They can cast 1 summon spell and then maybe cast a single damage invocation. I mean realistically, the PL bonus gives them what 3 accuracy, and some slight time buffs? Compare that to a troubador who is not only letting invocations go, at a faster rate - but is also shifting/changing chants (at a greater range too) to be effective at all time of the battle. I don't think that is discussed enough, the troub is chants and invocations, while the other classes are mainly using just invocations and a stuck with the vanilla chants. No other class can brisk recitation to get 10 pt shields, immunity to mind/constitution attacks, or extend their lash to be able to have two out at level 1. Yes, you can do it if you reach about 27 in INT but that requires items, and guess what the troub can do it too is getting better benefits out of it as well!

The chants are different than the invocations, even then the class just doesnt compare to Troub which blows it out of the water and gives way more than what is described.

Hello all, I would like to respectfully advocate for better mechanics on the Bellower. I know it may be outlandish, considering how the bellower is considered the best summoner and all - in my opinion this does not compare to how robust the Troub package is. Yes there is a nerf, but even with the nerf - the troub package permeates it's malignant influence so that I lose sleep at night over it. From another post of mine: Does anyone not feel with a shorter chant radius, Bellowers doesn't get the big impact that Troub has? I say all this respectfully of course.

Can I just say, that compared to a Troub, the bellower is just outclassed in almost every way? I am playing with he BPM and I hate how I am always longing the Troub even with the nerf it got. Since the Bellower plays with PL - and when his shouts are supposed to be stronger - can he get a buff to the PL of his chants? So they are stronger - etc? At least while he has stacked invocation/phrases or something. Or allow him to access certain phrases earlier? I just hate how powerful troub is - and how he is the defining experience of a chanter. All of the above does not compare to rushing out skellies with many lives, semi immunity to afflictions, fast rebuff on the temp hit point shield, the versatility of pushing out different chants, better chant range, better linger if you choose it. Troub just blows it out of the water with barely any drawbacks. WHY DID YOU MAKE TROUB OBSIDIAN??!! (Or why not make Bellower better?)

Sorry everyone, it was a steam mod.

I only ever used the CP and the BPM. Maybe I did something and never realized it.

While playing my Psion/Bellower - I've come across a pretty awesome item. "Tales to enthrall and delight". A trinket for a Chanter that let them cast some priest and druid spells. Has anyone come across these? I only have the CP and BPM installed.

Holy crap - man why did I never put this together. For the spells/invocations to hit - you increase accuracy. So Cipher, and Monk have ways to increase the chance of hitting. I thought it only effected weapons. Just wow. Never knew this. I've been in a form of paralysis trying to make Bellower work, Troubador really is the best. Just increase the accuracy via Cipher or Monks Dance - then done you will hit with the spell more. WOW.

Another question related to invocations and accuracy. I would argue that buffing you accuracy/having a class with innate accuracy bonus is better than having power levels right? In regards to hitting. If I pull off Cipher's +20 accuracy ability - that will make my invocations even more likely to hit??!! So in the end Troubador Cipher is really solid - as the invocations will hit more because of the accuracy buffs provided by Cipher. Right/wrong??

@thelee would you mix Bellower with Psion? Having a tough time choosing a bellower multi.

Repeat post? Sorry.

For the chanter (my favorite class ) it says that the bonus for Great Soul is 15% phrase duration, not 20%. Just a typo right?

This works with the community patch and I am very happy and grateful for this awesome community.